Trump thread #109 Election Part 3 and off he goes with a trumpety trump?

[freddosfrogs]

We can but hope!

What will happen in AZ, PA and GA next?

[Title edited by MNHQ at OP's request]

And all that showy business about not taking his salary but putting it back into the community - what about the amount of government money he spent golfing at his own clubs, whilst not working, thus putting money into his own pocket? That and his measly $750 paid in taxes. And the rest. FFS. He's as corrupt as they come. But you already knew that.

@occa that's extremely interesting and useful, thank you, and not at all long to make your point. We really need imho to understand why people vote the way they do - how else to work towards change? I speak globally, as a Brit not and American.

More lawsuits being filed. Who pays for these legal fees?

Pennsylvania. Asking SC to intervene. Disenfranching GOP poll watchers
Michigan. Asking all counting to stop.
Nevada. Challenging the process. Sueing the County Clerk
Georgia. Challenging a pile of ballots being tabulated (small number)

@occa thank you.

At home we discussed this issue yesterday, one line of thought was the (current) right tends to have short sharp easy access rhetoric whereas the left is a bit more detailed and inclusive.

It takes time, patience and education to ‘think’ about what the left is saying.

For the U.K, the working men’s clubs and unions of old seemed to be more hands on with exploring policy/ideas with folk, WC people were more likely to be clever even if they didn’t have more formal education.

I see this in my own working class family where the older people have full critical thinking and knowledge. The younger folk (boomers) are a bit more slogan-y and accept what they read as fact.

Philly votes still to come in.

Biden camp getting increasingly confident.

I think we should have a good idea on Pennsylviania later today.

@occa that's really interesting. I'm a long-standing listener to the Pod Save America podcast (four former Obama staffers who have formed a political media company and do a lot of work now in mobilising the Dem vote). I find a lot of their insight really helpful but have had a sneaking suspicion that they (and large swathes of the Democrat party) completely misjudged the priorities of the electorate at large, which seems to have been born out in the results. Most people don't have lofty concerns about structural inequalities. I'm not sure many Americans are really that bothered about Covid, especially, as @anon444877 says, in lower population density areas. People care about what's in their pocket. Under Trump the US economy has done well and the stock market has boomed - largely because of Obama, but people are easily convinced that it's because of Trump's 'genius' in business. I also think people are sick of 'endless wars' in the Middle East. Trump has been vocal about pulling out troops and has no interest in playing World Police.

However, I think another factor is that the Republicans have done a great job of setting up the levers of power in their advantage. The way they've packed the courts and gerrymandered districts is going to make it very difficult for the Deomcrats to ever make real headway again. If they couldn't get the Senate this time around then I don't see what hope there will be next time. Especially with Joe Biden as a lame duck President, unable to get any meaningful legislation through. That will further perpetuate the image of the Democrats as useless and ineffective. I don't see the way back, and it worries me for the integrity of democracy in the US and by extension the rest of the world.

To add to my point re sharp slogans:

Blair: things can (will?) get better
Obama: yes we can.
Trump: MAGA
J’son: Get Brexit done

Corbyn, Biden, May et al don’t seem to have easily reachable statements. That I remember anyway.

I am keeping my fingers crossed for Pennysylviania.

Very good explanation Occa. Thanks.

@Phoenix21
For the many, not the few.

Is the senate back in play again with the Georgia re-runs in January? If so that could be really hopeful.

@occa

I had a long conversation with a friend yesterday about the level of support for Trump. Friend works in California in industry where he reckoned 95% of the people he works with were Trump voters.

He had a few points:

For most blue-collar workers, Washington DC may as well be a million miles away. They can't relate in the slightest to either candidate. Virtually none of them went to University, and they think ((and refer to themselves) as not very bright.

Generally, they're proud of being blue collar, and a vote for the Democrats would almost be seen as being a 'class traitor', trying to be something you're not, thinking you're better/smarter than the people you work with. Voting Republican is seen as standing in solidarity with your fellow workers.

This is because 99% of these people do not care one tiny little bit about Trump's character or lies or dodgy dealings. They are the absolute epitome of single issue voters. They care about the economy. That's IT. As they said, 'it's not like they're going to be inviting Trump for dinner'. They do not care what he's like, they don't think any politicians are even slightly interested in them or their views.

Most of Trump's more egregious personal/political decisions don't affect them personally. At least not nearly as much as the day-to-day grind that keeps food on the table. A lot of them are the only earner in their family, so it all falls to them. Covid has made them more, not less likely to vote Republican because they are more worried about their jobs/the economy. The ONLY thing they care about is low taxes and a thriving economy. Remember, there is very, very little in the way of a social safety net in the US. If the economy tanks and you lose you job, nobody will bail you out. You lose your health insurance and quite possibly your house.

So the irony is, they vote Republican, the party of big business who've over the years stripped most worker's rights etc., because they think they're the party who'll keep the economy going and keep them in work. So they will never get the rights they deserve because they're too scared to vote in a candidate who might fight for those rights in case the economy is collateral damage, because of it is they're fucked because they have no rights. So round we go.

It's a neat little trap that allows big business to exploit workers without them even realizing it and keeps blue collar people voting Republican.

I don't really disagree with this, but I'd point out two things:

1. The Democratic Party used to be the working class party. Which raised the question, how did that flip? The Democrats still claim that they would best take care of the interests of the workers, but if that were true, how did they end up losing them?

2. Probably the answer to #1, the Democrats have become as much the party of the elite, of the banks, of big business, as the Republicans have, and they have themselves bene party to destroying the social safety net.

So this idea that the working class voters are trapping themselves voting Republican I would say needs a little examination. The reality seems to me they are screwed either way, and their best bet, strategically, would be to be mercenary about their votes, with no loyalty to either party but only trying to hold each to account for certain policies. From that perspective turning from Obama, the union-breaker, to Trump, who talked about protecting industry and movement of capital and labour (traditionally leftist govrnemnts talk about these) makes a lot of sense.

Getting a bit tight in Georgia!

Placemarking as I’ve found these threads so helpful. Thanks all

Labour flipped to being middle class - democrats did the same.

Its to do with leadership and where they come from and an attitude of looking down on others as being inferior - stuff like saying people are backwards, stupid etc. Even if people know they are they don't like being called it by people who think are superior.

This is why the pomo-bollocks of identity politics is particularly alienating...

@TokyoSushi

Getting a bit tight in Georgia!

You can hear the Trump campaign channelling Ghostbusters shouting "Don't cross the streams!!!"

Toothbrush HQ thinks it will...

3ormorecharacters your last para was a depressing, but I fear, true look to the future
V interesting post

Me neither... will it come to pass?

McConnell can’t breathe easy. Perdue is at 50.0% and will likely fall below as last GA absentees come in. That would mean all eyes on GA for next 2 months. The TWO runoffs in Jan. will determine control of Senate. With casual Trump voter uninterested, watch Stacey Abrams’ org.
twitter.com/jonathanalter/status/1324344318593814528?s=21

@Goosefoot I think in terms of 1) there's been a very similar phenomenon here, with working class voters drifting to the Tories. I think it's largely to do with the rise of Populism which has taken over traditionally conservative politics. A lot of working class people feel forgotten about and ignored, and Populism stokes this by giving easy answers (£350m a week for the NHS!) and convenient scapegoats (all those immigrants coming over here and stealing your jobs!). It's a great con trick really that's been played on these people, to get them to vote against their own interests. I'm sure Russia has had quite a bit to do with it behind the scenes, particularly in terms of amplifying things on social media.

Trump to make an annoucement in Las Vegas with Matt Schlapp.

Matt Schlapp was a senior figure in the Brooks Brothers Riot in Miami Dade in 2000.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks_Brothers_riot

The Brooks Brothers riot was a demonstration at a meeting of election canvassers in Miami-Dade County, Florida, on November 22, 2000, during a recount of votes made during the 2000 United States presidential election, with the goal of shutting down the recount.

^After demonstrations and acts of violence, local officials shut down the recount early.

Many of the demonstrators were paid Republican operatives. According to investigative reporter Greg Palast, author of The Best Democracy Money Can Buy in 2002, Roger Stone organized the demonstration, and Matt Schlapp was the on-site leader. Republican New York Representative John E. Sweeney gave the signal that started the riot, telling an aide to "Shut it down."

We are now looking at bordering on a potential coup-de-tat if this kicks off.

We already know that we are seeing armed people outside counting centres in neighbouring Arizona.

This is where the danger starts.

I trust Amy.

In Pennsylvania- watch today for Philadelphia and Delaware County, the suburb to be counted. Not sure why the early votes didn’t seem to come in from there yesterday, but both have votes outstanding to send it to Biden, esp Philly. Will not be close when counting done.
twitter.com/amy_siskind/status/1324343025674440704?s=21

I dread to think on this..
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Andrew Feinberg
@AndrewFeinberg
@TeamTrump
will make a “major announcement” in Las Vegas this morning, headlined by 2000 Brooks Brothers Riot participant ⁦
@mschlapp
⁩, ex-Acting DNI Ric Grenell, Nevada GOP Chair Michael McDonald, and ex-NV AG Adam Laxalt.

As someone from a Red Wall area I'm not entirely sure that the people there have been conned. The way I see it is that metropolitans (or whatever label you want to use) have decided there's a list of issues that Red Wall people need to have paramount in their decision-making and the Red Wall people don't see it like that, they actually have a different set of priorities. I could sum it up for some as "I don't care whether I'll be worse off, I prioritise having a voice that this one time doesn't get ignored".

This is 1630 our time that he will be doing this

RedToothbrush sorry, I posted before updating the page.