To largely agree with government guidelines over Covid-19

[Plentyofshit]

I rewatched BJ on Andrew Marr yesterday. I’m afraid that everything he said made sense to me. I agree that there have been big mistakes - but - from what I can see - this hasn’t been the smoothest ride for any European country, particularly those that have been badly hit.

I'm in Liverpool and facing lockdown, I fully agree with the new guidelines.

@lljkk thank you x x the elderly guy was maybe talking from a selfish perspective. My every thought has to be selfless right now. So I’m trying to work out if I’m being selfish to agree with the guidelines? Am I wrong? What am I missing?

Am I truly being dim?

It was utterly heartbreaking to say goodbye to her on Sat - my brother is taking her to her surgery tomorrow. I spent 1 night at her house (checked this was ok with the hospital) , wearing a mask, taking precautions etc. My 18months old son was with me - she was SO happy. My dad died 2 years ago - so she is on her own. Yet, when she left her appointment on Fri, she was visibly shaking. I went to the hospital a few weeks ago with her - it’s a scary place. I’m so worried about what will happen next, but I need to not crumble - stay positive and keep my family going. I’m afraid listening to BJ on Sunday made me feel better, I felt there was hope...

Sorry qbout your mum op, hope everything goes ok

'So I’m trying to work out if I’m being selfish to agree with the guidelines? Am I wrong? What am I missing?'

Yes, I totally understand that to reduce transmission restrictions are needed, yet we've had posters on here bleat on for weeks about 'civil liberties waaah' and thinking the high rate will not mean high deaths for some bizarre reason, even though we've all got very recent first hand experience of that being the case.

Now surpise, surprise Nightingale hospitals are being mobilised, hospitals in the NW are already flat out and this whole thing looks like being worse than the first wave.

I don't blame Government, I blame the Margaret Ferriers of which there are clearly thousands, who couldn't give a toss about social distancing, guidelines or isolating once symptomatic or tested positive.

OP the thing that's helped me is sticking to what I know works. So wear your mask, distance, hand wash and limit contact with other people as much as possible. You're obviously going to be in the car with your Mam so wear a mask to protect her and try and not worry about the overall for now. You've a lot going on.

@GetOffYourHighHorse So pleased your posted - I agree with you wholeheartedly. Margaret Ferriers shocked me more than anything else I heard on Sunday. Best wishes to you too and keep safe.

@RuggerHug thank you - the mask was on in the car! But it’s everything, from touching a door knob - to bringing all my own food/cutlery so I don’t contaminate. Best wishes to you too - and everyone xx

Having watched this : www.itv.com/news/2020-10-12/covid-inside-blackpool-victoria-hospital-where-intensive-care-unit-is-at-full-capacity

I wanted to come back to my post. My mum is one of the kindest, most selfless, inspirational people you could ever wish to meet. Her grandchildren adore her. It’s not as easy as shielding the vulnerable - I need to care for her and not contaminate her or the hospital staff who treat her. Please take care everyone - and see this as a community effort where we all work together, not deny/insult/belittle and criticise each other.

An interesting post:

I see the Track and Trace has been mentioned. The thing about this Government is the obsession with centralisation, not using local resources and thinking they know best and not listening to others.

It was said at the start that T&T should be local. Local people on the ground, who know their community, to trace people. That was ignored but has finally been realised.

It was said that local labs, uni labs, research labs could be involved in the testing, That was ignored in favour of large Lighthouse labs.

They were advised that England had different rates of infection and that we were unlocking parts too early. They ignored that - and now look at the North.

The issue with the Government is that they think that just because someone is telling them something different, then they must be wrong.

Arrogance.

[quote Plentyofshit]@Timekeepspassing - I agree it does do harm, as you are relying on it to protect you, and it doesn’t do its job properly. But my point was - the PPE simply wasn’t there. In the speed to procure it, big mistakes were made. What would the solution have been?[/quote]
To listen to their own Cygnus report and have it stockpiled. Why do you think that devout FOI requests this report isn’t yet released? Because it will highlight the failings? Test and trace isn’t working. My DH has Covid a few weeks ago. As he’d not been many places he was fairly sure where he got it, they weren’t interested. They told him they don’t actually trace it back.

What’s the actual point of giving details then? I haven’t, and won’t, download the NHS app now because I know it’s pointless. And I’m hugely compliant normally as I think this is serious, haven’t seen family since December, had two isolation periods (one in return from travel) second when DH was ill which I fully obeyed, didn’t set foot outside ref house for any reason. But I have zero faith in the decision making of the government. Fact is, other countries have done better and listened to the experts or even managed to win the trust of their population better so that behaviour led to fewer deaths per capita.

Despite FOI requests.

@chomalungma - good post. I had a (less informed!) discussion about this with my DP on Sunday. My view is that things needed to be done very, very quickly. Of course it would be preferable to local authorities e.g Cumbria sound like they have it spot on. However my DM’s local authority are utter rubbish. Would so many different opinions/the amount of communication needed have caused more delays?

@Runssometimes I hope your DH is ok now. From my personal experience the app works for me/my family - and I’m grateful to have it because if my mum. So - my nephew at uni was told to self isolate, my DB has been in contact with him the day before he was told. He therefore didn’t visit my vulnerable DM - and potentially saved her...

She has stage 3 cancer - potentially curable. Surgery today. COVID would have wiped her out.

I'm inclined to agree OP. I've never voted Tory in my life, and probably never will, and will never forgive them over Brexit, but with Covid they are treading a fine balance between protecting peoples health and protecting their jobs, and although some mistakes have been made, Im not convinced a different government would have done better.

@pourmeanotherglass thank you - yes, that’s my feelings entirely.

I loathe this government and I think they are corrupt and self serving I think the mistakes they have made have been colossal - many and copious

• playing with herd immunity iides then lockdown too late to be effective

-Boris shaking hands with Covid patients, ----Track and trace set up privately instead of using local public health teams ( mostly because public health teams almost no longer exist because they were shut down by the Tories) -Cummings fiasco, plus all the other breaches of guidance/law by all the other mps/ government officials too many to list . Mostly unpunished -Not planning and funding properly the return of schools( this is a massive one,), -Ignoring what would be the effect of university return

I also think that given where we are, and within the confines of their self serving unpleasant ideology they are now doing their best to get through with as little damage to health and the economy as they can so what they are doing at the moment is probably the best available to them and to us. Then again we get what we deserve for having voted them in.

@bumblingbovine49 That’s a great post too.

plentyofshit

Firstly i hope your mum is ok

Secondly I don’t think you are missing anything by following the guidelines and doing your best ...like most of us

But the government at times have been fucking useless liars who love a good soundbite

Thats not to say that I believe they aren’t trying...i just think they have been incompetent at times

And for the incredibly hard of thinking people can believe that Mays government would have been better even my dad who loves the tory party (loves maggie, thinks boris is very intelligent and has a soft spot for Theresa) thinks they’ve fucked up at times (hr didn’t say fucked up though)

@RufustheSniggeringReindeer thank you. I think this is what I need to hear. I want to believe most people are following guidelines, and doing their best - despite how rubbish the government have been. I want to believe that the government are at least trying. Its about hope, and I need to hear positivity. That despite all that has gone wrong, we are still working together for the good of the whole. And that we care for the elderly, vulnerable and the people who may really suffer from COVID, and realise the potential implications of our actions. That we need to make sacrifices and forego certain luxury’s - if the knock on effect is to save a life/education/economy.

@Plentyofshit

She has stage 3 cancer - potentially curable. Surgery today. COVID would have wiped her out.

I hope your mum’s treatment goes well and am glad she’s getting it. That’s another mishandling of the government, deprioritising treatment for cancer treatments, hip replacements, transplants and other surgeries.

The charity sector has been decimated - a tiny proportion of the promised bailout actually delivered with research into treatments and services put back years. Right now, Macmillan, BHF and Cancer Research are all being forced to lay off hundreds of staff both in services and fundraising which will have long term impacts for many thousands of people who rely on their services and advancements in research. I work in the sector and I don’t know of any charity not looking at redundancies right now, It’ll be worse next year and when charities can’t be effective then unfortunately the people that rely on them will be let down. Clearly the reasons behind this aren’t entirely the government’s fault but by intervening meaningfully now they could alleviate problems to come. After all the Tory government rely on civil society and charities to pick up the pieces for their policies. But they are being very effective in ensuring that they aren’t getting too criticised for this.

That does break my heart @Runssometimes I was talking with my DP about how to approach Xmas this year, and how we don’t need gifts etc - and to discuss this with DD. A donation to Cancer research instead of gifts makes perfect sense to me. I’ve used the website many times and phoned for advice. But this is just a drop in the ocean for what’s needed. I’m so sorry.

Thats not to say that I believe they aren’t trying...i just think they have been incompetent at times

I think they are arrogant and think they know best - and hate criticism.

Wouldn’t disagree with any of that chomalunga