How much do you care who wins the US election?

[bravousa]

Background: UK citizen here, residing in the UK and generally don't trust politicians.

I may be weird but I don't really care that much who wins the US election. AIBU? Everyone seems to be obsessed.

I feel for the Americans if they get stuck with Trump for another 4 years, however that problem feels so remote from my day to day reality and worries here in the UK. And what do I know about Biden? Absolutely nothing other than he seems like a nice old man.

So do you care? If so, why?

(Obviously if you have strong connection to the US either by citizenship, family or business, I assume you will care. This question is mainly for those of us who don't).

I care. I'm really worried about the potential for another Trump presidency. Even if you don't care about some of the awful things that are happening in the US (and I do), there are so many implications for the rest of the world due to Trump's foreign policy, position on climate change etc.

I really don't know how anyone could consider it unimportant!

And let's not forget that Trump represents the majority, or certainly did at the time of last voting.

I'm always amazed by how ignorant some people are. Trump did not represent the majority, even in 2016. He won fewer votes than Clinton.

I don't particularly like Trump, but what is both ignorant (and somewhat disingenuous) is to present it as some kind of 'unfair victory'. The popular vote isn't particularly relevant in a system where the capture of power doesn't rely on it, and many American analysts have already said that the popular vote would have been different had this been the deciding factor, because there would've been more incentive to vote for many people.

But it inconveniently completely negates your point that Trump ‘represents the majority’.

He never has, by a long streak.

I agree with the quote attributed to Orwell/Churchill which says "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."

I'd love to see a strong leader who isn't a misogynist etc and who represents a much better role model, but on the flipside I also think a lot of people today are completely out of touch with the wider world and are far too focused on identity politics and 'being nice'/virtue signalling etc. Of course, there is merit in this but it comes far behind basic survival, which is something the large majority of us lucky few (in worldwide terms) have lost touch with.

People like Kim Jong etc don't care about how nice we are. What matters is that he knows he'll be blown into the middle of next year if he fucks with NATO or sends any missiles our way.

The privileges most Western people take for granted were largely won by capitalistic, imperious men like Trump, and we owe much of our quality of life to our empires of days past. If all major world powers disarmed tomorrow I'd imagine things would change very rapidly as there are many less fortunate who want what we have and will take it given half a chance.

Whilst the general population argues about which toilet non binary people should use and becomes frightfully offended that somebody as misogynistic as Trump should ever gain office, there still remains the need to have leadership which can deter potential enemies. People often say on here "well, it's all male violence, perpetrated by men", but I doubt Kim Jong cares what they say. Whilst there are violent leaders out there (which there will always be) we need our own leaders to be capable of necessary violence, as it's pretty much human nature IMHO.

I'm not advocating for Trump, but I'm convinced a significant part of society would vote for some fluffy woke hipster given half a chance. I also agree with Churchill that "the best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter."

I have no idea what the solution is. I'm not very enthused by either choice and wager there are hundreds of better choices out there. I'd possibly even vote for Arnold Schwarzenegger over either of them tbh.

But it inconveniently completely negates your point that Trump ‘represents the majority’.

He never has, by a long streak.

Didn't he get something like 95% of the amount of votes Hillary got? I'm not sure this constitutes her winning the popular vote by 'a long streak'.

Either way, there's no doubt he is extremely popular. It's just the whingers you hear the most. Like with Brexit. The majority voted out and are now getting on with their lives (figuratively speaking) whilst those that lost are making all the noise.

...and, I repeat, Trump does not represent the majority of Americans.

The privileges most Western people take for granted were largely won by capitalistic, imperious men like Trump, and we owe much of our quality of life to our empires of days past.

I dare say there are a fair few indigenous communities in nations around the world who aren’t all that delighted with imperialism. But I guess they don’t matter.

I dare say there are a fair few indigenous communities in nations around the world who aren’t all that delighted with imperialism. But I guess they don’t matter.

Well, they clearly don't matter enough to the majority as people don't seem to be bending over backwards to help them. What I'm saying is that it's easy to be anti-capitalist when you live in a nice cushy society built on capitalism and imperialism. All the people who want a socialist government....so long as they can keep the nice car, iphone, and washing machine.

It's a rollercoaster. I was deflated, losing hope that the 'red mirage' was indeed a mirage, woke to some really good news, and am hopeful again. I feel this is an important moment for all of humanity. There is hope that some really insidious trends worldwide will no longer be encouraged. I am also keen for someone less clinically insane to have the nuclear codes.

Thing is, much of the rest of the world is still fucked whatever goes on in the US.

Put in very simple terms, it isn't good that one of the most powerful & influential men in the world glories is his misogyny and thinks it's ok to 'cop a free feel'

Thankfully, common sense has prevailed.

Did he actually say that, or are you extrapolating that from his comment about how a famous person can get away with 'grabbing somebody by the pussy'?

I don't like him but I also find myself rolling my eyes at the amount of word twisting some people employ tbh.

I don't like him but

He’s lucky he’s got you on here sticking up for everything he’s done or said, given how much you ‘don’t like him’.

Where would poor Donny be with you?

He’s lucky he’s got you on here sticking up for everything he’s done or said, given how much you ‘don’t like him’.

Where would poor Donny be with you?

Where have I been 'sticking up for everything he's done'. Got any examples?

As I said, I don't like him. However, I don't really like many of the hysterical lefties either, who seem to overexaggerate everything (e.g. comparisons to the Third Reich).

You do realise that it's possible to be on neither side, right? I'm the same with many issues. Like how I hate corporate culture and big business in general but still think socialism is usually bonkers.

The one right above, for starters.

How is thinking it's ok to 'cop a free feel' any different from saying that a famous person can get away with 'grabbing somebody by the pussy'?

What he actually said was worse than the rather more polite way Mintjulia phrased it...

UK Govt already prepping (or should be according to its own CCC) for a 2 degree temp rise, and considering 4. Scientists agree that at 4 degrees of warming organised society can’t really continue. Trump pulling out of Paris accord really really matters on a world scale. If he has another four years to weaken US institutions kiss goodbye to American democracy- he’ll do away with term limits and then the world is chunked up into authoritarian powers pretty much hellbent on competing with each other for the earths remaining resources and governments who don’t give a shit about their own people. And we have zero chance of staging off planetary catastrophe that makes much of the actual earth uninhabitable for humans. That’s why I care.

How is thinking it's ok to 'cop a free feel' any different from saying that a famous person can get away with 'grabbing somebody by the pussy'?

Really?

Ok, well I believe that some people in positions of power can and have got away with crimes as they have the influence to cover it up/suppress it. The Catholic church, Jimmy Saville, the American diplomat's wife who killed that teenager by driving on the wrong side of the road and then fled back to the US, claiming political immunity.

By your reasoning, I must think the above are all ok. Just like how women who say the patriarchy facilitates sexual discrimination must think it's ok.

See the problem with your argument? Saying something isn't the same as endorsing it.

UK Govt already prepping (or should be according to its own CCC) for a 2 degree temp rise, and considering 4. Scientists agree that at 4 degrees of warming organised society can’t really continue. Trump pulling out of Paris accord really really matters on a world scale. If he has another four years to weaken US institutions kiss goodbye to American democracy- he’ll do away with term limits and then the world is chunked up into authoritarian powers pretty much hellbent on competing with each other for the earths remaining resources and governments who don’t give a shit about their own people. And we have zero chance of staging off planetary catastrophe that makes much of the actual earth uninhabitable for humans. That’s why I care.

I read an article a few weeks back about unprecedented levels of gas rising to the ocean surface. Way beyond what they expected once measured. Some of the scientists in the article were saying that we may already be fucked.

By your reasoning, I must think the above are all ok. Just like how women who say the patriarchy facilitates sexual discrimination must think it's ok.

What are you on about...?!

Where have I said you ‘endorsed his comments’?

You asked if Mintjulia extrapolated what she said, from his pussy grabbing comment.

No, she didn’t ‘extrapolate’ anything - she went by his actual words.

I think it was methane which is many times worse than co2 for global warming. From memory, they said levels were 400x higher than the natural equilibrium should be, and although they weren't a significant issue just yet it was unlikely that the process would reverse now started.

What are you on about...?!

Where have I said you ‘endorsed his comments’?

Jesus Christ! Reading is apparently not your strong point.

It's not about me endorsing his comments. You said that stating a fact is the same as believing it's ok.

"How is thinking it's ok to 'cop a free feel' any different from saying that a famous person can get away with 'grabbing somebody by the pussy'?"

I'm saying that pointing out something isn't the same as endorsing it. It's entirely possible to point out that famous people can get away with things without actually believing that it's ok for them to do so.

I'm saying that pointing out something isn't the same as endorsing it. It's entirely possible to point out that famous people can get away with things without actually believing that it's ok for them to do so.

Have you actually heard the Access Hollywood tape / read the transcript? I’m guessing not.

Trump does a lot more than just point out that famous people can get away with things.

• I did try and fuck her. She was married.

• I moved on her like a bitch. But I couldn’t get there.

• I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait.

But by all means, carry on telling the poster upthread that they ‘extrapolated’.

I’m a Brit living in the US, so I’m very invested. I voted for Joe.

However, both my county and state have gone blue (West coast state as expected, we’re always blue) which means a lot on a day to day basis.

School funding, infrastructure, county hospitals, gun laws, pro choice options, free school meals year round, a lot of issues that I care about and that concern people are much better IMO when Democrats have control locally.

Blue counties / States are cushioned from Trumps nasty rhetoric in many ways. We’ve moved a few times over the last 20+ years, and pick our home and neighbourhood carefully.

I wouldn’t want to be a Democrat in a red state, especially if trump wins. He is a major embarrassment, a raging narcissistic, and a general arsehole, so I’d like him out.

But by all means, carry on telling the poster upthread that they ‘extrapolated’.

Well, I'd have to have said it in the first place to 'carry on'.

I simply asked whether Trump had actually said that or whether they were paraphrasing on his behalf.

Your assertion that pointing something out is the same as believing it's ok is an entirely different matter.

Truth be told, I think Trump's a bit of a tit. However, I also believe his popularity is partly down to people getting fed up with identity politics, excessive political correctness, and the general tendency of today's society to be perpetually offended over everything. I'd love to see him win just to witness the amount of rustled jimmies it would cause, but I'd also want to turn back time after a few days as I think he's largely bad for the world.