Friend said they're planning to break Covid rules..

[ThoroughlyForumed]

I was visiting a close friend yesterday evening (all fine in my location at the moment). We got to chatting about Christmas plans and what we would do 'if' rules changed or were upped in our area.
Luckily for me my family is a neat 6 so as long as we stay in medium we can celebrate together but obviously would change the plan if anything changed. Her family is a larger 11 and she very candidly just said they were all planning to celebrate together regardless of what rules are in place then. I sort of shrugged it off at the time as I didnt want to start a hypothetical argument but AIBU for being secretly pissed off with her for being so cavalier with Covid rules?

I think 'live and let live' would be a reasonable stance to adopt over this; however it's obvious how divisive it could be. I'm fairly that I won't be having my 'normal' Christmas because the family members I usually spend it with will adhere to rules and we're in Tiers 2/3. This isn't a huge problem, but I think it'll irk me nearer the time if other people are clearly getting together in large groups, particularly if they're publicly vocal about it. But I would still try not to get too wound up. I think we'll just have to grit our teeth and get through Christmas.

Families spending Christmas in large groups will be cancelled out by far fewer people going to work and schools being off.

I’m more worried by the Christmas shopping crush frankly. With Brexit coming we will gave all that stockpiling shite as well as the usual Christmas over buying. No way will people prioritise self isolating for 14 day over getting the third packet of stuffing or another ham “ just in case”.

It’s very sad you’re the sort of person who would not just be judgey but also actually be pissed off too. But at least you’re owning it, well on here anyway.

I think there will be a possibility of a circuit break after Christmas and the chances of Secondary schools being 'closed' otherwise there is a chance it will be carnage.

What WILL cause upset is older relatives putting pressure on family members who work in high risk jobs to go round for Christmas dinner. We are not comfortable putting my inlaws at risk. They don't seem to understand the risks, or are in denial of them. We will be having Christmas in our own house, just our household and that's our choice even if restrictions are raised for one day, but there will be raised eyebrows, I'm sure.

I'm fed up of the bad feeling this has created between people really. I've been surprised how lax some people I know are, and how uptight others seem to be over "the rules".

Luckily we are also a "neat 6" but I would say (and certainly not report) anyone acting different to us if they had more than 6. If it was that important then why does the Government:
a) encourage everyone back out to restaurants with Eat Out to Help Out (no, I didn't do it) at the same time as encouraging workers back to offices and opening up schools/universities - anyone with 2oz of common sense could see it was too much too soon;
b) allow BLM, anti-mask and other marches to go ahead over summer, not to mention toilets at beaches being shut - whilst still allowing beaches to be open, pretty disgusting;
c) make rules they can't police so they quickly descend into a farce;
d) not get track and trace running properly;
e) not have CV19 tests at all entry points to the country up and running.
Whilst some of those things may not be possible within weeks they have now had months. Until they have got some key schemes up and running I won't be putting my life on hold - not that I am a complete anarchist as I naturally don't break the rules anyway as we live a quiet, not particularly sociable, life.

Wasn't there a discussion about this just yesterday? And probably the day before, and the day before that etc.

It’s hard to follow rules that are so crazy
It’s also hard to follow rules when the only real harm I have seen is economic
Since March 18 I’ve seen people
Utterly screwed financially
But actually not for health
I’m fact health issue are more people who can’t acess treatment

I’m not being a Covid denier , and I’m being fairly low key
But that’s my truth

I'm fed up of the bad feeling this has created between people really. I've been surprised how lax some people I know are, and how uptight others seem to be over "the rules"

Indeed this x 100

It's up to her, lot's aren't following the rules because they are bat shit, the rules not the people.
There are 6 adults, a 16 year old and two under 5's in our family, and we'll be together whatever the rules.
Doing our own risk assessment and it's very low, so no problem.

@CurlyhairedAssassin

That said, *@WaxOnFeckOff*, I do wonder how comfortable hospitality staff working in lower tier areas feel about higher tier guests coming in to their area. Not just hospitality staff either. Locals generally.

We've just had a few days in the Lake District. It's almost exactly the same rate of infection that we currently have in my part of Scotland but far more freedom. We even had a meal out, with alcohol! They are Tier 1, we have similar restrictions as Tier 3 but a bit extra. We were door to door so no impact different to locals.

We have scottish accents and obvs the locals would no idea if we were from Glasgow/Lanarkshire which do have as high rates as Liverpool etc. However, we had nothing but courteous and welcoming treatment wherever we went, I think they were glad that we were there spending money.

I don’t know one person sticking to the rules tbh.

We have difficult decisions to make in our family, but that's why you have to make them.

If everybody uses the reasoning that they have hardly seen their family all year, so they are seeing them at Christmas, then the NHS will simply not be able to cope with the number of inevitable cases.

I've seen my mum for one day this year. One. It's heartbreaking. Nothing more I would like than to to see her with my partner and DC .

However, that might result in hospitalisation for her, and possible illness for any Doctors and nurses that treat her. This has been happening, it's not scaremongering.

If you are going to go against the science and the advice of PHE ( sod the Govt, they are just winging it ), then don't try and rationalise it or justify it..you are essentially risking the lives of your family members and the complete strangers that may have to treat them.

What WILL cause upset is older relatives putting pressure on family members who work in high risk jobs to go round for Christmas dinner. We are not comfortable putting my inlaws at risk. They don't seem to understand the risks, or are in denial of them. We will be having Christmas in our own house, just our household and that's our choice even if restrictions are raised for one day, but there will be raised eyebrows, I'm sure.

Maybe they are willing to accept the risks?

My 89 year old father in law will be joining us as will his daughter (DH's sister). That takes us to 7 and we don't care. He would rather take his chances with the virus than fester alone and depressed on his own.

However, that might result in hospitalisation for her, and possible illness for any Doctors and nurses that treat her.

This was a problem at the start when medical staff weren't supplied with proper PPE.

Tons of people will be breaking the rules. And frankly it’s for good reason. I can go to work and sit in a socially distanced meeting. But not go the pub and have a drink with same people? It’s nonsense.

If I felt strongly about rule breaking over Crimbo then I would essentially quarantine myself as I work on the assumption that most people will do what they want to.

This thread is making for depressing reading.

I'm a hospital doctor and likely will be spending christmas at the hospital (again), with my husband and baby at home. It's such a slap in the face when we give up so much of our life and our family's life and people, some of whom get a whole week of holiday over the christmas period, or are working from home anyway, can't show front line workers some respect by abiding by the rules.

Yes the government has been a complete embarrassment in their covid management, but we're all working away in hospitals across the country. Can't people do it for us? Where's all that pot-banging spirit now? We've all had a miserable year and front line workers are heading into a shit show of a second wave.

Merry fucking Christmas to us.

Well it's none of your business. It's alright for you, your family is a neat 6. But if there were 7 in your family, you might have a different attitude.

Wow this thread makes totally depressing reading.

Since when did our country become full of such selfish, entitled people.....

1. None of us know what the rules will be or what tier we will be in, so how on earth can you have already decided what you’re doing?

1. You may not even be allowed 6! And how many homes and dining tables are big enough to allow 6 distancing to 2m?

1. We’re predominantly all adults. It will not kill us to not have the usual whole family for Christmas for 1 year. It may just save our lives...(think outside the box, meet up in different ways)

1. It is not kind to have older, vulnerable people to your house (even for one day), especially if you have young adults or kids. Unless you have totally quarantined for 2 weeks, you cannot guarantee you do not have covid. The Christmas environment is the ideal one to cause multigenerational spreading.

1. Hospitals are already busy at Christmas, staffing levels are lower and many staff are already sick. There’s always high admissions anyway due to winter flu, alcohol, other illnesses and accidents.

1. Our hospital is already busy! In October! Surprise, surprise the local lockdown is not working so far. We now have cancelled all routine services and will have staff redeployed. Basically every effort is having to be put into managing covid, plus any other emergencies. Is your family Christmas worth delaying other people’s medical appointments, surgeries, cancer treatments etc? Remember it could be your friends or family.

1. Just because the rules are nonsense, or you don’t agree with the government, or you think covid isn’t real, does that really give you the right to do what you want?

1. If you are thinking that you are doing your “own risk assessment “, believe me that is what the people currently on itu thought they were doing. No one deliberately tries to catch covid.

@BaylisAndHardon

This thread is making for depressing reading.

I'm a hospital doctor and likely will be spending christmas at the hospital (again), with my husband and baby at home. It's such a slap in the face when we give up so much of our life and our family's life and people, some of whom get a whole week of holiday over the christmas period, or are working from home anyway, can't show front line workers some respect by abiding by the rules.

Yes the government has been a complete embarrassment in their covid management, but we're all working away in hospitals across the country. Can't people do it for us? Where's all that pot-banging spirit now? We've all had a miserable year and front line workers are heading into a shit show of a second wave.

Merry fucking Christmas to us.

Well if you go into the medical field working in a hospital, having to spend Christmas and bank holidays at work just comes with the job. Being a doctor, I'm sure you're handsomely recompensed. Retail workers have to do the same.

What WILL cause upset is older relatives putting pressure on family members...

And vice versa.

Maybe a quieter smaller Xmas this year might not be so bad. We might appreciate a more peaceful day, without the usual overspending on presents, food and big boozy gatherings

Maybe they are willing to accept the risks?

Clearly they are, @HesterShaw1. So they can do that with relatives who are equally willing to take the risk to their house. We are not willing to. We may feel different if it was one very depressed relative living on their own who was begging and begging us to go. But not to relatives who already live with someone.

I have rethought a few friendships where they have broken Covid laws. I’d not be friends with someone’s who thought it was ok to steal etc so see it as no different. Those laws were introduced to help keep cases down, protect others and the nhs etc.

My husband is in the emergency services baylis and I have friends who work at the hospital. We are all adopting a common sense approach of following the rules for the most part but we are not going to stress over 1 or 2 extra people or 'coincidentally' meeting up at a park when our kids are in the same class at school. You have chosen to be a dr working in a hospital. Shifts and working christmas come with the territory.