To ask if there's something I'm missing about the allegedly "controversial" Diversity performance

[GlummyMcGlummerson]

Diversity performed on Britain's Got Talent, a performance which incorporated a message about BLM. Their performance, as usual, was incredible and sent out some great messages. The video is below.

It's had 10,000 complaints. Why?! am I missing something? Did someone's nipple pop out or something? What is the basis of people's complaints? The only reason I can think is that some people (probably because they're part of the problem) don't like it when others point out that there's racism in the world? Boo hoo to them

Noblegiraffe, no but it’s less controversial then a very recent murder. The examples I’ve had to suggest it is not a controversial thing to perform is because 1, Torvel and Dean performed the Romeo and Juliet death scene in the 80s and there was a magician sawing in half a woman in a magic act and 3 there was a primary school play showing the crucifixion of Christ. All I want is a similar performance that portrayed an actual murder that wasn’t deemed controversial.

Its sad that following this Jordan has spoken about the messages and abuse they've received since..to do with them and their family.

And how been complaints that the dance was mentioned on Saturday..the shows are pre recorded! And even so why should it get a mention. Nothing to apologise for.

Wasn't mentioned...

To be fair yes it has started a conversation here .... but to what end ? Has anyone seen that performance and been inspired to learn more ? Or has it made anyone rethink things?

I’ve been out of theatre for 10 years so I may just be behind the times, but this approach was far more about the profile of the dancers and choreographer than the issue.

But hey maybe I’m just a cynical old hack.

Stairway perhaps you could publish a guide on what forms black peoples expression of pain and anger can take? How long is a respectable period after a murder to express that pain? How long they are allowed to do so, on what days? Over what medium? Because they've tried quite a few different ways and they're all apparently wrong.

I think it was great and absolutely the best platform to get a BLM message across - the most watched platform!

I think maybe it did

It apparently moved 15000 people to complain so I guess they were thinking something

That in turn stimulated lots of articles and comment

I suspect in amongst all that a few people did change their minds or feel challenged

Maybe he choreographed it just for the profile but he could have done a tribute to Chadwick Boseman if he wanted something topical and less controversial. I would be surprised if BLM was something that the members of Diversity were indifferent to. Why is it so hard to believe it is a subject he cares about?

Bizarre that this many people have got so worked up about a dance. So many things to be worried about today, a dance would be bottom of any list I could think of.

Waffleyversatile I thought it was it was a really powerful piece of artwork, however it was controversial and some people would consider it in poor taste given the fact that Floyd George was a real person and not a fictional character. I think a lot of the complaints were due to more racist reasons but not every single one. I think people have forgot he was a real person and have termed him into with a hero, martyr or villain .Maybe an entertainment show wasn’t an appropriate place to perform it.

As for Jilly and her defending the right for people to say the indefensible, that was like reading a Piers Morgan tweet!

What’s wrong with a Piers Morgan tweet? Or is it just that he has committed thoughtcrime against wokedom?

• *[edited by MNHQ - quotes deleted post] **

I didn’t know George Floyd, so I can’t possibly say with any credibility what he was like.
I can say the American Police were worse and murdered him because of his colour. Others stood by and watched. That feels much, much worse than deliberately or inadvertently handling counterfeit money. We’ll never know what led up to that incident because unlike most white people, he wasn’t arrested and given a fair trial.

Good people do die every day. Most not at the hands of those employed to prevent killings and protect the people. Most not because of their skin colour. That is what makes it so awful.

There is absolutely no excuse for anyone to gloss over racism. To suggest his life was worth less, so it’s OK to be trodden to death by a law enforcement office aligns you with the people that feel it is acceptable to murder someone because of their skin colour. Those peddling the myth share the Nazi philosophy of racial superiority. Abhorrent.

If people are going to claim that the problem is that diversity was too graphic in their 'recreation' of george Floyd's death then they might as well complain at how graphic a magician cutting a woman in half is too graphic

Of course they won't do any of those things though.

Just like those claiming it's virtue signalling and attention seeking for Diversity to raise issues when they are famous haven't confirmed that they'd also be complaining about David Attenborough using his platform to raise awareness and start a conversation about plastic polution.

It's obvious to most people reading that the most vocal critics of Diversity are scrambling for ways to mask their real views: that BAME raising issues of racism makes them feel uncomfortable, either because they'd rather not have to think about it, or because they think systemic racism doesn't exist.

Just watched it. Excellent. Thought provoking. Well done Diversity. Thanks.

Love the desperation to prove how woke and not racist some of you are!

Yes if we didn’t all love Diversity’s performance and think it was simply inspirational then we are all Nazis. Obviously.

Or if we point out that using GF as a poster child for a movement designed to tackle racism is not the way to engage people we obviously must think that racism is ok, well no it’s just that we aren’t stupid. We’ve had these conversations before we know where it leads and we know what makes people actually stop and think and listen.

However- I do take the points raised that actually Diversity and AB are under no obligation to educate anyone about racism.

@CatsFantastic

Love the desperation to prove how woke and not racist some of you are!

Yes if we didn’t all love Diversity’s performance and think it was simply inspirational then we are all Nazis. Obviously.

Or if we point out that using GF as a poster child for a movement designed to tackle racism is not the way to engage people we obviously must think that racism is ok, well no it’s just that we aren’t stupid. We’ve had these conversations before we know where it leads and we know what makes people actually stop and think and listen.

However- I do take the points raised that actually Diversity and AB are under no obligation to educate anyone about racism.

I’m not sure I even know what woke means.

No, not liking a dance isn’t akin to naziism. Thinking the lives of black people and that it’s ok to kill them because of their skin colour is akin to naziism.

Tackling racism shouldn’t require a poster child, as you put so dismissively. It requires each and every person to be clear that killing people because of their skin colour is unacceptable.

* [edited by MNHQ - quotes deleted post] *

Concerted efforts to attack black people, black culture and anti-racists like you and your mates underline why movements like BLM are still sorely needed.

I won't engage with your spurious nonsense. You keep frothing at the mouth about a dance on a telly programme; some of us have useful things to do, like fighting racists and racism.

'If people are going to claim that the problem is that diversity was too graphic in their 'recreation' of george Floyd's death then they might as well complain at how graphic a magician cutting a woman in half is too graphic'

'Of course they won't do any of those things though.'

'Just like those claiming it's virtue signalling and attention seeking for Diversity to raise issues when they are famous haven't confirmed that they'd also be complaining about David Attenborough using his platform to raise awareness and start a conversation about plastic polution'

As has been said throughout likening this to a magician, Romeo and Juliet or even Attenborough is just embarrassingly silly. This was a recent murder, so as a pp said a more appropriate analogy would be would anyone do a dance about PC Harper's horrific death and of course they wouldn't because it would be a crass thing to do on a lightweight talent show. So what is the difference? His death was also a high profile atrocity, the result of long standing failures in the system. This time regarding criminality though. That sadly doesn't seem to enrage some as much as failures and brutality in US policing.

The racist messages received by Diversity members since the dance shows why the dance WAS required.
Some posters are deliberately conflating BLM political organisation with BLM as a belief. I almost certain that Diversity are not affiliated with the BLM political wing
There was 15k complaints because elements of the right wing press whipped up a lot of anger. Some people hadn’t even watched the dance , yet complained to OFCOM.
They just want black people to stop ‘complaining’

Furthermore, I take umbrage with the idea that white people are trying to be ‘woke’ or virtue signallers simply because they support Diversity’s right to express themselves through dance. That is just lazy labelling.
I am almost certain that if it had been a dance based on so called ‘black on black ‘ crime, there would be very few complaints as the white people would not be the aggressors.

Also, the ignorant posters who are almost condoning the murder of George Floyd, (because he was allegedly a former criminal )
These posters are missing the point, this being that George Floyd was killed because he was a black man, it could have been any black man. His race determined his fate.
I suspect that these posters are aware of this fact, but deliberately choose to put their fingers in their ears and moan about ‘wokeness’ and ‘ virtue signalling’. Having a moral compass is now seen as a flaw in the eyes of some.

It's hardly as though BLM perused a range of suitable role models to use to spearhead their campaign and decided on George Floyd
(There's no shortage of candidates. Maybe they should have chosen 12 year old Tamir Rice shot by police for playing with a toy gun in an empty park but even he isn't innocent enough for some people not to say he deserved it)

Floyd was murdered in cold blood on the street by a police officer and it so happened that it was filmed and that right thinking people around the world were outraged and protested. It is mainly the clear, immediately available footage that marks his case out. The upswell of revulsion against that was spontaneous.

So George Floyd is just an ordinary flawed person who didn't ask to be a figurehead and didn't deserve to die. His family obviously didn't want him to die but they are happy that his death has been used to lead to change. They want justice for him and they have not asked for his image not to be used.
Floyd himself made a video speaking out against gun crime in his community.

It's really bizarre to speak of BLM 'choosing him as a figurehead'

It's fine if you don't happen to like the dance BTW that doesn't make anyone a racist it's just a matter of taste. Some people prefer ballet to street dance but I don't really think that anyone complained because they disliked the actual dancing. None of Diversity's previous dances ever attracted such complaint even their tribute to Michael Jackson.

Not sure why anyone would bring PC Harper into it either

His death was a tragedy and people were outraged by it but it did not spark international protest because he was killed by criminals in the line of duty. Criminals usually do bad things sometimes including murdering people. This is not a surprise and especially not a surprise to police officers.

However murder is not something police officers should do and is more outrageous.
The state is not responsible for the actions of criminals but it is responsible for the actions of police officers

People repeatedly making the point that George Floyd died in the US seem to suggest no such thing can ever happen here but in the UK black people die in custody twice as often as white people and there are no shortage of famous cases. Someone upthread said they were long ago and it had stopped happening Sheku Bayou 2015, Rashan Charles 2017. Their families might beg to differ

@Theld because some posters seem to think that BAME people should be raising awareness for everything or nothing. As has been said eloquently above, but no answer has been given that I can see, why this only applies to Diversity and not to anyone who wants to raise awareness and public knowledge on any issue is not clear (except that come on, it is very clear!).

'Not sure why anyone would bring PC Harper into it either'

Because a pp said acts lke magicians sawing people in half are acceptable or Attenborough talking about plants. I gave a more appropriate comparison and said no, murders are not the 'same'.