OH thinks no kids are left hungry?!!

[ihate2020]

I've joined the cook4kids over the half term in our area.

Oh is pissed of about it and thinks the parents that collect the lunch boxes I've made up are just out to get a freebie and I should spend the money on our own kids

AIBU to say he is a delunsional idiot?

Food needs to go directly to the child. Parents sell vouchers, etc, like mirror said and laugh at governments stupidity. Parents can't be bothered to cook for their kids.listen to mirror she worked with families like that. Obviously children shouldn't go hungry but we need to find most effective way to get good into the children and currently we are not.

Yes, yes, yes @narcdad45 a free school meal 365 days a year is NOT the answer!

[quote Chuggington2]@Gilead you talk about enabling.....feeding children on their parent’s behalf is 100% enabling them to carry on not prioritising their children. You do not get it. No we can’t let a child go hungry but we need to stop the attention seeking and have some real discussions about why.[/quote]
Problem is that when someone suggests that x is a problem in many families you get the But Olypmics. In the end people start arguing that people don't even have a spoon and can't afford one and this turns it ridiculous. I do wonder if this attitude of "not my(their) failing" and shutting down discussion with "But people (0.001 of population in reality) simply cannot because of (enter obscure reason), you cruel bastard!" is the reason why UK is in top 5 for children's poverty in EU...

Simply, if it can't be talked about properly, it will only get worse.

feministfemme
clears throat

WE SHOULDN'T LET CHILDREN GO HUNGRY EVEN IF IT IS THE FAULT OF THE PARENTS. THE CHILDREN HAVE NO CULPABILITY.
EITHER YOU FUNDAMENTALLY THINK ALL CHILDREN HAVE A RIGHT TO FOOD, OR YOU DON'T.

Phew. I feel better.

Totally agree!!!

I’m glad your shouting has made you feel better. Unfortunately your words and sentiment has and will do nothing for the actual hungry children in this country because you just won’t listen and it’s infuriating.

I went hungry as a child. My mother was a horrible woman who spent any money she had on herself and left us with virtually no food. Our father was quite well off and paid her maintenance but worked abroad. I don’t know if we’d have qualified for FSM or not but she wouldn’t ever claim it because she thought she was very superior. Meanwhile, we were left hungry all the time. I remember how hard it was to sleep when I was hungry. I’m a senior teacher now and I would never watch a child go hungry. We give food out whenever we can see signs - and I know the signs well. I vividly remember one half term that a kind neighbour dropped a food parcel at our door. It was full of snacks and my mother was quite put out by receiving it but the neighbour insisted she was doing one for everyone to keep her busy. We are all those snacks and we’re so grateful. Food parcels directly to the door are an incredible gift.

narcdad. Yes I have experience. However at the moment we need to feed children. We are in the middle of a pandemic and malnourished children are vulnerable in many ways. Yes we need to look at longer term answers, but let’s face it, this government is unlikely to do so, ergo in the meantime we feed the children as best we can.

@Gilead

narcdad. Yes I have experience. However at the moment we need to feed children. We are in the middle of a pandemic and malnourished children are vulnerable in many ways. Yes we need to look at longer term answers, but let’s face it, this government is unlikely to do so, ergo in the meantime we feed the children as best we can.

Doing something and talking about why it's happening and how to prevent it in a future can be actually done at the same time. And it should tbh. While there is a public eye on it. It will go quiet again soon and then... Well, everyone will somewhat "forget" again as another issue takes the news.

I was hungry as a child even though both parents worked in professional jobs. They were too absorbed in their own problems to prioritise food. It takes planning, energy and consistency to put together a packed lunch or a meal. Reading this thread it is clear there are different reasons behind children being hungry. Having to wait 5 weeks for the first payment of Universal Credit is also part of the problem. If you add together poor mental health and financial struggles its not difficult to see how children end up hungry.

narcdad. Yes I have experience. However at the moment we need to feed children. We are in the middle of a pandemic and malnourished children are vulnerable in many ways. Yes we need to look at longer term answers, but let’s face it, this government is unlikely to do so, ergo in the meantime we feed the children as best we can.

But what you are saying is blame the government, throw out a few fish fingers and that’ll help keep those vulnerable children fed and il feel better.

It will do nothing. Absolutely nothing. And shouting this over and over will not help nor make you a better person.

We need an honest conversation about neglect and parental and personal responsibility and until we are prepared to accept that we shall go round in circles and nothing will be done.

I hate this move back to the Victorian idea of deserving and undeserving poor. Any child who is poor is deserving. Quite agree. It’s irrelevant to a hungry child whether they’re hungry because their parents can’t or won’t feed them. The important thing is that SOMEBODY needs to be feeding them.

But no one is saying that. They are saying that although there seems like a very simple answer it’s actually hugely more complicated than that and because of those complications these simple answers may do more harm than good. I’d love it if people now tried to get more involved and get down to the nitty gritty of trying to make these kids lives better. What a success that would be! But making packed lunches no one will eat and slagging off the government isn’t that sadly. I grew up in similar circumstances to you, judging by your post. We regularly had no gas or electric etc. Literally did not have a pot to pee in. I was lucky in that my mum could make pennies stretch a very long way, she could cook from scratch, we had a local greengrocer who let her have stuff on tick and she would still often go without to make sure we ate. Other kids on our estate weren’t so lucky and we usually had extra mouths at our table. I entirely accept that there are a myriad of reasons for hungry children; it’s not a simple issue and we definitely need investment in children’s services. But sorting out neglect and poverty etc takes years. It’s been happening forever and still isn’t fixed. It’s all very well you shaking your head and telling other posters that a cheese roll isn’t going to solve the issue. Of course it’s not; everyone knows that. But do we ignore those rumbling bellies in the meantime?

@CanIGetARefund

I was hungry as a child even though both parents worked in professional jobs. They were too absorbed in their own problems to prioritise food. It takes planning, energy and consistency to put together a packed lunch or a meal. Reading this thread it is clear there are different reasons behind children being hungry. Having to wait 5 weeks for the first payment of Universal Credit is also part of the problem. If you add together poor mental health and financial struggles its not difficult to see how children end up hungry.

It does not take 5 weeks to get a first payment for UC, this is completely false, you can get an advance on the same day or next working day.

UC has evolved since its initial roll out to enable these advances, the only reason some have to wait, is if they do not complete the initial identification and verification checks.

Food bank vouchers and LA support funding (another issue that's never fully addressed) should be offered in the interim.

But do we ignore those rumbling bellies in the meantime?

You talk like a politician!

No, what I’m saying is that those bellies will still be rumbling after we’ve given this food out but then everyone will forget about them because they feel like they’ve done their bit. People will have that warm glow inside thinking that they’ve helped but those kids will still be hungry and miserable. What I’m saying is the easy answer isn’t the right one.

Now everyone is so passionate about feeding them let’s look at the best way to do just that rather than just throwing food. Just because it’s hard to understand, stomach and fix these problems doesn’t mean we shouldn’t try.

But do we ignore those rumbling bellies in the meantime?

Emotinally blackmailing dtamatic statements like this just make people turn away and give up tbh...

No one here os suggesting to "let their bellies rumble". 🙄

You talk like a politician! ... No, what I’m saying is that those bellies will still be rumbling after we’ve given this food out but then everyone will forget about them because they feel like they’ve done their bit. People will have that warm glow inside thinking that they’ve helped but those kids will still be hungry and miserable. What I’m saying is the easy answer isn’t the right one... Now everyone is so passionate about feeding them let’s look at the best way to do just that rather than just throwing food. Just because it’s hard to understand, stomach and fix these problems doesn’t mean we shouldn’t try. I’m actually talking like an adult who has witnessed the effects of childhood poverty first hand. I don’t have any difficulties understanding that a packed lunch over the holidays isn’t going to fix anything. What I am struggling to understand is why the issue has to be either/or. We can work towards eradicating neglect and poverty at the exact same time as we make sure a hungry child has something to eat that day. This is not an issue where sides need to be taken. The end aim is the same, so why criticise the attempts of people who are trying to do the little bit they can to address the short term effects of a long term problem? Most people don’t have the time or the money to launch campaigns trying to convince the government to properly fund child services, so why mock their attempts to do a little bit to help, even if they do forget about it by Christmas?

Emotionally blackmailing dtamatic statements like this just make people turn away and give up tbh... Yes, it’s a convenient get out clause for some, I’d imagine.

No one here os suggesting to "let their bellies rumble". I disagree. A few posters are going along the lines of ‘you’re wasting your time. Stop doing the little bit you’re trying to do, the real solution is xyz and that is the only thing that will help’. We’ve been trying to eradicate poverty & neglect for centuries and we haven’t managed it yet. So could we not approach it from a different angle at the same time?

I agree with everyone who's said that kids are going hungry because of neglect.
(I would add to that certain short term emergencies and some situations where there are immigration issues)

However: I still support free meal programmes for the sake of all the families who do put food on the table but with a struggle.

I'm thankfully not a position where someone giving my kid a cheese sandwich and an apple is a load off of my mind. Plenty of people are.

We have an excellent holiday scheme where I live that provides free lunch and a microwave meal to takeaway. Kids over 8 can sign themselves in, so it is accessible to neglected kids.

It works because its available to everyone, is right on the doorstep and the organised activities act as window dressing to prevent stigma.

When you come pick your kids up the youth workers press food on you. Everyone has the opportunity to make a show of "not needing" it and then walks away with something anyway.

If its done properly...it can be a really good thing.

[quote feministfemme]**@MootingMirror But why does it matter who's fault it is? I agree that feckless parents who don't care about their children are awful, but kids deserve to eat even if it's their parents fault.[/quote]
It does matter very much actually.

If there are even a small % of parents who will not feed their kids whatever measures/benefits are put in place because their priorities lie elsewhere, then that needs to be addressed in another way. That is what the school @MootingMirror is talking about did.

If it had been left as it was those kids would have gone hungry.

Overall, of course, every child needs to be fed and to have someone care. That care comes in various forms.

. I disagree. A few posters are going along the lines of ‘you’re wasting your time. Stop doing the little bit you’re trying to do, the real solution is xyz and that is the only thing that will help’. We’ve been trying to eradicate poverty & neglect for centuries and we haven’t managed it yet. So could we not approach it from a different angle at the same time?

So you see exactly why it’s fruitless but you still want the government to fund it so people get to feel like they’ve done their little bit. Why? Who does this benefit?

Actually acknowledging and trying to deal with the problems that might actually help, that’s too hard, too much effort?

It’s not that people want it help that makes me frustrated, that’s always great. It’s the fact that people want to help but in a minor specific way without challenge and funded by someone else whilst knowing their efforts will do very little. But they will fight to the death to do it because what? It doesn’t make sense. Who is all for?

@whiskybysidedoor it will fall on death ears.....@Sn0tnose you’re completely contradicting yourself, no one is saying don’t deal with the immediate problem that’s in front of us....but if you aren’t also prepared to have an honest conversation about why this is happening and put some of the effort that you’re putting into dealing with the immediate issue into confronting the whys and the long term issue. And you’re coming out with thing like well this has been going on for centuries so why bother. I take the position that you’re to scared to have a proper conversation about the real issues at play here and are more concerned about the feel good factor for yourself - sorry.

You talk about people not having the money to launch such campaigns well the person spearheading FSM earns £100’000’s every week....I’m sure he could spare a bob. For those of us at home the effort is he same and costs nothing, real visible conversations on social media, hashtags, change.org surveys....we don’t want to do that though do we because we’re too concerned with upsetting people and our own image.

Feeding your children should be the first thing you do and the last thing you don’t!

Of course it should. But if you don't have enough money, your utilities are on a meter so if you don't pay them they are cut off (unlike a monthly bill where you can get into arrears before they cut you off) so you use some of the rent money. Then the council say you intentionally got into arrears and therefore they won't help you.
What I mean is you are expected to pay rent and council tax before food. They are seen as more important.

It does not take 5 weeks to get a first payment for UC, this is completely false, you can get an advance on the same day or next working day That's if they'll agree to giving you an advance. I know people who have been turned down for them. And then they have to be paid back. So the already small amount of money you have is reduced further. You're always paying catch up.

whiskybysidedoor & Chuggington2 Seriously? Do give over, the pair of you. Either read what I’ve written or ignore it, but don’t start making stuff up that I didn’t say and didn’t imply.

Actually acknowledging and trying to deal with the problems that might actually help, that’s too hard, too much effort?

The last Labour government did this, only to see all their work decimated by Cameron’s austerity. We’ve gone backwards in the last decade. And attacking the root causes of poverty is hardly a priority in the middle of a pandemic. We should have mended the roof while the sun shone.

The cost of providing meals to children out of term time is dwarfed many times over by the cost of the furlough scheme.

Whilst both schemes are open to abuse, abuse of the furlough scheme runs to billions.

www.rpc.co.uk/perspectives/tax-take/hmrcs-new-powers-to-investigate-furlough-abuse

Ordinary people blaming and denigrating the poor and needy as unworthy/immoral plays an important ideological role in the continuation and expansion of inequality.

I wonder if there's a way of sending vouchers direct to older kids through their email accounts. So meal deal vouchers for tesco's or something in the holidays. I have 3 teenage boys and could not bear to think of hungry teenagers ( or any age of children) going without.

Surely we can help in the short term with food provisions while still trying to sort out the root causes of poverty in the long term?

I agree we need to support children with neglectful parents (those who won't feed their children) and that may involve a different method, but there are kids going hungry now due to the pandemic / job loss. If it helps one kid, it's better than nothing and while those kids are getting fed, we can try and figure out how to help those who can't access the same kind of help - I don't have any bright ideas on how to necessarily, but I'm sure something can be done.