to not understand why so many people are against adoption?

[Confusedamonium]

Before deciding to adopt, I'd never really been aware of this but it appears that a huge chunk of society are really, really against adoption - and I just don't understand why.

• SIL thinks children should be in foster care in case their parents change their minds or change their behaviour. She thinks permanently removing a child (no matter how much support has been offered or how long/severe the problems are) is unfair on the biological parents.
• DM thinks that no one can love an adopted child as much as a biological child - despite what we tell her.

People make comments about how cruel it is that children are taken from their parents (to both the children and the parents). Can anyone actually explain why they think it's better that children either float around foster placements or remain in abusive homes? What really shocks me is that foster carers are perceived as saintly carers for innocent souls and adopters are perceived as evil child snatchers. My parents foster and get no end of praise for it but one mention of adoption and people turn frosty.

@AcrossthePond55
Because I have an unlimited capacity to love am not an arsehole

I remember when we were first considering adopting and someone said we shouldn't do it because they 'wouldn't want to take on someone else's problems' when referring to the children. It is quite a few years ago now but I've never forgotten it and it shocked me. Luckily we no longer see that someone.

What firsttimemama doesn’t understand is that when you give birth to a baby, there are a rush of hormones surrounding that which Mother Nature designed for ensure you fall in love with that baby and you will literally die for him or her. That keeps the human race going. (I know not everybody gets this and should not feel bad if they don’t.)

What many people don’t realise is the hormone rush wears off. Yet your love for your baby remains. How does that work?

It works because every time you do something for your baby, the bond between you grows. Bathing, feeding, cuddling, holding, kissing, singing, laughing. They respond to you, they start to smile and their faces light up when they see you and that feels good, and a bond between you is growing. You can’t feel it because it’s impossible to distinguish between that bond and the hormone rush. Go forwards in time 17 years and you’re having to drive out at midnight to collect your daft teen who spent their taxi fare on alcopops and they didn’t take a coat and you do it because that bond is still there.

A parent who adopts a child doesn’t have that hormone rush, as a rule. But they will still be bonding and growing. And seventeen years later they will drive out in the dark at midnight just as you do.

Emerald When adoption is identified as the best option, agencies are encouraged to get on with it and not hold out for years for the perfect match (eg exact ethnicity matching). I do not believe they are going round trying to find children to adopt from families able to care for them just to meet targets - if nothing else the services are overstretched and underfunded - why would they give themselves unnecessary work?

@Ahorsecalledseptember

What firsttimemama doesn’t understand is that when you give birth to a baby, there are a rush of hormones surrounding that which Mother Nature designed for ensure you fall in love with that baby and you will literally die for him or her. That keeps the human race going. (I know not everybody gets this and should not feel bad if they don’t.)

What many people don’t realise is the hormone rush wears off. Yet your love for your baby remains. How does that work?

It works because every time you do something for your baby, the bond between you grows. Bathing, feeding, cuddling, holding, kissing, singing, laughing. They respond to you, they start to smile and their faces light up when they see you and that feels good, and a bond between you is growing. You can’t feel it because it’s impossible to distinguish between that bond and the hormone rush. Go forwards in time 17 years and you’re having to drive out at midnight to collect your daft teen who spent their taxi fare on alcopops and they didn’t take a coat and you do it because that bond is still there.

A parent who adopts a child doesn’t have that hormone rush, as a rule. But they will still be bonding and growing. And seventeen years later they will drive out in the dark at midnight just as you do.

Scientifically speaking, most people around a baby experience a hormone shift. In fact, a great deal of women lactate (an amount they don't notice) around newborns.

[quote EmeraldShamrock]I do think the UK will look back on many forced adoptions in the future somewhat like the Irish.
The numbers removed have increased massively agencies are expected to meet numbers

[/quote] Another tick on my bingo card

My wife and I looked at adoption after IVF failed and after a lot of soul searching decides it was not for us. I freely admit that I was somewhat influenced by the experiences of a number of friends and acquaintances who have adopted and are currently going through exceptionally challenging times as their adopted kids all have behavioural or developmental issues. I truly admire anyone who takes it on.

Possibly, but that’s not really what I was posting about. A baby crying might well cause the let down reflex but in itself it is not the same as the hormonal ‘rush’ some women experience after having their baby. It’s an overwhelming feeling and one that some immature people confuse with overpowering love that no one else can experience. They do, of course, just not in quite the same way

The thing is, most people would do anything for their kids without question. Those that are in the care system didn’t get there by accident. I’m pretty sure the parents will have had every opportunity to change their ways but obviously didn’t/couldn’t.

Whilst it must be heartbreaking to have your kids removed and placed for adoption, if you don’t change your ways for the sake of your child, there’s no hope. Some parents can’t/don’t prioritise they’re children’s needs above their own, therefore aren’t capable of bringing them up.

If they’re adopted young enough at least they’ve got a descent chance of a normal upbringing.

So yes I think adoptive parents are amazing. Especially as some of the children may have developmental/behavioural issues from being neglected etc

I've heard the "can't love an adopted child the same as a biological one" before. Even if this were true (and I don't think it is), I don't see how this is an argument against adoption in general. Children without suitable biological parents still thrive best in stable families.

I've never heard people say children shouldn't ever be adopted in case their birth families change their behaviour. I've heard a lot that birth families need more support and that decisions shouldn't take as long as they do. But I can see why families that struggle might think that - fear that their children could be lost to them is quite powerful.

If they’re adopted young enough at least they’ve got a descent chance of a normal upbringing.

Unless their adoptive parents are abusive arseholes

I am adopted and I personally have a very bad opinion of adoption, but I know that it is because of the horrendous experience I had. My adoptive 'parents' were abusive and never let me forget that I was adopted, I have been NC with them for 6 years and it has taken a lot of therapy to get over what happened to me.
I have also traced my biological parents (My Mum 13 years ago and my Dad last year). The relationship with my Mum has been rocky at times but the love is definitely there, we just both have sensitivities about what is normal, the relationship with my Dad is amazing and I truly regret not tracing him sooner. I see my Bio parents as my real parents and always will so I don't disagree with the terms myself but I would use Birth parents when talking about others situations as I know my view is due to my experience.
I do think that adoption needs to be even stricter and that there should be a long settling period before its permanent because the right combination is essential, especially when the children are from a vulnerable situation and already have feelings of rejection etc.
What hurts me the most is my Birth certificate and I would love to have my original reinstated but its not possible

I think people who adopt are incredible but I there are negatives to adopting and that is why people go through fertility treatments instead of the process.

I would be concerned that I wouldn't love an adopted child in the same way I love my DC. I would be worried that they would never fully accept me and my DH as "real" parents. I would be concerned of the damage done during pregnancy or early in life.

My friends who have adopted have faced additional issues that wouldn't come up if they had bio children. Then a school friend who was adopted as a child spent years coming to terms with the abuse she experienced pre adoption (drug abuse, self harm etc)

Tbh I think that all parents are capable of wrongdoing but people seem to think that adoptive parents will love their children more because of what it took to have them. In the same way people seem to think parents who had children via IVF love them more because of the pain they went through to have them. When actually, once you become a parent only then do you realise what it’s all about and whether you’re any good at it.

I knew someone who e.g. tried for a baby for ten years, and when she had her she hated being a parent so much she went straight back to work and put the baby in nursery from 9/6 every day at the age of four months and her DH did all the childcare on weekends.

Wanting a child is no guarantee of being a good parent.

In terms of loving a biological child more, I don’t know about more, I do think it must be different, but then I think that we love all our children differently from each other.

But I know several adults who were adopted in families where there were biological children and they all say they felt different from their siblings growing up.

We're facing this kinda thing now. DH and I am had our first child this summer (a biological DD) but have decided (quite a few years ago) that we wanted to adopt as well. Both sides of our family have pulled faces and made remarks about wanting more 'real grandchildren' like an adopted child is somehow not as good! Makes me see them all a little differently if I'm honest

I am an adopter. I was so so angry on our course when I was told I would never love my adopted child like I would my birth children. It could not be further from the truth. I would die in a heartbeat for any of my children and I would never choose between them. Most of the time they forget one of them is adopted 'she gets her hair from you doesn't she mum' etc. I also hate that people think it's ok to ask why she was taken from her birth parents. It's not your business and it's not my story to tell. It's her story and although she is open with her being adopted it's not something she wants to tell everyone. Telling people your parents are shit and couldn't put you first isn't nice

I think adopters are brave and adoption is wonderful.

I have lots of adoptive families in my circle.
Some adoptions have been more successful than others.
My overriding feeling is awe at parents who go through the process, the hoops and investigation etc they go through.

I feel sad that they are almost abandoned after the adoption, that they don't really get the help they need with some of the kids extra needs.

I have families who were very very savvy when researching the children and were very clear on what they could and couldn't take on, and then others who were so desperate to be parents they bit off more than they could chew.

I have never heard any of the negativity you have spoken about.

[quote EmeraldShamrock]Adoptive parents are undoubtedly real parents.
Unfortunately as investigated some SS agencies get it wrong. I think forced adoption with such a small timeframe can be questionable.

[/quote] I agree with both points and thank you for posting that link.

@TableFlowerss that was certainly true in DS's case. His birth mum was given chance after chance but she just wasnt capable of putting him first. In fact she had four children and they were all put up for adoption. SS do everything possible for children to stay with the birth family but sadly it just isnt always in the best interests of the child for that to happen.

@SimonJT I am not trying to offensive to you or any adopter.
I am sure it is the right decision for the majority of DC in care but there is questionable evidence with the UK forced adoption process being very quick missing opportunities to help.

Oh LJ - that place took vicious and extreme to a whole new level. The inception of groups to talk about groups to talk about groups, you could find out you were being targeted by a group three deep in the crazy with no idea - it was wild.

I've heard of many of these attitudes (beyond jessy), some who have this weird ideal of how parents should be and how things should work and others that are more towards systemic issues with adoption, many of the louder ones are twisting real issues current or past out of proportions and the very real current issues - particularly from adoptees themselves who are often used and abused by people on all sides: if you're happy, you're delusional or a role model, if you're not happy, you need to be more grateful or evidence of how messed up the system is, and having complicated emotions ends up with all of the above.

I think some media and high profile American cases haven't helped people move any more positive than the associations of forced adoptions and what has happened in in the UK, Ireland, and elsewhere in living memory (and in some places, still on going). The US still has a lot of messed up issues going on and that bleeds into the image elsewhere.

The loving adoptive parents have to get past both the 'state is out to get us' screamers and 'adopting as part of our ministry/image' which are comparatively few, but still very real situations that have had many tragic endings that that can be really loud in some spaces. It's difficult to create systems for this, it needs constant monitoring and change people's minds, but people get thrown to the wolves with the flaws, real and imagined (though I support nations not wanting to take part in international adoption with how that tends to be the source of most of the more heartbreaking stories).