Husband's down time

[Pondlife87]

We have a 16 month old daughter who is a terrible sleeper.
Both my husband and I work. He does 5 days a week and I do 3.
We did split maternity. When i was off i did all the night wakings. When he was off we shared it as past 3am she will not settle without feeding (she is breastfed).

Now we are both back at work he does the first shift (10.30-2.30) and i do the second shift (2.30-7) of her waking. She tends to end up in bed with us from about 4 as otherwise I'm up every 30 minutes settling her. We've tried having her in bed with us all night, but she just wants to feed constantly if I'm near her and won't accept Dad.

So- i get to my point. Dad has always been a night owl and stays in his workhouse every Friday until 3am doing projects. This means we have to swap the shifts. This means I am up between 10.30-3 resettling her. Then when he comes to bed, because she needs to feed I am awake hourly resetting her and she will only accept me. Then because he has been up until 3am he gets the lie in. I get the lie in the following day.
I have expressed i am unhappy about it as I get next to no sleep all Friday night because i essentially do both shifts. He argues that lots of men/ women go out every weekend.
However i do not think it is ok to go out every weekend until 3am if you have a child, so i don't see why this is different?
I've suggested he can go out but take the baby monitor to do thr first shift and he said no. I suggest he go out and come in earlier at say 12/1 and he said no.
Am i being unreasonable with my requests?
Is there a middle ground? Can you offer any otjer solutions?
Please note this is not a request for advice to help baby sleep better. I've tried everything haha.

If he wont give up the lie in I would be going back to bed as soon as he is up.

@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken

Apart from the amount she is sleeping, what makes her sound sleep deprived?

Babies have different sleep needs and length of sleep cycles. The OP has not said the child is hyper, sluggish, grumpy, tearful, behind on milestones... Or indeed anything to indicate they are underslept. So where are you getting that from?

You sound strung out yourself tbh and not surprised after 16 months of no sleep. You don’t need to do this you know. How can you say wanting babies to sleep at night is a post Victorian disproved theory?! I breastfed and went a little down this road with dd1 it nearly broke me. She’s 13 now and marginally stroppier and less chilled than her 11 year old sister who slept through and was weaned earlier. As they get older you realise how pointless it all was. Be kind to yourself.

[quote VeniceQueen2004]@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken

Apart from the amount she is sleeping, what makes her sound sleep deprived?

Babies have different sleep needs and length of sleep cycles. The OP has not said the child is hyper, sluggish, grumpy, tearful, behind on milestones... Or indeed anything to indicate they are underslept. So where are you getting that from?[/quote]
Ummmm the fact that’s she’s 16 months old and still only sleeps for 30 minute stretches?

@MsTSwift

Why do your children's different personalities indicate to you that it was pointless meeting your DD1's needs when she was small? I mean the motivation surely wasn't to make them more amenable to you?

Also at 13 everyone is stroppy and un-chill - give 11 yo time!

If that's her sleep cycle that's her sleep cycle. People need different amounts of sleep. Adults wake up between sleep cycles, we just fall back to sleep quickly and don't remember it. As long as she is showing no I'll effects, there is no reason to believe she isn't getting all the sleep she needs (albeit in bursts).

@Pondlife87 and @VeniceQueen2004 I don’t really have any advice I’m sorry, I understand how difficult it can be with partners and feeling like you are nackered and doing loads. Does my head in. I feel like calmly explaining and even throwing it in as a joke (?) can ease a difficult discussion. I also wanted to say thanks for this thread!!!! My baby is 8mo and all you hear about is sleep training, controlled crying etc and I really don’t feel like I want to do any of it.... so it’s interesting to read about mammal responses etc. And just a different perspective to be honest. Controlled crying just feels unnatural to me. I’m sorry you have not been understood or shown any empathy but I do find mumsnet to have quite a few members with a stick up their arse. You do what feels right for you. If everyone was happy with their choices and followed their own conviction maybe they wouldn’t be so judgemental of others. 🙏🏼

@nolongersurprised
I am genuinely grateful for that advice as if it were the case for us it would be valuable information.
She does eat well though and has fortified cereal for breakfast most mornings, her favourite meals are spaghetti Bolognese and bean chilli and her fave veg is brocolli and spinach. So hopefully (and logically) it isn't that.

@VeniceQueen2004

If that's her sleep cycle that's her sleep cycle. People need different amounts of sleep. Adults wake up between sleep cycles, we just fall back to sleep quickly and don't remember it. As long as she is showing no I'll effects, there is no reason to believe she isn't getting all the sleep she needs (albeit in bursts).

I can’t help but feel you’re contradicting yourself a little here. I don’t mean to offend because you’re obviously taking this very personally. You say adults wake constantly throughout the night but don’t remember it so no harm done but the 16 month old here is waking fully and not learning to stitch their cycles together. Therefore, by your own admission, it will be doing her harm. Babies’ sleep cycles at this age are around 50 minutes so she’s not even getting that. Mum is struggling, Dad is struggling and baby probably isn’t getting a full sleep cycle. There’s no reason to push through this way. It’s clearly torturing mum.

He's making a choice that's unfair to you to better him. He's relying on the fact that you WONT make the choice to do the same as it's not what you want for your child. Have another discussion with him, point out he's being a dick, and ask him how he would feel if you just made the choice not to parent between 3-whatever time he normally gets up, and leave him to deal with the consequences.

And as much as you say he's a good egg, the only answer is that either he's a dick who cares more about his needs than equality, or he's a dick who's putting his needs over the decision you made together to nightfeed for your child.

However, you can't fix it, you can't make him, if you still want to night feed and he won't participate, then you're doing it alone regardless 🤷‍♀️

Oh and she also gets a multivitamin once a day.

Check Vitamin D as well, aiming for 75. There’s an overlap with night time restless in younger child and restless legs in older children and robust iron and Vitamin D help.

The amounts of iron in a multivitamin are low because iron can be toxic if given too much. Similarly in a multivitamin the Vitamin D is only 200-400IU which is more prophylactic/maintenance doses, not enough to treat a mild deficiency

30 minutes of sleep at a time is not adequate for anyone, parent or child. Your child has gotten into the habit of waking for feeding. Break the cycle.

For everyone's sanity, do what works for you all as a family, stop going by research and science. If you are working and up every night, sometimes every 30 minutes there is no way you are not tired. I don't blame your Dh for doing his hobby til 3am, I would too just to have some normality. Your night time routine needs sorting for everyone.

My eldest was a shit sleeper, I feel your pain. Especially when people tell you what you should or shouldn't be doing with your own child. I know with my eldest she needed the comfort during the night, so thats what I have her. She got better in her own time. Some children just take a little longer to get there.

Your husband should be getting up in the morning. If he is tired because he is doing his hobby, tough luck, that's his choice to stay up so late

OP so many posters just can't grasp that some babies are different. I don't know why we expect babies to have no wake ups. I'm in my twenties and wake up at least twice. 16 months is very small and it's concerning how many people advise being "firm" with a child so young.

If your husband has a full night off plus a lie in you need to get the same. His choice.

If she’s only napping for 30 mins a day and then waking constantly at night then she can’t be getting any quality sleep either.

There is a theory if you get the daytime nap right then nighttime sleeping can improve. Maybe consider trying to get her to sleep for a good hour during the early afternoon. This worked for us with bf DS but of course every child is different.

Why post in AIBU, OP when you are not prepared to accept that you might be unreasonable? You can post in lots of areas on MN for good advice but you are getting very angry with posters who tell you that you are being unreasonable. IMO, you are being impractical and unreasonable.

Okay. I would tell him that since you're being kept up because of no help and he is only up so late because he chooses to do so... That from now on... You get a lie in both days. And if he complains that he would be too tired say "and you don't think I am having to be repeatedly woken all night in Friday while you're having a break"?

@Bluntness100

Please note this is not a request for advice to help baby sleep better. I've tried everything haha

I suspect this statement means you know this is the issue.and this is what you need to resolve. She’s sixteen months, you need to deal with this now and say no and start to wean her

Yes.

I'd be very worried about child's quality of sleep and the long-term effect on her metabolism.

@GreenTiles22

I would expect your husband to do the first shift on Friday night so you can get some sleep.

Unless he's creating the vaccine for Covid in his shed until 3am, he can do his hobby on his days off.

Agree, or postpone hobby entirely until parents have equal access to uninterrupted personal time.

Can you not just co sleep with baby from the first wake up? It’s the getting up and down multiple times in a night that’s so exhausting but if you don’t want to wean you could do set things up to do night feeds in a much less painful way. My sister co slept with all her kids until around 2yo. They would wake to feed during the night, she would roll over, let them latch on & go straight back to sleep. Husband oblivious & got a full nights sleep. Nobody had to get up or even fully wake up at all.

My point is when they enormous healthy kids all this seems pointless sorry. It’s punitive the poor op isn’t sleeping if she hadn’t read that book she might be. She’s obviously a loving and devoted mother whose child will therefore be absolutely fine if she gently did something to enable her to get more sleep. The op matters too it’s not all about ensuring the baby doesn’t have a moments upset.

@Hamm87

Shouting at ppl won't help, you want him to do his share then you do your share simple split everything including working, 🙄 he works 5 DAYS, see we all can do that on little sleep and you begrudge him a night to unwind and do his hobby you have 2 extra days to him, to do this as you can pop your child in nursery or nap during the day so i find really the unfairness is on you in this oh so modern day your choice what you do his choice for him he does more then most men and if you don't care about advice you should not ask simple

This post is bizarre. What do you think the op is doing on the 2 days she’s not ‘working’? It’s childcare. Which is what we pay childcare providers for. Just because it’s unpaid doesn’t mean it isn’t work and the op gets to do as she pleases. Lots of paid jobs are more restful than being at home with young children.

Pop them in nursery? Not sure where you live but nursery is pretty expensive and presumably the op has reduced her hours to save that money and do the job herself. 16 mo are not like newborns, they need attention and are constantly on the move (well mine were) - resting and napping was a thing of the past.

The husband is as in on this plan as the op, (Why do people always assume this is a female agenda and some helpless sap of a man being railroaded? Do men not have the same feelings for their children as their wives? Are they innocent bystanders in parenting?) so he needs to do his equal share of 50/50 nights, which he’s not doing and 50/50 work, which they are both doing.

As for vitamins op not sure what brand you are using but the paediatric nutritionist recommended we switch to the WellKid brand as they have a better dose of vit d. Just random FYI there in case anyone was concerned specifically about vit d.