NHS consultant flies to Greek island despite quarantine

[kumquat365]

Name change for this. DH and I have a friend who is an NHS consultant at the top of the pay scale whose service is short-staffed and has spoken to us about the unnecessary deaths caused by lack of cover in his speciality.

He's a keen swimmer and cyclist and booked to go on an activity-style holiday with a friend. He's not married and has no family: this wasn't a family holiday. They were booked to go to an upmarket activity holiday centre on a Greek island that in the last few days has been put on the quarantine list by both Scotland and Wales. The flight was due to depart late yesterday afternoon. Our friend's mate, who is a medic based in England, decided not to risk it and dropped out. Our friend, who works in one of the countries that had declared a 14-day quarantine on return, went in the knowledge he'd have to quarantine on return.

AIBU to feel shocked and disappointed? He's complained so much about shortages of staff in his specialism and he's just taken a decision that will mean it's even worse.

@CitizenFame hahah love this response! Ppl do need to mind their own knitting.

I don't think it's selfish to go abroad Batshit. I'm just commenting on the different tones of this thread compared with many others on MN.

The general consensus has been it's both stupid and selfish, and had the op not said he was NHS then I suspect the replies would have been different.

If i was an nhs consultant I would want to squeeze in a break before covid hits again combined with all the delayed cases of medical conditions which went untreated and the chaos that winter brings

@JenniferSantoro so if you worked alongside him, or were one of his patients, you wouldn't mind at all that he had a period of two weeks extra off unplanned in addition to his holiday (which is of course quite reasonable in itself, he's absolutely entitled to a holiday!) which meant you had to work overtime yourself to cover his extra leave, or meant that your treatment was cancelled to the detriment of your health?

Annual leave is planned for and he should absolutely take it but this is extra time off on top of that which is not authorised (by the sounds of it)

YABVVU to say 'we pay their wages'. What drivel. They pay taxes too!!

The woes of the NHS aren’t one individual consultant’s problem, anymore than the problems at your workplace are entirely yours to sort out.

My friend knew that his destination had been added to the quarantine list for some hours before he departed for the airport. Long enough to cancel and find an alternative but probably not long enough to have set up cover and okayed the situation with work.

So just to be clear, you actually have no idea whether this has been OKd by his employer, nor whether alternative cover has been arranged?

[quote Whyaretheredinosaursinthebath]@JenniferSantoro so if you worked alongside him, or were one of his patients, you wouldn't mind at all that he had a period of two weeks extra off unplanned in addition to his holiday (which is of course quite reasonable in itself, he's absolutely entitled to a holiday!) which meant you had to work overtime yourself to cover his extra leave, or meant that your treatment was cancelled to the detriment of your health?

Annual leave is planned for and he should absolutely take it but this is extra time off on top of that which is not authorised (by the sounds of it)[/quote]
The OP hasn't said whether it's extra, unauthorised leave, or even leave at all, because she clearly has no idea. There's no 'by the sounds of it'.

@Didkdt

Op are you the other medic? If not then honest to God un-clutch your pearls and carry on with your day

I would be very surprised if OP were to turn out to be a medic, after a thread where she demonstrated that she has not a single clue about the reality of the work.

YABVVVU

I'm really shocked at your sense of entitlement OP. How is it any of your business how someone spends their annual leave? It's not your friends responsibility to hold up the NHS!

You really aren't a friend to him at all.

Those having a go at me: I'm not talking about what causes shortages, or saying this man should work himself to death.

I'll say again in case it wasn't clear before: I voted YANBU because I think him complaining about staff shortages and then going off on holiday himself is hypocritical.

If he ended up off sick from stress related burnout (or a heart attack), he'd be away from the NHS for a lot longer than taking a few weeks leave. Don't begrudge him his hard earned holiday - wherever he chooses to go. Like I said earlier, the UK quarantine is ridiculous anyhow. Countries with lower R rates than us are on the list, and it's not even a proper quarantine.

@AnyFucker

Is the "other medic" your husband, op ?

More like Dr Quinn, Medicine Woman, Doc Martin or some other fabricated bunk like that.

You are “shocked and disappointed”
.... perhaps you need better things to worry about 🤔

Rofling at someone holding up the human bilious attack Allison Pearson and her drivel as evidence this poor fucker shouldn't go on holiday. Still, it takes the pressure off everyone else she's foul about for a day or two.

Sadly, these kind of threads illustrate why the Tories are going to get away with pretty much privatising the NHS. The level of expectations of NHS staff and “putting on a pedestal type heroism” is just ludicrous. Consultants are individuals just like teachers, bankers, admin staff and anyone else. They are entitled to make their own choices and a job is a job. Plus I just don’t think it is worth judging or falling out with friends in covid times and with regards to covid rules/behaviour - I never go there on Brexit, don’t go there on covid rules. It isn’t black and white and genuine respect for others, which should be part of friendship, is to let them have their own opinions. If you are comfortable in your opinions then you should not have to feel disappointed or judge anyone else.

'The level of expectations of NHS staff and “putting on a pedestal type heroism” is just ludicrous. Consultants are individuals just like teachers, bankers, admin staff and anyone else'

Exactly. Imagine a teacher had done this, booked the last 2 weeks of the summer hols off to a place they knew fine well they would have to quarantine on their return. The kids could have some more remote learning, or their colleagues could do extra work. That's fine!

Doctors are not gods and should not go somewhere that they know fine well they have to quarantine on return.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

'The level of expectations of NHS staff and “putting on a pedestal type heroism” is just ludicrous. Consultants are individuals just like teachers, bankers, admin staff and anyone else'

Exactly. Imagine a teacher had done this, booked the last 2 weeks of the summer hols off to a place they knew fine well they would have to quarantine on their return. The kids could have some more remote learning, or their colleagues could do extra work. That's fine!

Doctors are not gods and should not go somewhere that they know fine well they have to quarantine on return.

This is a foolish analogy, because doctors don't have to take their leave at a certain time while teachers do.

Hmm I was wondering when there might be a thread like this one!

What difference does it make that it's not a family holiday?

Am pretty sure the various NHS departments have robust policies in place for those staff members who are deciding to travel abroad e.g. you will need to take annual leave or unpaid leave if you know in advance that you will need to quarantine on return.

From what I gather from a family member who is medical NHS employee, the exemption thing ended back in July, unless you were caught out with the rules changing while you were actually abroad, you would be expected to take annual/unpaid leave.

or of course work from home if possible- clearly not possible if you are a surgeon operating in theatre.

Will keep an eye out for this thread in the Daily Mail!

Doctors are not gods and should not go somewhere that they know fine well they have to quarantine on return.

..If a Doctor can quarantine in his/her own time and dollar on their return, or can quarantine without it having an effect on their work then it really really is absolutely none of our business.

'If a Doctor can quarantine in his/her own time and dollar on their return, or can quarantine without it having an effect on their work then it really really is absolutely none of our business.'

Oh I bet everybody would say that. Nurses could do a bit of online training for 2 weeks, ditto teachers and social workers.

The point is if you're part of a work force you have to act responsibly.

I'm a bit judgey of anyone who are featured the msm on their jollies all shocked at quarantine rules imposed but to go knowing they are in place takes a special kind of arrogance/stupidity imo.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

'If a Doctor can quarantine in his/her own time and dollar on their return, or can quarantine without it having an effect on their work then it really really is absolutely none of our business.'

Oh I bet everybody would say that. Nurses could do a bit of online training for 2 weeks, ditto teachers and social workers.

The point is if you're part of a work force you have to act responsibly.

I'm a bit judgey of anyone who are featured the msm on their jollies all shocked at quarantine rules imposed but to go knowing they are in place takes a special kind of arrogance/stupidity imo.

Are you actually daft enough to think it's either face to face appointments or a bit of online training for a consultant, with no other options available?

YABU!

I've just re read your first post- it most definitely sounds like you're anything but a friend to this man!

If enough NHS staff are caught out by quarantine I predict a government U-turn shortly, namely that a negative test (either 1 or 2) for NHS staff will suffice following return from a quarantined nation. They would be tested anyway so no extra cost.