Doesn’t want to be on birth certificate

[SendWine]

Without boring you with all the details, I have a 6mth old DS. I am a single mum, was not in a relationship with the dad but when I found out I was pregnant I involved him in the decision and he said he would support me either way and be involved in DS life.
He was supportive during my pregnancy and we even talked about seeing how it goes between us when the baby was born.

However since DS has been born, he has seen him between once/twice a month (he lives just over an hour away), and he always brings his mum and daughter with him so he never has time with DS on his own or has any time on his own with me so as we can talk about raising our child. I’ve asked him to arrange to see him more often, to be more consistent, to see him on his own so he can bond with him and also to support me and to give me a break sometimes. He avoids the conversation and won’t agree to anything. I have not even bought up financial contributions. I have a good job but have obviously had to save hard for my maternity leave and he has not once offered to contribute. He hasn’t even bought any nappies or milk! But I have also not asked him for anything.

We are due to register DS in 2 weeks time (delayed due to COVID). His dad has now turned round and said he doesn’t want to be on the birth certificate... the reason he gave being that ‘he doesn’t wasn’t the csa knocking on his door for MY life choices’!! I am absolutely disgusted. As far as I am concerned he has shown his true colours and I don’t want my son growing up around someone that only cares about himself.

AIBU to think being on the birth certificate is not an option? If you don’t want to be on it, then you are choosing not to be in your sons life.

[NancyBotwinBloom]

Op if he's self employed you can ask the cms to carry out a variation on his income.

I did this, ended up going to court but he didn't show up for any of the hearings.

He didn't provide any of his financial information that the cms or court requested so they looked for a similar job in a similar area and based the new payment on that.

He now owes over £10k.

You may not ever see the money but do not let him get away it.

[prh47bridge]

@SisyphusAndTheRockOfUntidiness

Don't put him on it. There's a current/recent thread by a mum who's having no end of trouble trying to leave her abusive ex behind, but because he's on the BC, he's entitled to see the child/children. Even though he's subjected them (including the child/ren) to terrible abuse. She really regrets putting him on, it's so sad.

I am not familiar with the thread concerned but contact is awarded because he is the father, NOT because he is on the birth certificate. The same contact would have been awarded even if he was not on the birth certificate (assuming there is a court order).

If he has genuinely abused the children and the courts have accepted that the abuse took place it would be very surprising if the courts awarded contact. Unfortunately, some mothers invent allegations of abuse in an attempt to stop contact. I'm not saying this mother has but it means courts have to be cautious and not accept such allegations unless there is good evidence to support them.

[ProfessorSlocombe]

@VampireBill

Why would your employer want to see your birth certificate? I don't even think I've ever seen mine (and I'm 56).

Your employer is required by law to check you are entitled to work in the UK. That means (for a UK citizen) either sight of a passport or birth certificate.

If one of the alphabet agencies comes a-knocking and they can't prove they checked, then the fines can be eye watering £20,000 per employee.

www.gov.uk/prove-right-to-work

[Zaphodsotherhead]

I've just got a question about the DNA testing, which is probably completely stupid but...

if a man has to take a DNA test in order to start paying CMS for a child he doesn't want to pay for - can he just get someone else to provide the sample? The mum may know, absolutely that he is the father, but if he provides a false sample and maintains it's not his child...what happens?

[NandosPeriometer]

If it's the same process as testing a baby's DNA then they have to go to a lab in person and the lab take a photo of the person that they tested.

I know someone who wanted to deny the dad access and tried to get another baby tested instead but the photo gave it away

[NandosPeriometer]

metro.co.uk/2015/06/15/dad-sent-look-alike-to-dna-test-to-avoid-paying-child-support-5246927/

[HattonsMustard]

@blueberrypie0112 our whole system is very different to the US.

It is assumed that if you are married then the child you have given birth to as a Mother is your husband's. Either parent can register the birth alone or go together.

If you are not married then the father of the child has to attend the registration of the birth to put their name on the birth certificate or complete a declaration to agree to be put on.

For my sister who has a wife, they had to use a sperm donor clinic to be able to register both women on the birth certificate as parent 1 and parent 2. If they had used a friend for the sperm donation, then the non-biological parent (I am not saying if my sister or her wife carried the baby) they would have to go through the process of adopting.

I completely agree that in some states the US has got it right re child support that they can lose their driving license and be put in prison. It really should happen here considering the CMS is being sued for incompetence.

[TheRosariojewels]

Your poor son deserves better OP and you have every right to feel angry. Obviously, you can't make him be on the birth certificate. It doesn't feel fair that he gets to be in your son's life without wanting to acknowledge and take on his full responsibility as a parent. However, for the sake of your son I would continue to let him be in your son's life. You don't want your son to grow up and blame you for not having a relationship with his father.

[HyacynthBucket]

[fjordfiestas]
Do employers actually want to see a birth certificate now? I would have thought that died with the ark, and certainly will not be a requirement in the digital future.

[SweetPetrichor]

I think this is fair enough IF he opts out of the child’s life. I believe that since the choice to abort or keep is entirely the woman’s (rightly), then men should be allowed an equal opportunity to opt out. As women, we can choose whether having the child is right for us. Men don’t get that option, and I think that’s unfair. I would judge any man for not wanting an unplanned baby, just as I wouldn’t judge any woman who chose to abort. Seems fair. But equally he can’t have his cake and eat it...if he wants to be part of the child’s life, then he should be contributing.

[pooopypants]

OP stop merging things - maintenance, access and BC are three different things. Comments like "if he wants to see his child, I'll definitely be making a claim!" blur the lines and they're not related. As someone said upthread, these are separate issues. He can be made to pay maintenance without seeing your child, he can be on the BC without you claiming maintenance (as many PP stated, he would need to attend the appointment with you).


Take a step back and think of your child - get him registered, submit a CMS claim and don't encourage contact - he sounds like a Disney Dad anyway so I'm sure Amy contact will fizzle out anyway, just let it run its course. That way you know that your conscience is clear and he was the one who stopped bothering

[SunbathingDragon]

If he is refusing, then you can’t make him and he will have to stay off. However, he has made his feelings clear and I would be doing a CSA claim today (the birth certificate is irrelevant, as he will soon find out when he is asked to do a DNA test).

[BilboBercow]

Great he's just given away his parental rights and let's face it, he's a terrible father anyway. Go to CSA immediately. He's an idiot who doesn't even know he'll still be responsible unless he proves he's not the father.
Make him pay. You've been nice so far, now he's fucked it.

[beachedwhales]

I'd be glad not to have anybody else on my DCs birth certificate if it was purely about me. You can get maintenance without it anyway.

[beautifulmonument]

I was in a somewhat similar situation to you OP 14 years ago when DS1 was a baby. Back then I cared about DS1 having his father's surname, his name on the birth certificate, getting child maintenance payments, visits etc. I'm glad now that none of that ever happened. We have nothing to do with the father (100% his choice not mine) and life is good. I'm so glad I don't have to have anything to do with him as it would have been a nightmare over the years.

[paperandfireworks]

"The only thing I will say, is if he's not on the birth certificate and you go for maintenance they will more than likely request a dna test, once that's done you can be made to put him on the birth certificate unless he signs away all his parental rights and I believe if he does that you aren't entitled to anything off him."

Total nonsense. They will not "more than likely request a DNA test". If the father wants one, he organises and pays for it. You are always entitled to the maintainence, signing all your parental rights away isnt an option for the father here

[FlumpetCrumpet]

The only time I have ever needed to produce my birth certificate was the first time I applied for a passport (aged around 12 I think?). My DS had a passport by 6 months and I don't expect to ever have to use his BC again now he has a passport (maybe school admissions?).

I realise that in cases where there is a dispute between parents about rights and responsibilities then it has a significance but in all other circumstances it seems to me to be a fairly useless document that at best sits in a drawer for decades gathering dust. Certainly no need for hysterics about "but what would an employer think when they see a blank space on a birth certificate / The vicar would never come to tea if they knew, how embarrassing".

[Coyoacan]

I am not familiar with the thread concerned but contact is awarded because he is the father, NOT because he is on the birth certificate

Parental rights go with the birth certificate

[Shmithecat2]

I've YABU'd you as this is what happens when you're not married to the father when you have a baby.

However, as has been said, he is absolutely liable for CSA payments. Sort that claim out ASAP!

[FizzyGreenWater]

Well he's done you a favour. As others have said, you need to turn around your thinking on the birth certificate. It isn't so much about him giving you/your child the 'gift' of his acknowledgement... it's MUCH more about YOU giving him parental rights that, quite frankly, could turn out to make your life much, much more difficult if your relationship breaks down.

If I were not married to the father of my child, no way would I automatically put them on the birth certificate. And no way would I ever consent to my child not sharing my surname - the very idea of that when I were definitely gonig to be main and only carer - LOL. I'm glad to see you're definite on that one!

Don't engage with him now at all. Register the baby quietly with the names you want, and if he changes his mind and wants to be there, say no. Or even change the date and don't tell him if easier - just make damn sure he's not on that BC. You're lucky this happened!

Needless to say, also don't tell him that him being on the BC makes no difference to CSA/maintenance. You say he's self-employed, it's probably likely you'll get little anyway. Register your baby, then make a claim. For those saying he should have the option to opt out - um, no. Men get the option to make sure they aren't fathering babies they don't want to support financially at the point where they choose to wear a condom or not. Simple as.

But - maintenance and contact are separate things. It's undoubtedly in your child's interest to have a committed relationship with their dad. But.. ONLY if he's committed. So while I don't agree with the knee-jerk 'If he isn't going to pay maintenance he isn't seeing him' - I think that really you're probably saying something quite different and something more understandable... ie, if he's going to see himself as 'not committed' and intends to drop in and out when he fancies playing daddy every now and again - then no, a flat no. That definitely is NOT in your son's best interests.

But make sure you separate the two. Start the claim, let that run on its own. Refuse to discuss it with him.

Then, contact. What does he envisage? What is his idea of a relationship? If it's a vague 'Oh I'll try and come down every few weeks' - then you're well within your rights to say - sorry, no. You're not going to play Weird Uncle who comes with presents. And you are not going to dictate the terms either - there will be no 'Keep the weekends free this month because I might feel like coming down.. .oh sorry, can't now, something's popped up.' You are either a dad to him, or you are not. Contact doesn't have to be every week, but it has to be - consistent, committed, and FATHERLY - with a view to him taking responsibility at an appropriate pace, which will ultimately end in your DS staying over when he is older, regularly.

If he balks at that and wants it free and easy - nope. See you in Court if you want to argue that you should be allowed to see him when you fancy and let him down at will. If he's responsive and willing to talk it through - then talk.

[Elsewyre]

@SendWine

Without boring you with all the details, I have a 6mth old DS. I am a single mum, was not in a relationship with the dad but when I found out I was pregnant I involved him in the decision and he said he would support me either way and be involved in DS life.
He was supportive during my pregnancy and we even talked about seeing how it goes between us when the baby was born.

However since DS has been born, he has seen him between once/twice a month (he lives just over an hour away), and he always brings his mum and daughter with him so he never has time with DS on his own or has any time on his own with me so as we can talk about raising our child. I’ve asked him to arrange to see him more often, to be more consistent, to see him on his own so he can bond with him and also to support me and to give me a break sometimes. He avoids the conversation and won’t agree to anything. I have not even bought up financial contributions. I have a good job but have obviously had to save hard for my maternity leave and he has not once offered to contribute. He hasn’t even bought any nappies or milk! But I have also not asked him for anything.

We are due to register DS in 2 weeks time (delayed due to COVID). His dad has now turned round and said he doesn’t want to be on the birth certificate... the reason he gave being that ‘he doesn’t wasn’t the csa knocking on his door for MY life choices’!! I am absolutely disgusted. As far as I am concerned he has shown his true colours and I don’t want my son growing up around someone that only cares about himself.

AIBU to think being on the birth certificate is not an option? If you don’t want to be on it, then you are choosing not to be in your sons life.

When you say you involved him in the decision does that mean you told him you were keeping it or did you genuinely only decide to because of his support?

[mumwon]

You may have to prove right of residence & to work in this country so therefore have to provide proof of ID
I doubt anybody would turn a hair or even bother on thinking or looking at/ about non id of father these days

[mam0918]

thing is you can just get a court ordered DNA test and get CSA anyway

your probably best off not though, that would possibly allow him to seek custody/visitation/parental rights etc... and you likely better off as a strong single mother not risking losing your control and to put up with a selfish asshole

[VeniceQueen2004]

Kids are better off without half arsed dads. Tell him that's fine, that son probably isn't even his anyway, and never contact him or respond to contact again. If he pursues contact he can go through the courts and request a DNA test. IF he goes through all that, it would show he gave enough of a damn about his child to deserve to be in his life. On current evidence he doesn't care at all, and so would be a worse than useless influence.

When your son is older you can explain to him that families come in many shapes, and your is your little team of two. As long as you are consistent and there for him, he'll be better off in that scenario than having to put up with semi-neglect from his deadbeat Dad who only puts in an appearance when it suits him.

[VeniceQueen2004]

And don't claim CSA. Why bother? There are umpteen ways any man with half a brain can avoid paying it, and it just gives him an 'in'.