To not allow my 17 year old daughter to go on holiday with her boyfriend and their parents?

[cinderelly]

Hi my 17 year old daughter met her first boyfriend on twitter in June 🙈 Once lockdown was restricted they met up and have been quite intense ever since. Constant weekly dramas. We have asked to meet him but she kept making excuses. We didn't mind and just put it down to nerves. She started spending more time with him and she met his parents on 10th September. Since then - 11 days ago - they have been for 2 meals and the parents have joined too. I thought this was really sweet and asked when we could all meet. The red flags started after their 2nd meal - 5 days after meeting them for the first time - they asked her to go on holiday to gran canaria in December (her 18th). I was so shocked. We have never met them, I dont even know their full names and apart from being angry that they didnt broach the subject with her parents first, my initial reaction was "that is weird". Obviously she was flattered and was annoyed at my reaction. The next day I explained how I felt and thought she understood. I explained that i think it was too soon but would like to meet them. She was very defensive and eventually admitted that she was worried that we wouldn't get along. I tried to put her mind at rest and eventually backed off. I'm in no hurry and felt the holiday suggestion might have just been an off the cuff comment and assumed it would blow over. On Friday night the parents joined them again on a night out (the lad can't seem to go anywhere without them!) This time was to a bar in the city centre. My daughter text me at 11pm asking if she could stay over in their house. Again, bad cop here I said no. They dropped her off in a taxi about half an hour later and I used the chance to say hello and introduce myself. I was met by a very drunk and hostile mother. My daughter was drunker than id expected and the only thing the mother said to me was "shes had a drink ok!" My defenses went up immediately, so I just said "Really!" walked away and shut the door. I immediately realised why she was keen for us not to meet. Since then (Friday) they have booked a villa - apparently assumed she was going - still not attempted to get in touch with us - despite us knocking at their house on Sunday evening after (reluctantly) letting my daughter visit Sunday afternoon. She came home from college tonight absolutely sobbing her heart out because her boyfriend has 'flipped' saying we are too controlling and she should just go because she is 18.
I am absolutely flabbergasted. My blood is boiling and I find this whole scenario totally unreasonable of the parents. They have made no attempt to meet us and just seem to be poking for a reaction. Is it just me? I really feel like she needs protecting and I'm really sceptical about the parents intentions. Please help!?!?

@oliversmumsarmy
I love this approach 👏

I just wanted to mention a couple of things.

1. Your dd is nearly an adult and will shortly be on her own making serious decisions about her life. I don't think you are taking this into account. You are still treating her like a small child, giving her permission to visit people on a Sunday afternoon. If these people and her bf are not safe people for her to be around, you want her to develop the right instincts to notice that herself.

2. At the moment you are taking on the role of forbidding her and, as a lot of people have said, you run the risk of her rebellion sending her into his arms. My sister married a psychopath because my mother forbade it.

All these comments saying the daughter is an adult, or nearly so, seem to ignore the fact that this is her FIRST boyfriend ever and she met him on Twitter a couple of months ago. She barely knows him and is not experienced in relationships at all, yet easily half PP would send her off on her merry way with this deeply odd and worrying family they've never met.

I agree with the poster who said this is one way to introduce young women to abusive and unsuitable relationships - to nurture them when the girl is young, impressionable and doesn't know any better.

I wouldn't be sending her either, OP, and while I understand you can't really go around forbidding things, you can certainly make it clear you won't be paying any money towards it, not even as a birthday present. It's very strange that they're pushing so hard for her to come and my initial (and probably least suspicious) thought is that they think they're onto a chance to offload a decent chunk of the holiday cost onto another family.

You maybe should try and meet the boys parents at some point. You maybe are only judging them from the night when they had been drinking together on a night out, That is not the right time to go judging people after some drinks, as people can act differently from their normal selves after some booze.

So it seems my wanting to keep her safe is actually manifesting as treating her like a child. I get that and I will work on it.

However my gut feeling is there's something seriously weird about this family and until I'm proved wrong - Im sticking with my instincts.

I would be every bit as alarmed as you, OP. It would be a firm no from me, I have a DS the same age who's also in a very intense relationship and I'm having to draw similar boundaries about priorities and schoolwork. My attitude is, "as long as your under my roof, you'll do as I say". Even if they're technically adults at 18, maturity lags way behind.

I think Boris will have a greater say than you....
Never mind the bf, I wouldn’t want her going away with the parents! I think it’s too far, too soon plus covid! She could be stuck out there! What if she hates it, they argue, she wants to come home early, she gets ill etc. She doesn’t know the parents, what if they just want to get drunk all day/night.
Obviously she won’t see these dangers/problems, she just wants a holiday with her bf....

Your daughter will subconsciously end up with controlling men if you don’t stop with your own controlling behaviour

@Tearingmyhairout1998

Your daughter will subconsciously end up with controlling men if you don’t stop with your own controlling behaviour

Its protecting not controlling. Your judging me by one scenario from one post. You have no idea how Liberal I've been.

@Suzi888
Absolutely! How can they be so irresponsible. Thick!

OP your posts are coming across hysterically BUT I listened to my parents when they calmly spoke to me and I heard them out because they spoke to me like I was an adult and there was no pressure, I was left to make my own decisions with their support.

I may be mid 40's but I still listen to advice from them because they care, NOT because they want to control me which is what your posts come across as, not saying that is your intention.

If my parents carried on the way you are coming across no way would I listen.

I get you feel there is something wrong with these people but maybe talking to your daughter rather than at her may help more

OP I can guarantee the reason you haven’t met her boyfriend or family is through her being scared you’ll judge them and stop her seeing him. My mum was like this with my DSis, she left home at 19 because of the novelty of being able to do things without restriction.

Have a chat with her about boundaries and consent etc, touch on recognising abusive relationships. But please take a step back, my mum didn’t and turned my sister into the biggest liar ever.

@Suzi888

I think Boris will have a greater say than you.... Never mind the bf, I wouldn’t want her going away with the parents! I think it’s too far, too soon plus covid! She could be stuck out there! What if she hates it, they argue, she wants to come home early, she gets ill etc. She doesn’t know the parents, what if they just want to get drunk all day/night. Obviously she won’t see these dangers/problems, she just wants a holiday with her bf....

@Suzi888 their relationship has been so volatile and such a rollercoaster. I dont want her to think this is normal. She constantly blames herself and persuades herself its just friendly banter when he puts her down for her clothes, her education, her IG posts. She even had a secret IG account from him. He looked in her phone, found it and left her sobbing in town after he told her it was over because she didn't tell him. I dont ask her these details - she tells me!! Ive bit my tongue and just been a shoulder to cry on once a week. I cannot wait for her to come to her senses!

I don’t think the parents sound “predatory”. My husbands parents are some of the most welcoming and generous people you’d ever meet and I could EASILY see them inviting a significant other on a trip. Husbands family would also absolutely invite me to stay the night, in our case it would have 100% been in separate bedrooms (even after we were married ) but I know other families just aren’t as concerned about it. They may have been hostile because your daughter was complaining about you, and as we all know, we need to show the worst bits of someone to make a point and are concerned about her. My parents never met any of my boyfriends parents, and barely met my boyfriend until my now husband.

Likewise, your daughter’s boyfriend may not be getting the truth about your relationship with her, she may even be using you as an excuse if she’s feeling a little confused about how she feels about the trip. You are probably not getting the real story about him either.

Nothing about this situation sounds “predatory” though. You are way OTT with that reaction.

cinderelly

It isn’t about you protecting her it is about her learning to protect herself.

You can teach them all the best strategies in the world and have them practice their own decision making skills as they grow up but at 17, nearly 18 you have to trust they can make the decisions themselves and be there for advice and support if it all goes tits up and to pull them back if you think they are going to do something really really stupid (Like telling dd that she can’t become a stunt woman and throw herself out of a 10th storey window without training behind her no matter how much the pay is)
It is a fine line to tread.

Whilst you might call it protection at her age it will come across as control.

You do have to bite your tongue and to a certain extent let them get on with things even if you don’t like some of their friends.

Let Boris and Pedro be the bad guys in their holiday plans.
Whilst you might have said what a lovely idea.

I sort of know the type of parents these people are. They sort of takeover and whilst your dd and their Ds might have been only going out for a short time they have their lives planned.
The wedding dress has been picked out and of course they will be moving in with them.

Ultimately the girl/boy does come to their senses when they realise marrying into the family means their life is not their own.

I know you see this and are trying to protect your dd but ultimately she has to see it for herself and she won’t whilst you are dead set against these people.

I think if she wants an extra holiday away from the family she needs to pay for it. If she can’t afford it, she doesn’t get to go!
It doesn’t sound like this relationship is going to last OP so try and chill a bit. As PP said, I am with you on your motives but I think your behaviour may have the opposite effect and push her towards the boyfriend and away from you.

“he puts her down for her clothes, her education, her IG posts. She even had a secret IG account from him. He looked in her phone, found it and left her sobbing in town after he told her it was over because she didn't tell him“

That’s a whole other level of behaviour, he sounds abusive. He’s not a child either, almost an adult. I would be very worried OP. Hopefully someone with some experience comes on, with better advice. I think the problem is you will push her to him if you come down too hard. I think the holiday has to be a definitive (hell) no though.

It's difficult to know when and how to draw the line with teens. I'm in more or less constant conflict with my 17 year old DS atm so it's difficult for me to give you an objective opinion, OP.

Not knowing who your daughter's going away with is disconcerting and the boyfriend's parents sound peculiar; I'd be very upset if my DD came home tipsy accompanied by a drunk parent.

Are you sure your intense dislike for his parents isn't from a place of jealousy? She's choosing to spend time with them and not you. Sounds like this is the first time she's broken away like this and clearly you don't like it. I'm not even convinced your description of the mother you barely met is not influenced by your pre meeting dislike.

I have always been extremely welcoming to any young ladies my teen boys bought home. There have been a few because they are young and each one is treated as part of the family. If we go out for dinner, they are invited etc. And I have never asked, nor wanted to meet any parents. You keep banging on about that, calling it 'a common courtesy' but it's not a common courtesy. It's a hang up you have.
If my 18 yr old wanted his gfriend to come on holidays with us, I'd never think I'd have to ask 'permission' of her parents. It's between her and them whether she comes or not.

I think you need to do a bit of self reflection OP. I don't expect you to be totally honest here but try and be a little more honest with yourself about the situation. It's not easy letting go but, at some point, you have to trust in the foundation that you built

Goodness me, just persuade her to introduce you to the boy, let her see you’re giving him a chance rather than just dismissing him and his family out of hand as you are at the moment - you may even find you like him. You may even find his parents are OK people. And even if they’re not your kind of people it doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong with them let alone potentially dangerous. True it does seem a bit daft to insist on arranging a holiday together at the moment, both in terms of Covid and the fact that the relationship is in its early stages and may well have broken up by December. I’d see the fact that the parents show an interest in and are supportive of their son’s relationship as a positive though. Maybe they really like your daughter and think she’s good for him?

I may be wrong and they’re a family from hell but I don’t really see anything to particularly support that theory from what you’ve written. Do you think your daughter wouldn’t be drinking if the parents weren’t there? Maybe better she does it with adults around to keep any eye on her, they saw her home safely after all? Likewise going on holiday, I’d see it as less potentially risky than going away with other teenagers. I fear the way you’re currently going about this bodes badly for your future relationship with your DD.

Ah, a bit of a drip feed there about him putting her down etc.......

their relationship has been so volatile and such a rollercoaster. I dont want her to think this is normal. She constantly blames herself and persuades herself its just friendly banter when he puts her down for her clothes, her education, her IG posts. She even had a secret IG account from him. He looked in her phone, found it and left her sobbing in town after he told her it was over because she didn't tell him. I dont ask her these details - she tells me!! Ive bit my tongue and just been a shoulder to cry on once a week. I cannot wait for her to come to her senses!

That's a huge drip feed

Are you sure your intense dislike for his parents isn't from a place of jealousy?

their relationship has been so volatile and such a rollercoaster. I dont want her to think this is normal. She constantly blames herself and persuades herself its just friendly banter when he puts her down for her clothes, her education, her IG posts. She even had a secret IG account from him. He looked in her phone, found it and left her sobbing in town after he told her it was over because she didn't tell him

This should have been in the original post and the thread title

“My daughter wants me to pay for her to go on holiday with her abusive boyfriend and vile parents”

The responses may have been more in line with reality.

Sounds like he’s taking the parents on dates so they can buy them booze.

Crikey! This sounds very alarming. Gran Canaria is no doubt a great place to visit - but not during a pandemic. Who knows what the situation will be in December, but flights there are currently being cancelled from what I've read. And these (weird aggressive drunk nutter of a mother is offputting in itself, encouragement of drink culture is another) strange people have just met her and want to take her somewhere far away-argh! I'd be worried they are up to some predatory thing involving sex trafficking-all without the usual polite meet-the-other-parents interchange having first occurred, or the proposal discussed with you. It all sounds so weird. (And the additional information about his behaviour makes it more alarming.)

I don't think it's at all controlling to be protective in these circumstances. I think I'd make it about Covid, and flights back, and the government, and isolation after, possible problems, etc, rather than them.