To think this mum should have been more concerned

[consideratealpaca]

Dd9 has an account on a popular online gaming platform. During lockdown she spent a reasonable amount of time playing this game with her class friends from school. One particular girl and DD have butted heads a few times and fell out, which to me seemed like normal kid like behaviour and I wasn't concerned.
Despite me trying to persuade DD not to, she opted to spend some of her birthday money on 'diamonds' to enhance her game experience. I think she spent roughly £100 in dribs and drabs, which I wasn't impressed about, but it is her money when all is said and done.
Last week she came to me and said her account had been 'hacked' and all her diamonds, special objects etc had been stolen. She was then shut out of her own account. It finally transpired that she'd given the girl in her class who she frequently argues with her log in details.
Ordinarily I wouldn't particularly care but this child has stolen the things she bought with her birthday money as well as all the credits she had accrued in game play.
The girls had a brief exchange on WhatsApp and the class friend admitted she had taken my daughters diamonds etc and then changed her password.
I'm pretty sure I can take back control of the account for her, but everything is now lost. Her friend meanwhile, has all of my daughters diamonds and credits.

I messaged the mother of the child in question and whilst the message was read, it was ignored. So I approached her in a polite and friendly way in the playground this afternoon. I was hoping that she'd be shocked at her daughter's behaviour and perhaps we'd get an apology at least. I do not want to be reimbursed for the lost money, and stated that from the start.
The mother's reaction was just to shrug and waffle about not getting involved. Am I right to be mildly pissed off, or ridiculous for making an issue of it to begin with?

I don't think it's unreasonable to want an apology, but with the mother's strange reaction, it may be to expect one at this point. As pp said, depending on the platform, you may be able to get help from them.

Can someone please explain how this is like gambling?

In some online games, the purchases go towards 'lootboxes', what you get is random with some items usually being more rare. These have made the news repeatedly over the last few years. Some companies have been found really rigging the results to get more money and trying to argue that they're "surprise mechanics" to get around laws against gambling in games for kids. There have been concerns about encouraging kids to gamble and addictive-behaviours associated with them. Several countries have now either ruled or have been in the process of formally ruling that this is gambling which will affect more than a few big gaming companies.

In other online games, as pp said, the purchases are an established item. This one is not gambling at all, it's just like buying an e-book, but for a game. Many games have a mix of in-game and real world currency for these, I've seen some of the games supported by schools use mainly the ones with in-game currency only.

The lootboxes and items specifically to make the game easier (sometimes called pay-to-win) have made a lot of headlines so are more well-known, but for many games the items are purely aesthetic or collectibles. Not everyone's cup of tea, but similar as others said to collecting anything else, just takes up less space.

Sounds like it needs to be a lesson learnt for DD and you. £100 is way to much money to give your child free reign of at 8yo. No way she will make the right choices.

Fuck me, £100 for a nine year old. When I was 12 it took me over a year to save up less than that.

Bloody hell, do parents not spend money in Amazon prime, Disney plus, Netflix or sky? Isn't that the same as spending money on games? Paying out every month for their kid to look at a screen? Or is TV somehow a more worthy hobby?

Good luck with the game company today op.

@maybemu

Sounds like it needs to be a lesson learnt for DD and you. £100 is way to much money to give your child free reign of at 8yo. No way she will make the right choices.

Yes, it's a very valuable lesson for DD9 to learn, which is the only good thing to come out of this situation. She didn't make the choice to spend her birthday money on her own, she always asked our permission before spending £5 here, £10 there during lockdown. It was OUR decision to indulge her love of the game.

Could it be that she’s just not familiar with how it works and doesn’t fully understand what’s happened?

The number of times I’ve heard from one of my sons that Jamie has ‘hacked’ him and picked up his coal blocks or Ethan has ‘scammed’ him and taken his skins...hacked and scammed are words they throw around constantly because they pick them up from You Tubers and they sound cool - but they’re often not used particularly meaningfully IME.

I tend to tune out of the minor squabbles - so maybe she thinks this is similar and doesn’t fully realise what’s happened.

Either way YANBU op and i’d have expected a bit more.

Saying that, I think some of the suggestions of contacting the police etc are ridiculous. I think the police have better things to do than mediate between two squabbling kids over £100 of virtual diamonds . Attaching realistic levels of importance to events is the sensible, adult approach surely.

I would take the steps to get your daughters account back op (with or without diamonds) and use it as a good learning opportunity for her about internet safety, password security etc. Then take her for an ice cream to cheer her up and move on.

Sounds like she's playing Roblox. Bane of my life. She can't give out her log in. It's a hard lesson that she has learnt. The other girl was completely wrong and her mother should be absolutely mortified and offer to reimburse your daughter but 9 year olds ( I have a similar age) are not able to regulate what they do or buy and you need to take control. I say this as someone who has been in a similar position

Like others have said, I'm shocked you allowed your nine year old daughter to fritter away 100 quid on a game. But, what's done is done, and I'm sure you're not the only parent to have done that sort of thing.
The worst part of this scenario is the other girl - she is a thief. I cannot believe at that age she has had the gall to hack into another child's account! It's terrible. Unfortunately OP your daughter has learnt the hard way never to share passwords and log in details.

Yanbu @consideratealpaca some of the posts on here are ridiculous.

Dd1 plays an online game, we allowed her to spend some of her own money to upgrade something. In normal times, we probably wouldn’t have allowed this but, but during lockdown when everything else had been taken away from her and she was playing this with friends it was the right thing to do.

I’d be furious with the other mother, like you said, what kind of example is she setting.

I do think you have to forget the money and apology, just a hard lesson for your dd in how not to trust people with any login details.

When a DC adds money to their game it is to enhance the home they built or buy a new outfit for the fashion show.
These items are not wasted they stay in their inventory they can trade them or reuse them.
Just like in real life we like nice outfits.
I think online gaming toys are hugely beneficial to the environment too.
Plastic tat is a thing of the past.
I think we will have some fine engineer's in the future.

@Mellonsprite

I’d be fuming, I’d ask the mum again today. I’d say ‘I know you said you didn’t want to be involved but having thought more, it’s really not ok that your DD has (magic word) stolen £100 of DD’s diamonds, when she said she was helping her. I would like them back in her account by end of week.’ If she dismisses you again, I’d say ok I’m going to approach school so they can use this as an education piece For the kids about not being scammed by so-called friends, and see if that shames her into anything. Good luck Op!

That sounds good

My dad is same age and has spent months earning diamonds in Roblox - me being a big meanie, I bought her about a fiver's worth at the start of lockdown and she's been doing challenges and stuff for months to get 120,000 diamonds for some snazzy outfit for her avatar, trading items to get there.
She's learnt that some traders are scammers, items are only worth what people will pay, and isn't allowed to add any friends she doesn't know in real life.

She also can't buy anything herself online - so a couple times a week I'm buying content for her for 59p or £1.09, which is tedious but at least it's not plastic tat.

For all this shocked at £100 being spent.

*IT IS OVER A 9 MONTH PERIOD FFS!!!!!!
*
That's LESS THAN £3 A WEEK!!!

Honestly, how many of you can truly say that your kids don't buy rubbish every week with their spending money?

And for all those saying £400 is too much money, do you not know about people being better off than others? It's totally a thing you know. There's like, a whole TV series about it called Rich House, Poor House.
And £5 spending money for my kids is probably going to be £20+ for a richer kid. I don't think they shouldn't be allowed it just cos mine can't have that much.

This is so sad, your poor DD

I think this has all been pretty much covered but YABU to be very disappointed in the other child's mother's response. Her child was deceitful and stole from your daughter. I had assumed that she didn't know about buying the diamonds and/or doesn't allow her DD to do so and that therefore her casual attitude was similar to all the posters on here who are outraged that you would allow your daughter to spend money on a game. But it sounds like she DOES give her DD money so she does know how it works and should be even MORE embarrassed.

I don't think there's much you can do but obviously you need to make sure your DD learns the lesson about not letting others know her log ins. And she may want to reduce contact with this person completely - being friends with someone who steals from you is not a sensible approach. Personally, I'd also feel free to warn any other parents whose DC play the game to ensure that they block their details etc and don't hand them out. And if the thief's mum gets upset about that, so be it.

Also, spending her birthday money over 8 months, most of it in lockdown, on a game she actively spends time on seems perfectly reasonable to me. Those items they buy they have forever in that game, and when they're bored, it doesn't clutter up your house! DD's fairy wings (roblux) or access to certain games have been absolutely worth the money.

I love @Mellonsprite 's idea.

Thank you @SpaceOP
The other mum certainly knows how the game works and gives her child money to spend in the game.

She generally takes a lackadaisical attitude to everything her darling daughter does.

During lockdown my DD asked to borrow my phone for five minutes to message her class friends on WhatsApp to find out what time everyone would be online to play. There was an exchange in which this girl sent a photograph which was then quickly deleted. My daughter had responded with 'OMG! Delete that now!' and further comments like 'I can't believe you sent that', 'my mum would kill me' etc. I asked DD what the photo was and she said 'it was rude'. I pushed her for an answer and she said 'it was a picture of a man with his willy in a woman's mouth'.
I messaged the mother and she really couldn't have fucking cared less. I left it there, because at the end of the day I was happy with my child's response.

I mean....if OP’s DD has four grandparents that give her £50 each for her birthday, that’s already £200? That’s not an unreasonable amount surely? That’s about what my mum spends on me and on each of her grandchildren

Have you checked your Camera Roll OP? Photos on my WhatsApp chats get automatically saved to mine even if the sender deletes them. You'll be looking at your photos in the future and think WTF is that?!

Sometimes I think it is a shame that there isn't an edit function available to OPs so that they can add the information demanded by posters to their first post!

Honestly seeing people so outraged by the money received as birthday presents and by the child spending their own money has made me cross.

In a large extended family it is easy for children to receive several gifts of money that add up to a sizeable amount. It's not dreadful or shocking. I am sure that this child knows how fortunate they are. They haven't spent ONE HUNDRED POUNDS in one fell swoop, but over several months, it's hardly reckless is it?

I also agree that those of us who aren't gamers don't understand the pleasures of gaming. Just like some of my friends don't share my love of books and theatre and laughingly roll their eyes when I go into transports of delight over a new plant.

OP you are rightly annoyed by the response of the other mother. I hope you get a positive response from the gaming company and that your daughter gets some of her sparkly wotsits back in her account!!

Just to say I dread to think what my DD2 spent on Robucks during lockdown, but she enjoyed gaming with her friends and creating stuff so much and there was bugger all else for her to do at times. It was worth every penny. Just this week I bought her a load of virtual eggs to hatch as a treat. I know it's not tangible stuff but I would rather spend money on enjoyable experiences than plastic crap or rubbish like trading cards or sweets.

@Gemma2019

Just to say I dread to think what my DD2 spent on Robucks during lockdown, but she enjoyed gaming with her friends and creating stuff so much and there was bugger all else for her to do at times. It was worth every penny. Just this week I bought her a load of virtual eggs to hatch as a treat. I know it's not tangible stuff but I would rather spend money on enjoyable experiences than plastic crap or rubbish like trading cards or sweets.

Couldn't agree more.

Those that are outraged about the online spending, if its £100 over the entire year so far it's a bit more than £10 a month, would it be ok for her to have spent £10 a month on plastic shit from the pound shop or the entertainer? Or £10 a month on additions to a Lego or Sylvanian families collection?

If the OPs DD has had 9 months of enjoyment from the game, especially through lockdown, and had her birthday money there to use sparingly then what's the big deal exactly?

It seems wrong that the game owners should be enticing children to spend such huge sums on things with no intrinsic value

But Netflix and Disney+ and a movie at the cinema have no intrinsic value either. Neither does Spotify or Amazon Music or the bloody TV licence!

Do you really not spend a single penny on entertainment that isn't a tangible 'thing?' @Pelleas

I spent nearly £50 on Animal Crossing and spend another £5 a month to play online. That's about the same as the OP's DD has spent this year on her game. Why is one ok and the other not? 🤔

Some people posting on this thread really don't understand gaming. This will not stand them in good stead for understanding the world of young people today.