To think this I should complain - possible sexism in year 4?

[GlummyMcGlummerson]

DD is in year 4, a new girl started at the beginning of term. I've been chatting to her mum in the playground and she said she's painfully shy and a bit worried about fitting in. DD(8) has said that she's tried playing with her in the playground but she doesn't say much and is so shy she often slumps off if there's a group situation.

Anyway, DD told me that all the girls in her class got a house point each yesterday. She said it's because they all, on instruction from the teacher, played with the new girl. I asked was it just the girls and not the boys getting house points? And she said the teacher only asked the girls to play with her because (in the words of the teacher apparently) "the boys aren't sensible enough to play nicely with her".

Now, as a teacher myself (though I teach older teens) I am well aware we have to take what's said at home by children with a huge pinch of salt. But, DD doesn't tend to make things up or embellish, she's very mature for her age. So, let's say we are taking what she says as true - AIBU to think it's sexist that only the girls have to do the care giving and welcoming to other pupils and all of the boys are written of as hopeless? There are quite a number of boisterous boys in the class but also some very friendly, sweet and sensitive boys too.

I have virtual parents evening next week and thinking of raising it. WWYD?

YABU. If a girl is shy and quiet, common sense says she will feel more comfortable with other girls. That is not 'sexism', it's just common sense!! My DD's experience would indicate that you are completely wrong.

So much “common sense” is really engrained sexism. There is on the web a great video done about how engrained this is in U.K. researchers dressed a baby in boy or girl clothes and then asked volunteers to play with the baby. If the baby was dressed as a boy, the people would only grab traditionally “common sense” toys for boys, one even took away a doll and replaced it with a truck. They’d also be more physically active...pick baby up to try a rocking horse. If the baby was dressed as a girl, it was cooing, singing, girl toys.
They interviewed them after and revealed true sex of the baby and after watching themselves, they were all saying Oh my! I had no idea that I was doing that.
I’ll try and find a link....

No, if it was a boy they would have asked the boys.

I’m with you op. It’s depressing how many posters here can’t see the everyday sexism.
Telling boys that they are all too silly to play with girls.
I detest the whole ‘boys will be boys’ attitude. It excuses the boys who misbehave and makes kind/sensitive/shy/quiet/thoughtful boys feel like there is something wrong with them because they don’t wants to crash around all day.

That said I wouldn’t bother the teacher.

“two strong boys”

By secondary this isn't sexism it is reality.

'two strong boys'

Come on. I've worked in education with a mainly female team for years and honestly, no table has been so far too heavy for us to move.

Here is link showing how people without even realising it teach boys and girls to play differently from very young age.
Girl toys vs boy toys: The experiment - BBC Stories
m.youtube.com/watch?v=nWu44AqF0iI

When I was in Y4 the girls played together, and the boys played together. This wasn't necessarily prompted by the teachers, but they will want to direct the new girl more towards people she's more likely get on with and have things in common with .. and that remains the girls.

Most girls around primary juniors are in the mindset of 'yuck, boys!' so what would the point have been in telling the boys to go and play with a shy new girl? It wouldn't be fair to her.

@LindaEllen

When I was in Y4 the girls played together, and the boys played together. This wasn't necessarily prompted by the teachers, but they will want to direct the new girl more towards people she's more likely get on with and have things in common with .. and that remains the girls.

Most girls around primary juniors are in the mindset of 'yuck, boys!' so what would the point have been in telling the boys to go and play with a shy new girl? It wouldn't be fair to her.

How do things ever move forwards if parents are happy for things to be the same as they were thirty years ago?

I find this constant harking back quite depressing.

My children played with girls and boys, if they'd ever said 'yuck' about girls/boys I'd have told them not to be so silly and sexist.

I'd imagine the teacher is basing it on her knowledge of the children in her class, who she teaches every day. I guess she knows if the boys are silly!

It was a totally sensible decision by the teacher under the circumstances.

@Notanotherwooname

And if we repeatedly tell boys they’re not “sensible enough” then they’ll live up to our expectations...

Precisely!

Two of the boys my DD is best friends with and they are far more gentle and sweet and welcoming than at least three of the girls in the class. It's nothing more than a lazy stereotype

@Merryoldgoat

It’s obviously not the biggest issue ever, but it’s little stuff like this from which bigger things grow.

My friend’s son won’t drink out of a cup or bottle if it’s the wrong colour. Asked why we were playing girl’s music at DS’s party (Disney songs from Frozen and Tangled), obsessed with play fighting etc.

I think it’s ridiculous but I’d probably just use the opportunity to drill into my child that boys and girls are capable of the same things and that the teacher was wrong.

Yes exactly, it's not exactly the patriarchy at it's most fierce but these small "drip drip" instances of sexism build up into stereotypes so by the time the kids teach the age I teach you see clear differences in self regard and expectations. It's sad to see, I wouldn't perpetuate this nonsense with my pupils and I don't think we should not challenge sexism because "oh you don't want to be THAT parent"

Odd thing for your daughter to say to the teacher tbh.
A new, painfully shy girl is not, generally speaking, going to open up to boys in quite the same way she would to a group of kind friendly girls. Not sexism.
Interesting the girls had to be praised and given points for being nice though. I might question that element of the event.

I am a teacher.

I would empower my DD to think through if the teacher should have handled it better/differently and discuss it that way. But my DC are well used to me going off about everyday sexism.

My waffling on about everyday sexism has definitely rubbed off as DD pointed out that she thought it was unfair that it was "women's work" 😂 I'm pleased she's taking it in!

@PinkiOcelot

I’m not surprised you didn’t enable voting on this! What a total non issue!

I'm always on the app and it's not an option. I'm not afraid of the voting function

Mine refuses to clear the table when her 89 year old Italian grandmother asks her and her girl cousins to do so, unless the boys get up too. That's sexism.
Expecting little girls to be friendly to other little girls isn't.
Giving them points for being kind is simply bribery and arguably more damaging than any silly comments about boys.

@TheSeedsOfADream

Odd thing for your daughter to say to the teacher tbh. A new, painfully shy girl is not, generally speaking, going to open up to boys in quite the same way she would to a group of kind friendly girls. Not sexism. Interesting the girls had to be praised and given points for being nice though. I might question that element of the event.

I am a teacher.

@TheSeedsOfADream I think you've misread as DD didn't say anything to the teacher about it, just me (with gentle prompting of "Do you play much with the new girl Beth?")

Expecting little girls to be friendly to other little girls isn't

No but assigning "girls jobs", that boys are perfectly capable of doing, because the boys aren't allegedly up to scratch, IS sexism.

Surprised to hear that people's Y4 kids don't play in mixed sex groups. DD is in a small class (14) even split, been that way for years, and they all play with each other (she actually prefers the company of the boys)

Do you think a shy 8 year old girl is going react favourably to a bunch of noisy , marginally bonkers, lads. I guess if she can play football and name every player in the premier league it might work.

@Pyewhacket

Do you think a shy 8 year old girl is going react favourably to a bunch of noisy , marginally bonkers, lads. I guess if she can play football and name every player in the premier league it might work.

Because a girl couldn't possibly have football as an interest

JFC.

It is a bit rubbish OP - my son (yr 3) has so far had all 4 (yes 4!!) new kids purposefully seated next to him over the last 3 weeks and I know it's because the teachers know he's confident and kind - he received an award last year for making a 'Welcome' card for a new kid to the class.
I think I'd be tempted to raise an eyebrow to the teacher and talk to your DD about it, but I wouldn't complain as I see that as more of an issue with the boys' parents imo.

Major overreaction!

It is clearly sexism and is encouraging young children to see it as unusual to have a friend of the other gender. It also conveys messages that poor behaviour is boys should be tolerated while girls have to be nice and self-sacraficing. I would 100% raise it.