To destroy my son's phone?

[WeakandWobbly]

My 13yo ds has had a mobile for exactly one year. He has ASD. Over the course of the year he has become more and more fixated on it. He rarely has calls or online chats with friends. He gets up as early as 6.30am to play space games and watch YouTube bloggers talking about rockets, which is his special interest.
He gave up scouts, and he gave up drama club. Now he has no hobbies, doesn't leave the house at all on weekends, , and won't help out around the house. 99% of the arguments and fights (and I mean him shoving me, kicking me, shouting abuse at me, breaking things) occurs when my dh and I try to enforce boundaries on usage.
We think we have been very reasonable in that he can have his phone before school, he is banned - by the school-- from having it in school so he doesn't take it. In the evening he will not engage with anyone nicely until it's 7.30pm when the phone has to be handed in. He often hides it, refuses to hand it over, keeps the password secret and so on. Our family life has, been destroyed... And don't get me started on lockdown hell
My DD age 11 also has a phone, but we don't have any problems with her.
This weekend was particularly bad where ds was kicking me and spitting at me, calling me a lunatic, threw water in my face, because my efforts to control phone usage he sees as bullying.
I was thinking of asking the local constabulary to pop in and 'seize' his phone and destroy it. That way he cannot target us parents over it.
YABU: kids need to have a phone
YANBU: chuck the thing out and get your sanity back

Sorry I don't know how to do the voting buttons on my phone. I'm fuming too much!!

Is it possible to change the times he has his phone? So if he does his homework after school he gets it at 7.30 to 9 for example? So it becomes more like a reward (giving it to him) than a punishment (removing it)?
I would do anything until you get that 10% moment of reasonableness and then agree boundaries together. I have no experience of teenagers or autism - just offering a potentially different solution and apologies if it is a shit one! for you - it sounds tough.

@petingo

Children do not need and should not have a mobile phone that can do more than make and receive voice calls.

Bollocks. I don't want a phone that can only do those things myself. I'm using mine now in fact.

I wanted my teenagers to be able to text and WhatsApp me when they were out toom

I think lots of people have no idea of how extreme the behaviour of someone with ASD can be. I think however that removing the phone completely will not be helpful and is also unfair on a teen. Many, many children use phones at this age and are otherwise uncommunicative with their families.
Think about picking your battles and adopt perhaps a similar policy to those of Neuro typical teens.
Phone not allowed at school - school rule
Phone not allowed overnight - health rule - not good to use phones when should be sleeping
The only other option for controlling use without getting into a fight about handing it over would be to control via wifi. If he gets aggressive about handing it over, turn off wifi at times he is not allowed.
Encourage a compliance without confrontation so a place where phone can be left by him at these times.
Talk to him when he is calm.
Be really clear with him that the aggressive behaviour is intolerable and that you will call the police if he is violent and that help will be sought through the school. Discuss with him what he will do when he begins to feel angry ie goes to his room and stays there until he is calmer.

too

@WeakandWobbly

I hope you are ok, I don't think a lot of people understand ASD obsession and how the fixate on something.

We've had to remove ds Xbox at one point because of this. And at another bag up all his footballs because he was heavy duty on them no one was to touch wouldn't go anywhere without etc.

I can also see what you are attempting when you mention the police and trying to distance yourself from being the one who takes it.

I agree with the removing it, once these things start having an impact on the rest of the family you need to remove.

Sorry I don't have much in the way of suggestions but just wanted to say your not alone

YANBU.
OP, I've heard that you can get phones designed for pensioners that can support essentials like whatsapp etc but have a shitty screen and no gaming or browser access, see if you can find something similar?
I really think it's time we had a non-addictive smartphone designed that is just for communication and orientation, supporting google maps and messaging apps, but without access to time eaters like games, videos, the internet, and social media. These pensioner phones are ok but not quite perfect from what I've heard - but they might be a good middle ground for your son. Nokia apparently have some. Have a look and see what you can find!

I don’t have anywhere near as much experience as you, so I may be completely wrong, but do you think that his phone usage might calm his anxiety? His screen time might be a way of dealing with how his brain works, and decompressing. Taking the phone away might make him feeling panicky.
I’m not saying you shouldn’t take it away, just that seeing things from his point of view might help find a way of dealing with it.

@Ohalrightthen

Getting the police to come and take your son's phone away!? Ridiculous overreaction and a gross misuse of stretched resources. Jesus wept.

Just take it yourself. No need to destroy it either, that's another overreaction and pretty wasteful. Cancel the contract, remove the device, replace with brick for emergencies.

^ This

YABU. Some of his behaviour sounds incredibly challenging, but that's not a reason to respond with bad behaviour of your own.

I'm autistic. I didn't have a phone as a teenager but I used to get up early to use the computer or watch TV. School was incredibly difficult, so I hated the idea of having to just get up, get ready and go, with nothing else in my morning. When I got home I'd be mentally drained and in no mood for social interaction with family for at least a couple of hours.

The phone may be a coping strategy, and the fact that he sees you taking it away as 'bullying' indicates this. Limiting his time on it is sensible. Taking it away altogether seems unkind, and destroying it incredibly petty. The shouting and hitting should be dealt with separately, I think. That's not acceptable behaviour. But the teenage years are when most young people pull away from family life a bit anyway, and for autistic people they're often when the social deficit becomes more pronounced by comparison to their peers, and things like school or clubs become a lot more challenging. The phone is an easy, visible symbol to put all this on, but I suspect there's much more going on. (I was never, ever violent or aggressive, but my dad still used to say he hated my computer and my niche interests.)

You need to take it away and replace with a brick phone. Involve the police if/when he acts. You can't ask them to seize his phone anyway as they have no legal grounds to do that. You have patenting responsibility and can do it.

What are you expecting your autistic teenager to do in this time period if he isn't allowed his screen?

Autism pre-dates smart phones by quite some margin. The OP is to be applauded for trying to get her son to engage with life outside of a screen.

No autistic child “needs” a device, and more than a NT child does.

Loving the minimising of DV on this thread. Strangely punches and kicks dont hurt less just because they are being delivered by a teenager.

OP do what you need to do - including calling the police if you fear for your safety. One thing you could consider is using one of the parenting apps to regulate phone usage. This might depersonalise the "off" periods enough to avert an angry reaction and he wouldnt need to physically hand the phone over.

He does need some downtime though, esp straight after school, and there are worse things he could be doing than watching videos about space.

Jeez...All the Smug Mugs saying ''Parent your child'' probably haven't seen a violent child in action.

Until a friend adopted a DD I too had thought that sensible boundaries would be the way to go.

Friend had to call the police, and they DID take it seriously, they were great.

Enraged children can be extremely strong, and boys more so.

Having seen friend's DD in action {her other children were fine} I was astounded at the Whirlwind of fury.

@WeakandWobbly I don't envy you at all. Call the police if your son assaults you or trashes the house.

Good luck.

@Porcupineinwaiting

Loving the minimising of DV on this thread. Strangely punches and kicks dont hurt less just because they are being delivered by a teenager.

OP do what you need to do - including calling the police if you fear for your safety. One thing you could consider is using one of the parenting apps to regulate phone usage. This might depersonalise the "off" periods enough to avert an angry reaction and he wouldnt need to physically hand the phone over.

He does need some downtime though, esp straight after school, and there are worse things he could be doing than watching videos about space.

Agree wholeheartedly. Also think that vids about space are a lot less worrying than other nastier or more vacuous vids. The app sounds a good idea.

Some of you are being unnecessary harsh. I used to work with adults with learning disabilities and challenging behaviour. The violence is terrifying. We would at times have to involve the police even with our training

I'm just here to say the comments about do your parenting are extremely unreasonable. You are setting boundaries, and clearly your parenting is working well for your daughter

Absolutely these comments. Jeez, you always get the people on here who seem to think it you are just firm enough that will do the trick and he'll quieten. As if all it takes is a firm calm voice.

It's just not like this. He's 13 so he's probably quite big now. And he's prepared to physically assault you when you assert boundaries. It must be terrifying. Of course OP feels family life is being destroyed! Who wouldn't?

@Nomorepies

You need to be tough and keep enforcing it every time. But please don't contact the police. They don't do this and and have enough going on.

They will and do come round if a parent is worried about violence to themselves or criminals damage.

What matters more...Someone being beaten by their child {DV is DV} or shoplifting?

Weak first of all, I think posting in AIBU about a child with ASD just leads to being battered about your 'bad parenting' without anyone understanding how difficult it is.

Second- have you tried a visual barter system with him?
Have you heard of token economy e.g he earns a token for each job he does around the house and he exchanges them for phone time.

That way, instead of him automatically getting the phone, he has to earn it.
It depends on what level of ASD he has, how well he adapts to it.

Tighter restrictions for bad behaviour? My kids get a ban on their phone if they are rude or have behaved badly in some way. Hit them where it hurts! Also I notice behaviour greatly improved by less screen time.

@MaskingForIt

Autism pre-dates smart phones by quite some margin. The OP is to be applauded for trying to get her son to engage with life outside of a *screen.

I was only asking, I wasn't suggesting it was the wrong thing to do. Genuine question was all.

No autistic child “needs” a device, and more than a NT child does.

I don't disagree.

@Ohalrightthen

Getting the police to come and take your son's phone away!? Ridiculous overreaction and a gross misuse of stretched resources. Jesus wept.

Just take it yourself. No need to destroy it either, that's another overreaction and pretty wasteful. Cancel the contract, remove the device, replace with brick for emergencies.

I think this is a it strong!

He has physically attacked you, so if you feel you want the Police to speak to him, I don’t see the problem with that. Definitely remove the phone though, undoubtedly. I hope things start to improve for you.

Try the parenting apps which limit time. You can allow them to make calls to specified numbers while not being able to do anything else with the phone at the same time.
I’d also set out expectations of what he needs to do during no phone time eg chores, homework, exercise, activities. Talk to him to come up with something together
I wish you luck. It is really difficult

I was thinking of asking the local constabulary to pop in and 'seize' his phone and destroy it. That way he cannot target us parents over it.

FGS get a grip. If you want to take the phone away then take it away but this is pathetic nonsense.

@neversayalways

Some of you are being unnecessary harsh. I used to work with adults with learning disabilities and challenging behaviour. The violence is terrifying. We would at times have to involve the police even with our training

I'm just here to say the comments about do your parenting are extremely unreasonable. You are setting boundaries, and clearly your parenting is working well for your daughter

Absolutely these comments. Jeez, you always get the people on here who seem to think it you are just firm enough that will do the trick and he'll quieten. As if all it takes is a firm calm voice.

It's just not like this. He's 13 so he's probably quite big now. And he's prepared to physically assault you when you assert boundaries. It must be terrifying. Of course OP feels family life is being destroyed! Who wouldn't?

Agree 100%

Putting a large and strong testosterone fuelled teen ''on the naughty step'' isn't going to work.

This is not ''normal'' behaviour.

Do people not think that the OP has not tried being 'firm'? It is very easy to be smug unless one has no experience of a strong problematic teen.

I used to volunteer at RDA, and a rider there was liable to get into a violent rage...Luckily never on the pony {Ironically the ''Naughtiest'' pony behaved well for her}
But there would be scenes as she was being taken home.. and it wasn't pleasant to witness...She was incredibly strong.

OP get professional help

Can you not install a parental control app whereby you can set the limits of his phones internet in times sessions. Explain to him that this is the first level of control as he is unable to self regulate. If things escalate just cancel the contract or report it stolen to block the phone, no need to destroy the handset.