Am I? Flatmate beef

[AuntieJoyce]

DD has been living with me during lockdown and has recently returned to her London shared flat (2 people). During the last 6 months there has been a change in the flatmate and new flatmate has had the place to herself for three months. DD has been paying her rent and half the bills throughout.

Now DD is back, things are kicking off and I have offered to get the MN opinion as she is not on MN. Sorry seem to have lost ability to set up voting (is this a premium thing now?)

DD is working three days in office, two days in flat whilst sitting in the living room. Flatmate has had a go at her as she can't hold patient calls whilst DD is working in the lounge and it is apparently unprofessional to hold these in her bedroom. So far so missing the irony of making DD work in her bedroom instead. DD has a few calls but both of us have worked comfortably in one room for 6 months, using headsets when we need to be confidential.

Today it has kicked off again. DD has an ensuite and pays £200 more than flatmate for her room because of this. Flatmate has use of house bathroom. DD used the flat bathroom today as she was in the middle of cleaning hers and needed to go.

Flatmate has now texted and asked her not to use "her bathroom". DD has pointed out respectfully that it is not "her bathroom" it is on the landing for both to use. Flatmate says "given yours is attached to your room there is no need to use the other one"

This isn't us is it?

Flat mate needs to learn how to blur or put a false background on her video calls.

If she doesn’t want your dd to use the flat bathroom at all then perhaps she should pay a little more for it.
Living room and other shared spaces should be used by each of them and neither should have any exclusive rights over them.

The flatmate is being unreasonable for sure but I would be far more concerned that she would be so bloody petty about your daughter having a wee in the bathroom. Does not bode well for future relations. These little things definitely fester and can make living together a nightmare. So glad I don't have to deal with flatmates anymore, we parted friends but only just barely!!

They are both being incredibly immature.

They need to sort it out themselves with a calm conversation.

I know of shared flats where noone is allowed to work in the communal spaces for exactly this reason.

@lottiegarbanzo

My starting point with this is that the living room is communal space - and it is living space. It is where the occupants of the flat relax and socialise (in normal times). It is not an office and can never be considered private space.

e.g. If your dd had a day off and wanted to watch TV all day, practise a musical instrument, or do some reading, craft activity etc in her living room, that would be perfectly fine and normal. Covid-times and working from home do mean she'd need to be considerate of noise levels but that's all.

Also, is the living room completely separate from the kitchen and dining space? I'd want to be able to make drinks, snacks and eat lunch, in my own home, at my dining table, at times that suit me - and for this to be a relaxing break from work, not tiptoeing around someone else's 'office'.

So, if anyone wants to work in the living room, for any period of time, they need the agreement of the other person, before they do it. The obvious thing would be to talk through their preferences and make a rota.

The presumption on working from home must be that, as an anti-social activity, especially if a private activity, it must be done in bedrooms, as they are the only private space. (The flatmate can easily choose a suitable alignment or background to make her calls look professional, that excuse is pure twaddle).

I agree with this. I live in a house with my husband. I actually have a home office, but if he’s out at work and the weather is nice I sometimes bring my laptop into the kitchen and sit by the open french windows. I don’t do this if he’s in the house as it’s not reasonable to expect him to tiptoe around, not put the radio on, not make coffee....

The flatmate can’t have exclusive use of the main bathroom because guests would need to use it. It isn’t a private bathroom which is fair enough as she isn’t paying for a private bathroom.

@Grobagsforever

Just teach the flat mate how to set a background in her video calls!

This ☝🏼 it amazes me how many people struggle with privacy etc and don't just have a work/corporate/plain background

@MJMG2015

Jesus there are some weird replies!!

Your DD is entitled to use the household bathroom as & when she pleases. If flatmate wants sole use, that's fine - but then the rent needs adjusting.

The living room is also for both to use. Flatmate can set herself up in the bedroom with a neutral background & no one will know she's working in her bedroom. If she can't work that out, I question if she should be doing the job she's doing.

She's got a little too comfortable having the flat to herself & she needs to either move into a place in her own or accept it's a flat share.

Your DD needs to stand up for herself and tell the flatmate to stop being so ridiculous & keep a dated log of the issues and if it doesn't settle down, speak to the landlord. It's horrible to live somewhere there's an 'atmosphere'.

Your DD has discussed this with you and asked you to post on here- just ignore the daft comments about being too involved!

This

I agree with @IncandescentSilver your DD is NOT being unreasonable

It is a SHARED flat, so they each have equal access to communal areas including the main bathroom and living room. While it is fortunate for the flatmate that she's had exclusive use for a few months, it is now time to go back to sharing equally. Your DD and her flatmate should sit down and work out an equitable arrangement i.e. not one where the flatmate continues to have exclusive use of the living room.

I would suggest your daughter offer the flatmate exclusive use of the main bathroom for £100 a month.

I do think re the loo situation that your daughter could have flushed, wee'd and re bleached.

Isn't an ensuite also about no having to go out to a communal area in the night?

If your daughter is working from home just 2 days I would have thought that the obvious thing would be to use the lounge one day each?

To be honest, if I was your daughter, I would go with the approach of saying in a neutral tone of voice, if sharing flats with communal areas is something the flatmate struggles to deal with, flat sharing obviously isn't for her and she should get a flat on her own.

Flat mate is unreasonable, and probably too used to having the place to herself.

If she wants to use the other bathroom as well as her own (weird)

I don't see anything weird about it. If one person is paying half the rent PLUS an extra £200 a month for sole use of an en suite, I think that entitles them to use all the other facilities with the exception of bedrooms.

If the communal bathroom has a bath, for example, and that tenant fancies soaking in the bath rather than having a shower, I see nothing wrong or weird with them doing that.

Re the bathroom; it’s shared as your DD pays to have it accessed through her room only. She doesn’t need to go into the shared living/kitchen/hallway to use the shared bathroom which flatmate may or may not be using (or flatmates’ guests). Likewise dd’s guests have use of shared bathroom and don’t have to go into DD’s bedroom to use the ensuite.

Re the calls. Can flatmate not set up background on video calls when she is in her room?

I think the loo thing became a bigger issue than it really is because of the pressures of them both working at home.

But mainly, isn't your DD an adult? Why are you so involved and why can't she initiate a conversation with her flatmate about how to manage WFH together?

Did she take toilet roll from her ensuite or did she use toilet roll that the flat mate paid for? Some people are incredibly precious over their stuff in flat shares.

I’m another one who would like to know if your DD cleans the communal bathroom?

@GoldfishParade I think you got it wrong. The shared bathroom is ust that unless there is a written agreement stating otherwise. It does not matter if the other room has an ensuite, if they pay the same for shared areas in the flat. If OPs DD has a guest and they stay in the living room, then the guests should be able to use the shared bathroom as well. The other peson pays 200 quid less.
The living room is also shared, it's no DD's business the other person does not want to sit in her bedroom to take calls. They may not even be video calls for all we know. The flatmate can sit at her desk.

OP Id suggest they share some rota in terms of the living room, so they both have a chance to chill or work there without the other person.

If your daughter has been away, who 'recruited' the new flatmate? It maybe that the rent/split etc hasn't been spelt out to her clearly.

THey should both have access to the lounge - if the flatmate wants privacy she needs to use her bedroom; must be possible to arrange the screen in such away that it's not obviously in a bedroom.
Problem is that flatmate has settled in whilst having the flat to herself; but let your daughter sort it out or move on; not really any of your business.

Did you miss the bit where the flatmate gets the livingroom to herself 3 days a week when the dd is in the office?

Looks like the rota takes care of itself.

Why can people see the flatmates surroundings? Surely blurring your room is standard practice now?

The flat mate is being unreasonable. Why should she get her own bathroom for her exclusive use for free when your dd is paying £200 for hers?!

Definetly more to this, but that's not to say the DD is not telling the truth it's probably something that the flatmate is trying to use to justify her behaviour which is to punish the DD for being good enough to pay the full rent plus extra 200 for the ensuite throughout and bills too. Why should the flatmate get to be like this when she didn't offer to help with the extra 200 pound over the 3 month and presumably the flatmate technically could use both bathrooms and I wonder if she used the bedroom with ensuite in DD absence and is now annoyed the DD is back and is trying to make her live in her ensuite like a bedsit, when it's a flatshare FFS! The DD is not unreasonable at all in this so I fail to see why many are so quick to condemn the daughter for using he living room and the main bathroom on occasion. Legally the flatmate has no rights to what she is expecting and is just being awkward because she's feeling it's her flat and that she has been in charge of upkeep a while. If anybody is entitled it's the flatmate

They should both work in their bedrooms. Neither should be working where the other flatmate can see their screen.

That said I have seen flat shares where the second bedroom was so small you couldn't open the door fully even with the bed right against the wall and if that is the case then working in the lounge is a must.

Somebody - presume the land lord - should have written up in minute detailed NOTES 1,2,3 etc. who has use of what, where and when - down to which shelves in the fridge each one uses. This list should have been given to each tenant when they signed the rental agreement and pinned up in a prominent place too- otherwise everybody will grab whatever they can as ''theirs''..