To think why this is one of the reasons we have an obesity problem.

[Delamalama]

Friend on facebook has put about 2 stone on this past year. She posted a selfie the other day with a statement saying how she's finally learning to love herself, she may not be perfect but it's her body and she loves it!!! She's on the verge of being obese and suffers with chronic backache. Of course she had comments saying 'looking good hun' 'you beauty!' Etc.

I've noticed quite a lot of younger ones doing this 'be fat and proud' crap.

Am I wrong to think that this along with many other things is why we have an obesity problem.

You say she's on 2 stone, but maybe she's someone who's been at a different weight and hated herself, or had to engage in unhealthy habits to stay that way. Maybe the weight gsi is made up of muscle because she finally enjoys working out, or her just not starving herself. Who knows? Definitely not us! The Facebook post might be 'in your face'/smug but she's not wrong for feeling that way because in your eyes she's heavier!

Also it isn't 'people like her' fuelling the obesity crisis. There's actually a correlation between the introduction of diets themselves and rise of obesity. Who knew? Well the proper nutritionists who regularly advise that anything that's in short supply our bodies will want - it's literally how we're wired as humans for survival. Diets foster a diet/binge and then weight cycling effect through making some foods 'bad' or in effect scarce to ourselves. Just watch someone who has 'fallen off' a diet go straight to mainlining whatever food it was they wanted but couldn't have. Or eating their 'last blow out' it's normal but people with a healthy attitude to food don't eat in that way because they don't need to.

There are other reasons besides obesity why people might need or choose to wear larger-size clothes. I look pregnant in normal-sized clothes because of fibroids, so prefer to wear larger-size ones. As I don't have other symptoms, I prefer not to have major surgery, and the doctor agrees with that. I would not like larger sized clothes to be made unavailable to 'punish' the overweight - and punish me too!

For whatever this is worth, I just messaged a doctor friend asking how much of a strain she thinks overweight people put on the NHS. She said drunk people are far more of a drain, and more abusive to staff.

A few points:

(1) I think that, though people tend to focus just on diet, reduction in everyday physical activity is one major cause of increased obesity. In the past, most people HAD to engage in far more physical activity at work and at home; and this has reduced due to technology. Now, don't get me wrong: I think that technology is excellent for keeping distant people in touch with each other; for making life manageable for people with disabilities; for dealing with crises like the present one; and for many other purposes. I'm no Luddite, nostalgia lover, or fan of people 'roughing it' when they don't have to. But it sometimes goes to extremes which mean almost no physical activity.

(2) Giving up dieting (at least for the time being) and accepting yourself when overweight, can be a little bit like stopping taking a medicine that is having side-effects worse than the illness. One may agree or disagree about whether the treatment is really worse than the disease, but giving up or interrupting treatment is not the same thing as thinking that the illness is great!

(3) Although people can certainly be shamed for smoking and drinking, it is not as ubiquitous as fat-shaming, Children will often bully others (even those who are not fat, but have annoyed them in some way) by calling them 'Fatso', 'Fat pig', 'Fat cow', etc. They don't usually choose 'smoker' or 'drunk' as the first insult that comes to their mind. And admiration is certainly sometimes given to people who can 'hold their liquor' or through drinking become the 'life and soul of the party'.

(4) Before getting too self-righteous about how people's bad habits in general, and overeating in particular, may overburden the NHS: we should remember that those who live very healthy lifestyles are the most likely to end up in that group that costs the NHS the most: the very elderly. I am certainly NOT suggesting that people should seek to die young to save costs for the NHS!!!! But the idea that those with unhealthy lifestyles (or lifestyles judged to be unhealthy) are automatically greater burdens on the NHS than the healthy is a rather questionable one.

The reason we have an obesity epidemic is the relentless advertising and supply of unhealthy food. If banning adverts for cigarettes worked to reduce smoking, then imagine how effective banning bad food adverts could be.

But the other issue is that it is generally easier to give up something altogether than to cut down consuming it to 'reasonable' levels. This is why alcoholics are advised to not drink at all. We have to eat to survive, so you can't cut out food altogether, or at least not for long! It is MUCH harder to reduce your eating than to give up cigarettes or alcohol.

@Jaxhog

The reason we have an obesity epidemic is the relentless advertising and supply of unhealthy food. If banning adverts for cigarettes worked to reduce smoking, then imagine how effective banning bad food adverts could be.

But the other issue is that it is generally easier to give up something altogether than to cut down consuming it to 'reasonable' levels. This is why alcoholics are advised to not drink at all. We have to eat to survive, so you can't cut out food altogether, or at least not for long! It is MUCH harder to reduce your eating than to give up cigarettes or alcohol.

Really?! As a smoker I'd rather cut down on food than get withdrawal symptoms from stopping smoking.

Have you ever actually seen an alcoholic having withdrawal symptoms? It's a horrible thing to witness and very, very unpleasant for the person.

I've been on many diets and have never suffered with withdrawal symptoms from food. I'd maybe get a little crabby and hungry but that is it.

That was supposed to say 'as an ex smoker'

@gwenneh but can you see how misleading your earlier post was without all the additional info re your health?

I don't judge people based on their weight.

While I didn't take offence and understood what you meant by your rebuttal, I'd argue that from your stance on this - and other - weight loss threads that whether you recognise or not you DO judge people based on their weight

@Marmitecrackers I've yet to come across an accident that with a little thought couldn't have been prevented! Most are due to people overestimating their ability to undertake a particular physical task safely! There's whole long threads on here "the stupidest accident you've ever had" and there are very amusing stats articles on the phenomenon.

You seem to be trying to make out you're completely perfect and never do ANYTHING Likely to cause you to become ill or hurt! I call bullshit!

One point at which the weight went on very easily was after my car accident which left me disabled - an accident in which my car and I were stationary!

I need to go under 1000 to lose like a pps comment to a similar post, that strongly suggests to me, if completely accurate, that there's a medical issue at play!

@ddl1 Absolutely all the "labour saving" devices and automation at work will have had a huge impact. The families that take part on the social history programmes "back in time for..." often comment - especially the girls and women who are ACTUALLY experiencing the difference daily whereas the boys/men aren't ACTUALLY working at the coal face or whatever - that it's exhausting sweeping floors, beating carpets, kneading bread etc

Agree also on the ubiquitous nature of fat insults

@Jaxhog totally agree on advertising too - especially the way some High fat and/or high sugar items have long been and still are marketed as "healthy" eg lucozade we need much tighter controls or outright banning on that. Don't even get me started on "energy drinks" generally!

I have barely slept for 2 weeks when stopping smoking. God. The worst experience ever. The. Worst. For me so far. I had every single withdrawal symptom and more. Ugh. Still get chill in my spine remembering it. 😐

Perhaps it's more accurate to say that tobacco, alcohol etc can be abstained from because they aren't essential to life, the same is not true of food.

@Graphista

Perhaps it's more accurate to say that tobacco, alcohol etc can be abstained from because they aren't essential to life, the same is not true of food.

But no one is "addicted" to all kinds of food...

@SchrodingersImmigrant actually there's starting to be evidence that suggests that could well be a factor

• that the parts of the brain involved in addiction may also be involved in regulation of food intake

@Graphista what, exactly, about my posts even referred to other people, let alone judged them?

I think people are free to choose to be fat

People are also free to feel good about themselves, whatever their appearance

Yes, obesity is normal now. I can’t get upset about it, it’s nothing to do with me. People make their choices.

And so what if it’s a burden on the nhs? Maybe we need to move to privatised healthcare (German model. Or Scandinavia model, not US style) and people can just pay more insurance depending on their lifestyle choices

people probably have varying levels of the hunger hormone ghrelin. different people have different levels of all other hormones.

@fallfallfall Ghrelin is largely controlled by our eating habits. It doesn't take many days to change the times and frequency of ghrelin release.

Private/public share health care payment model would be a sensible step. We have to force everyone to shoulder some of the responsibility and some of the cost of the lifestyle choices they make. I know, I am a bit of a health nerd and would be sensible, but I wouldn't want to be bunched into a cohort with obese people just to improve their averages.

@ShebaShimmyShake

The idea of a friend of mine posting this kind of crap on a message board about me is enough to turn my stomach.

You really don't sound like much of a friend at all, and I would feel deeply uncomfortable about you having access to my social media content. I think you should do the decent thing and remove your connection to her.

Wouldn't surprise me if friends like this are a reason why the woman in question feels the need to make a public statement about her self-acceptance.

Exactly!

Is.the OP's friend saying she is proud of herself for her weight gain or that she acknowledgement is a bit tubby but is an ok person with n spite of it? There is a difference

When you consider that fat people.are.looked.down upon is it any wonder that.we.feel.the need for people.to.affirm we.are.not worthless ?

Re: many cases of obesity being a form of disordered.eating I agree. I met the criteria pretty much for BED and didn't get much help from NHS.for.it so tried Overeaters Anon and am finding it reAlly helpful. I am learning how to eat to live rather than as a way to either soothe myself or give myself a high . Gone from size 28/30 to 24

@gwenneh sorry wasn't meaning you meant @Eckhart but forgot to make the differentiation

@Graphista thanks for clarifying!

@Graphista

My stance on this and other threads is that low carb diets can help with weight loss. No idea where you're getting the idea that I judge people based on their weight. I judge diets, and I spot BS.

@Delamalama I've been on many diets and have never suffered with withdrawal symptoms from food. I'd maybe get a little crabby and hungry but that is it.

Funnily enough a few days after I gave up processed sugar, I went through several days of the worst diarrhoea. I felt absolutely fine but within minutes of eating or drinking anything I needed the toilet. Presumably I picked up a tummy bug but I do wonder if it was a reaction to just suddenly removing processed sugar from my diet. My ex-husband is an alcoholic and I've lived thorough many a withdrawal attempt of his, many of which have put him in hospital and it did feel a little similar. Emphasis on little.

As someone who has lived with an alcoholic and witnessed so much of their absolute worst and as someone who has experienced sugar addiction, I can see both the similarities and differences. The big one obviously, is that sugar addiction doesn't change your personality to the point where someone becomes violently craven. Giving up sugar cold turkey, won't put you in the hospital, cause brain damage or kill you.

And while it can be argued that it's harder to give up bad food, because you can't go cold turkey and still have to eat. I'd argue that can be a benefit. When an alcoholic stops drinking the habit itself is very hard to change. On top of the very, very real chemical addiction, they are left without their social outlet or the relaxing feeling of a beer or 10 in front of the tv at night. When I switched from eating sugary foods to eating healthily, I still got to maintain the same habits. I didn't feel the loss of meal times or snacks. I just changed what I was having. I got to immerse my mind in healthy aspects of food. Experiment with cooking, baking healthy treats. I don't do it much anymore but when I was first losing weight, I was constantly baking brownies out of beans and dates, or making custard tarts out of oats and dates. Which I'd then eat for breakfast with greek yoghurt and berries. I let myself be completely indulged but in a positive way. I lost nothing but excess body fat. You can't do that with other kinds of substance abuse.

Experiment with cooking, baking healthy treats. I don't do it much anymore but when I was first losing weight, I was constantly baking brownies out of beans and dates, or making custard tarts out of oats and dates

The thing is, there's nothing wrong with an actual, nice-tasting brownie made out of actual chocolate, sugar, butter.

There's just an issue if you're eating them every day.

I steer my clients well away from "healthy" baking. Food is supposed to taste good. No one in the history of the world has ever made a black bean brownie that tastes as good as an actual brownie.

Everything in moderation. Not trendy but true.

I think a lot of people who feel fat people aren't somehow trying enough not only misunderstand how hard it is to lose a significant amount of weight.. But more than that how difficult it is to keep it off long term and not drift back. I say that as someone who lost 6 stone at one point, but put 5 back on.. And I would probably struggle (if honest, though I am about to start trying again) to lose 5lbs now as my heart just isn't in it. It's not a one time deal. And as mentioned before I have to deal with my weakness (food) every single day of my life. A drug addict, a smoker, an alcoholic does not have to ingest their poison but at the same time maintain sobriety every day. If I am to be successful I do.