OH thinks no kids are left hungry?!!

[ihate2020]

I've joined the cook4kids over the half term in our area.

Oh is pissed of about it and thinks the parents that collect the lunch boxes I've made up are just out to get a freebie and I should spend the money on our own kids

AIBU to say he is a delunsional idiot?

[SchrodingersImmigrant]

Also. That goes against the arguments here that it's not neglect really, that families just need help. So theoretically there would be no children removed. 🤷🏻

[VinylDetective]

You still haven’t answered my question @SchrodingersImmigrant.

[SchrodingersImmigrant]

About who is going to pay for the care? Well presumably no one since there will be barely any kids removed since it's apparently in majority of cases not neglect, just need a help.

[narcdad45]

@froggygoneonakillingspree

"Also, I'm not claiming to be an expert but the gov.uk advice page says you can't apply for a UC advance unless you've already had an in-person meeting at the job centre, which I imagine takes some time. If you've never been on benefits before you can't just go online, fill in a form, and have money in your account the same day."

Yes this did happen during the pandemic, yes advances were issued without seeing an actual person for several months. This was happening nationally and yes I was working with these extremely vulnerable families to obtain these advances which were paid the same or next working day.

The national target to get people into job centres for their first initial meeting is within 3 working days, during the pandemic it was done via trust and protect as the job centres were closed to the public so no face to face needed.

PIP is a different benefit with different processes.

Yes, I have been on benefits as were my very poor and poverty stricken parents. I am able to work and my job is working within the benefit support system with extremely vulnerable families.


As you were my stance still is that FSM during term times are pretty useless in the grand scheme of things.

[LyingWitchInTheWardrobe]

@VinylDetective

and when that fails, the children need to be removed so that they have half a chance of a decent upbringing. Because children deserve to be looked after

And who’s going to look after them if they’re removed? And who’s going to pay for it? Do people engage their brains at all before they spout this nonsense?

What is the alternative? Leave the children with parents who can't or won't care for them?

There is a care system and adoption needs to be made easier. Not rocket science for me but... I've worked in Social Services and seen the challenges, seen people drop off their kids, seen children being taken. What do I know?

I won't be as rude to you as you've been but your post is without foundation.

[VinylDetective]

Yes of course it is. So foundationless that there doesn’t appear to be an answer to the two perfectly reasonable questions it raises.

[SchrodingersImmigrant]

I like how you don't question where would money for all the help come from. Just the removal if all else fails part...

[LyingWitchInTheWardrobe]

Has the care system/children look after service been abandoned then? Nobody said.

I don't know what your agenda is, VinylDetective but you wilfully misquoted my post so whatever it is, you can keep it.. and your questions, which have been answered. Care system. Look it up.

[VinylDetective]

It costs far more to have children in care than to support them with their parents. I can question whatever I like.

[SchrodingersImmigrant]

@VinylDetective

It costs far more to have children in care than to support them with their parents. I can question whatever I like.

So you would just leave a child in a home where they are being neglected. Nice.
Anyway, that's theoretical, but stil eyebrow raising.

[bemusedmoose]

I Iive in an affluent area where bmws and range rovers are the normal family car. We live on £70 a week for the 3 of us (1 adult 2 kids) i would go hungry before i let my kids skip a meal (unless they weren't hungry) but there are plenty of the more well off kids that go to school hungry on a daily basis, one has a sugar sandwich (white bread, marg and white sugar) or nothing, lots only have a biscuit that before school club give them. Then for lunch the standard seems to be white bread and jam, a mayo sandwich, crisps and sweets. We are healthy eating school but the sh#t most kids eat everyday is 🤯 one girl has a giant box of tic-tacs every lunch and eats them all. Jam, midget gems, crisps and a chocolate bar is the normal girl lunch box - it's just sugary crap, no nutrition and leaves them knackered and grumpy for the teachers.

For lots of families it's not having the funds and for others it's having bad priorities. I buy a big sack of oats for £2 which makes porridge for my 2 for a good 2 weeks. Pinch of cinnamon, banana, honey, raisins or cooked apples are good for making it yummy and when things are really tight a bit of cheap jam on top.

But I've always been frugal, I don't waste anything (scraps and bones go to the dogs or in a freezer bag for stock or soup) and I also grow our own fruit and veg so what money we have can be spent on other food.

[Sozzler]

Some interesting research here on why children and their families are going hungry during this pandemic and what can be done to tackle it. Hopefully it might help to combat this false narrative that the vast majority of children affected by food poverty are a product of neglectful and uncaring parents.

www.savethechildren.org.uk/content/dam/gb/reports/winterplanforchildren.pdf

Although far from perfect, free school meals in the holidays do help a lot of children and offer vital relief to families that are under incredible financial pressure and hardship.

[SchrodingersImmigrant]

The thing is. This isn't just about families in hardship due to pandemic. This isn't a new issue. The magnitude of it now brought the issue into attention properly, especially with the disgraceful handling.

[froggygoneonakillingspree]

Yes this did happen during the pandemic, yes advances were issued without seeing an actual person for several months.

This thread has absolutely nothing to do with UC Advances. But at least you've dropped your insane lie that anyone claiming they had to wait five weeks for (non-advance) UC is "telling porkies."

PIP is a different benefit with different processes.
So? This thread is about poverty and child hunger. The fact disabled people have to wait months to receive benefits is absolutely relevant to explaining why some it's not just "feckless" wasters who spend all their benefit money on flatscreens and fags who struggle to feed their families.

[froggygoneonakillingspree]

For lots of families it's not having the funds and for others it's having bad priorities. I buy a big sack of oats for £2 which makes porridge for my 2 for a good 2 weeks. Pinch of cinnamon, banana, honey, raisins or cooked apples are good for making it yummy and when things are really tight a bit of cheap jam on top.

But I've always been frugal, I don't waste anything (scraps and bones go to the dogs or in a freezer bag for stock or soup) and I also grow our own fruit and veg so what money we have can be spent on other food.

That's admirable but most people living in poverty don't have big houses with the storage space for sacks of porridge, big gardens and oodles of spare time for gardening and making stock from scratch, and were not taught these skills. Some people don't even have a kitchen.

[SchrodingersImmigrant]

Maybe the people should learn the needed skills... If someone wants to learn something, they will.

Basically, what I gathered from all these threads is, that there is no solution. Because no matter what, there is always a But.
"People could start using the really cheap ingredient. Not great, but it feeds them"
"But children don't really like porridge and people have no leccy and gas to cook it"
"You can soak it overnight. If someone is hungry, porridge is a good help. Or other cheaper stuff"
"But people can't because they can't store large bag of porridge. And they don't know how to use other ingredients"
And so on.

Basically how it will end is that everyone will have a little victory wank over the likes on their pics with sandwiches they are "feeding the kids ya know" and that's it. 🤷🏻 See you next holidays with exactly the same issue.

The problem here is an overall attitude and the inability to discuss uncomfortable topics without shouting about people who have no spoons to eat with.

[dontdisturbmenow]

That's admirable but most people living in poverty don't have big houses with the storage space for sacks of porridge
Talk about dipping deep for excuses! Who said you needed to stock massive bags?

Why can't people accept that some parents, rich or poor are just lazy? They can't be bothered to get up 15mns earlier to prepare a very cheap but healthy breakfast.

They buy what can be just opened and eaten or put in the oven. They can't be bothered with planning meals in advance and cooking from scratch.

[SchrodingersImmigrant]

Talk about dipping deep for excuses! Who said you needed to stock massive bags?
That's nothing. On one thread ,a while ago, someone argued that pulses take too long to cook. Yeah, that is correct. Someone else suggested to soak them overnight (common practice). Answer was 'who could be arsed soaking lentils overnight'.
🤷🏻

[narcdad45]

@froggygoneonakillingspree

Yes this did happen during the pandemic, yes advances were issued without seeing an actual person for several months.

This thread has absolutely nothing to do with UC Advances. But at least you've dropped your insane lie that anyone claiming they had to wait five weeks for (non-advance) UC is "telling porkies."

PIP is a different benefit with different processes.
So? This thread is about poverty and child hunger. The fact disabled people have to wait months to receive benefits is absolutely relevant to explaining why some it's not just "feckless" wasters who spend all their benefit money on flatscreens and fags who struggle to feed their families.

Agreed but it was you who brought UC and a PIP to the thread

Indeed, quite rightly I corrected my statement about the 5 week wait , and have stated that vulnerable families, especially those who had trouble putting food on the table were issued same or next day advances for UC, this is Fact.
How do I know this? Have a think about it, as I won't state my actual job role.

I have corrected myself , however you still seem believe UC is done by owl post 🙄

[silentpool]

I do find it hard to believe that people cannot prepare porridge. However as the sole private tenant in a council block, I have seen levels of apathy that I found unbelievable. For example, I have the only working doorbell. Rather than ring the council to get it fixed, they get people to ring mine and have me stop work and go and answer the door. And then wonder why I get annoyed. So I guess in some ways, it doesn't surprise me.

[narcdad45]

@SchrodingersImmigrant

Maybe the people should learn the needed skills... If someone wants to learn something, they will.

Basically, what I gathered from all these threads is, that there is no solution. Because no matter what, there is always a But.
"People could start using the really cheap ingredient. Not great, but it feeds them"
"But children don't really like porridge and people have no leccy and gas to cook it"
"You can soak it overnight. If someone is hungry, porridge is a good help. Or other cheaper stuff"
"But people can't because they can't store large bag of porridge. And they don't know how to use other ingredients"
And so on.

Basically how it will end is that everyone will have a little victory wank over the likes on their pics with sandwiches they are "feeding the kids ya know" and that's it. 🤷🏻 See you next holidays with exactly the same issue.

The problem here is an overall attitude and the inability to discuss uncomfortable topics without shouting about people who have no spoons to eat with.

Exactly, well said!

[sqirrelfriends]

It's an awful reality that some of children just don't have anyone in their lives to advocate for them effectively.

I think the only solution is to increase SS involvement for all children, more checks to make sure parents are doing what they're meant to, and for removal before the children become too damaged from the experience. This will cost more than extra money for food or parcels/vouchers but will ensure the funding goes straight to the children who need it.

A bit of an extreme example but know someone who fostered a child born to a mother addicted to heroin, he was tiny for his age and had issues with hoarding food because he never knew when he would eat, it also came to light that he had been abused by one of her partners. It took 6 years for him to be removed and when his mother had another baby she was allowed to keep it, eventually the baby was removed as well.

The little boy never got over the abuse and has a lot of issues as an adult, all of it could have been avoided if he was allowed a decent childhood.

[annabelindajane]

Agree with feeding the children in schools so they actually get the food.
Agree with teaching the parents how to cook some basics , homemade soup is cheap and nutritious but suspect 5he parents that for whatever reason don’t feed their children are possibly not candidates for that sort of help .

[FairFridaythe13th]

Looking at the foods being packed on the news last night - it was crisps, biscuits, squash - more snacks than food. These children need proper nutrition.

Our local church/centre used to do patent&child ‘nutrition cookery lessons’ - so for a small amount (£2 I think) they could come and learn how to make a dish and they could sit down and eat it after (with some sides/bread/drinks) and/or take it home. It was run by the local council nutritionists and volunteers and the food was mostly donated by parishioner and local shops. It wasn’t really to teach cookery primarily - it was an activity that filled bellies.

[soffiee]

I think 3 things need to be looked into

1. Are some children always left hungry? In some cases social services need to be involved
   
   
2. Are some children hungry for a short period of time due to change of circumstances in the household when the parents have to wait for the benefits to come through when they've applied for the first time? Maybe universal credit shouldn't take over a month to come though
   
   
3. Is the benefits simply not enough after caps being introduced and households with 2+ children not getting anything? Maybe extra food vouchers should be issued that could only be spent on food to tackle food poverty.
   
   Also with cooking, we are a country where everything is convenience cooking. I used to work with a lady who would bring tinned soup and mention she would pick up a microwaved lasagne from M&S after work to have for tea. This lady lived with her husband and has a nice home, car and expensive clothes. She would wear her Prada and Lv bags to work so to me it seems they could afford food but her husband and her would never cook. I was in a more junior position to her and would cook every night and would take previous nights dinner leftovers to eat at work for lunch or I would get up early to make myself a healthy lunch for that day. When you go for a supermarket shop, you are surrounded by convenience cooking food. Everything is in packets or in freezers for oven. No wonder children who are even fed are fed with baked beans and frozen sausages. I cook from scratch because I was taught by mum to cook and we come from a Mediterranean country where we have loads of healthy recipes. I have a 19 month old and he eats everything we eat, I only separate his portion before I add any seasoning. I have cubes of healthy bone marrows in my freezer I add when I cook soups and stews. My child drinks only water and water is free. I don't feed him with microwaved, tinned and frozen food unless it's fish. I use fresh ingredients and yes I am lucky to be able to afford these but I also find these frozen and microwaved food more expensive than fruit and veg as the convenience food are brought per person.
   
   Schools should be teaching basic life skills such as hygiene, cooking and budgeting if we want to save the next generation.