Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

MIL feels attacked

335 replies

Rennlau · 24/08/2020 15:11

My OH and I are in a bit of predicament with my OH's mum/my MIL.

I could go on and on in regard to backstory, but I'll try and keep it brief and then on to the most recent issues.

Our DS is 6m old, he is our first and was born 6 weeks before lockdown, we have been getting pressured by MIL since I was a few days postpartum to have him overnight, this has not and will not be happening anytime soon, covid or not, but I was pretty distressed by her doing this when I had only had him days earlier and was just getting to know him aswell as myself in my new role as a mother ~BUT~ I did not assert myself and just kinda white-noised her then cried once she had left. She has not let the issue of having DS overnight or on her own (what is the obsession of separating mother from child?) even though this isn't an option due to covid and also neither my ds or I are ready for that. She is also pretty relentless telling us what to do and trying to get us to raise our DS the way she did my OH again white-noise, smile and nod. My partner and I are very much on the same page and have been trying to be as diplomatic as possible whilst walking on eggshells so as not to rock the boat - his parents are the only grandparents and we have both not wanted to do anything that could result in our son being isolated from them, but his mum is incredibly domineering and can be volatile.

In regard to lockdown it actually done my partner and I a world of good in the sense of allowing us some distance, relieving us of MIL pressure. We have become a pretty solid and harmonious family unit and have really got to find our feet as parents, we know how we wish to raise our son and even though he is a lockdown baby he is a pretty self assured and confident baby.

As lockdown rules have began to ease, my MIL has been able to now visit our DS and to hold him (she requested to see him in person countless times during lockdown, but had not been socially distancing so we did not want to risk it) and this is where things have went awry. She put my child's hand in her mouth, like full on in her mouth. It was just her and I in the room when she done it the first time, I was totally aghast and taken disgusted, regardless if there was a pandemic going on or not, I am not okay with her doing this. I have struggled to assert myself with MIL, but thankfully in this instance my motherly instincts took over and I told her to stop and I then took DS to washed his hands, I thought that would be that. It wasn't she has done it a further three times, the second time was the next time she visited and she done it when I left the room in front of my OH who had the same reaction as had previously. The final time she did it we were in her shop and in front of one of her employees, I instinctively said no hands in mouths and my partner took DS away to wash his hands. This was also the same day she allowed said employee to touch my DS's face and then asked if she would like to hold my son!! Again, my partner was not present (in bathroom) and I had to pipe up and say no, my MIL then started laughing. To clarify, covid is not the sole reason I am uncomfortable with having my son passed around. My oh and I both feel it's important to respect his personal space/autonomy and to teach consent as second nature, but I didn't feel that that was the time or place to get into it, however we have tried to be as informative as possible prior to this instance (whilst walking on eggshells) about our parenting style/choices while giving some grace for people (MIL) to acclimate, she has ignored everything to date.

After the last incident, my partner I decided our eggshell tactic was not working and we had to advocate for DS and set some clear boundaries. We decided to start with one boundary at a time and address what happened with DS's personal space, then if/when she oversteps other boundaries in the future clearly address it then and there rather than rehash/bring up everything in a one(y). I should probably note my MIL has zero regard for anyone's boundaries and it's something my OH has struggled with inti adulthood.

MIL visited us last Sunday and nearing the end of the visit we brought up what happened when I stopped her employee from holding my son, we explained it was not covid alone that prevented this from happening that we were not okay with our DS being passed around in any circumstances and tried to explain why, we were sensitive about our wording to make sure she did not feel attacked. To put it simply she went off her head. She began by being very patronising, tried to turn it around on me (just me) and then began yelling (at me) but I'm front of DS (OH and I have never yelled in front of him) so I finally asserted myself and told her to either stop yelling in front of my child or she had leave my home, my partner also stepped in and she left, yelling as she went.

She messaged my partner a couple of days later saying I attacked her, he defended me, reiterating the situation and I think gave her some home truths which probably didn't help, but on the other hand was probably needed. We have heard nothing since and honestly I have no desire to see or speak to her, but worry I am doing a disservice to my son, but don't know what to do if she won't respect us or our wishes as his parents, I fell that would be a bigger disservice to DS? I also have zero desire to come between my partner and his mother and I have told him that.

The worst part is, if she has an issue with us, which now does then she will go out her way for the full family to also have an issue.

I really don't know what to do going forward.

OP posts:
Rennlau · 24/08/2020 18:45

@lunar1 'generally' you should be able to read your baby's cues without them having to resort to crying to let you know they're upset.

Maybe it's you who is conditioning your baby by not respecting their autonomy (too small a person to be an actual person, logic) getting them to behave like a little performing monkey that is there to be passed around and held by anyone, I mean until they cry that is.

OP posts:
GhostCurry · 24/08/2020 18:49

“Of course its not a bad thing to be taught autonomy and consent, it's just bonkers to think that a 6 month old baby can be taught that !!“

No it isn’t. It all starts somewhere. Absolutely no reason why it can’t start this young.

What’s nice about RIE is that it gives babies credit. It does actually work. Babies aren’t dolls, they have moods, preferences, fears. It’s actually very important to be respectful of them, considering how much man-handling they (necessarily) undergo. Basically it’s just a matter of letting them know what you are about to do. In answer to another poster - “what happens” when they get older and resist nappy changes? They don’t. If you’ve been respectful the whole time, and made nappy changes into a nice moment, the baby won’t scream and struggle. It’s pretty simple really.

GhostCurry · 24/08/2020 18:51

By the way, cheers for ignoring everything else I said in my post, OP.

lovelifehope · 24/08/2020 18:52

You need to chill out a bit and be less intense. As baby gets older be careful you don’t become too fussy and over protective of him. He’ll feel smothered and probably resentful. All this personal space stuff for a baby is bizarre as well. But saying all that, I don’t like the hand in mouth thing.

Paperthin · 24/08/2020 18:53

I don’t think you are being OTT. Your baby your rules so to speak. I think the putting hand into her mouth is both a. Disgusting and b. A way for her to try to disrespect your views and force her will onto you. She didn’t think you would both ( you and DH) react , it’s about power and her ‘rights’. Awful. You have stood up to her and hopefully avoided years of her wanting her own way with your child. Next will be the whispering into the toddlers ears, aww your mummy is being silly isn’t she/ don’t tell mummy she’s being mean etc etc.
I don’t get that so many people on MN think it’s ok to take a new born baby overnight without it’s mum ..... I find it really strange that anyone thinks that’s ok. Unless of course mum wants to...which is another thing entirely.

ekidmxcl · 24/08/2020 19:03

Has anyone heard of social distancing? It isn't ok for randoms (ie MIL's employee) to hold OP's baby because baby and employee won't be 2m apart. Not sure why anyone thinks that is appropriate, pandemic and all!

Also it's really weird for her to want to get the baby off you to spend the night with her. I mean WHY? Why does she want to separate a newborn from its mother. Bizarre.

MIL putting his hand in her mouth is also utterly ridiculous behaviour during a pandemic.

I don't think the OP is remotely OTT and my kids are teens so I'm way past all the baby stuff.

It'll be a bit sad for the baby not to have a close relationship with his granny, but his granny is the one causing all this strife.

tigger001 · 24/08/2020 19:12

@Rennlau It is totally disgusting to have anyone putting your babies fist in their mouth, pandemic or not. So not batshit.

I have always thought it weird when strangers feel entitled to hold a baby that is a complete stranger, why would they do that. Especially in the middle of a pandemic....So again not batshit

My DS has still never stayed over at anyone else's house and he's 3. He has never needed to and I'm not really sure what a 6 month old would get from staying in separate house to its parents...so yet again not batshit

No one has the right to shout at you, let alone in your own home and in front of your baby...So yet again not batshit to ask her to leave

If she can't respect your parenting style ,then yes, she has to stay away. Remember "you" are not doing this to her, she is doing this to herself by her behaviour, I would make that very clear to her and any other family members who have an opinion in the situation.

You are not OTT or batshit, you sound like a great mum.

otterbaby · 24/08/2020 19:14

You are not bonkers. Some of these responses are. I completely understand where you're coming from - my MIL has a lot of the same qualities that you've posted about. It's basically gotten to a point where I've had to withdraw from the relationship with her and just let my DH crack on. He supports me 100% but I acknowledge it's still his mum, and I don't want to come in between that. I'm not due until October, but already some of her behaviour has dictated how often we're visiting and how often she'll see baby and have overnight stays (never, for the latter). Really like @rvby's advice - just keep it short and sweet and focus on your lovely little family of 3.

Rennlau · 24/08/2020 19:16

@GhostCurry I'm sorry, I didn't mean to come across ignorant - your advice was great and needed I just didn't see that post until I went back to look for after reading your most recent.

We're trying not to be too rigid with RIE it feels a little unnatural when we tried to fully implement, so going with our instincts but using it as a guide, honestly I over explain as you can tell via my post so I think sometimes baby is just like 'I get the just let's do this'. I'm with you 100% on not over doing it, as I said we did try briefly but it felt forced and like were more preoccupied with doing it right rather than engaging with baby which defeated the purpose really.

Also, YES kn what you said about nappy changes I just engage with him, ask him to hold the nappy etc. Takes a little longer but sound for us and he doesn't try to wriggle away so it's not stressy. MIL did swoop in and do it once and we meekly protested beforehand, she put him across her lap, tried to be super speedy without saying a word him and he was hysterical, we didn't stop it and it's the most inadequate I have ever felt as a mum l.

Sorry again for not replying to all the positive you had to say sooner, I was a bit of a dick.

OP posts:
Rennlau · 24/08/2020 19:22

@OnceUponATimeInHollywood no, I don't think it equates to separation anxiety, at all.

I think they build up there immune systems all the typical ways babies do, having their hands put in people's mouth isn't one of them and me not allowing someone to do that to my baby isn't me not allowing him to be a baby.

OP posts:
Quacks2020 · 24/08/2020 19:25

I have a small baby and in a very similar position.
Hands in mouth is a bit OTT, over night DEFINITELY not, people holding your baby, again I'm a bit 'precious' too and wouldn't want a stranger holding my baby especially in a pandemic.
I'm also trying to assert myself and stand up to MIL but struggling. Whether people agree or not, think you're a little bonkers, you're setting boundaries and she needs respect them.
At the moment my MIL is really trying to get a rise out of me, I'm biting my tongue but I also realise when my daughter is older she will eventually notice the tensions. Not sure where it will go from here...

JollyJlly · 24/08/2020 19:28

Your baby. Your rules. What would you think if a friend told you this? What a rude women, better to keep your distance so that your DS learns that it’s ok to have boundaries and to stick to them.

I have had loads of things that have infringed on what we want for my DD we’ve always stood our ground because it’s our child therefore it’s OUR CHOICE. Frankly I don’t care if it’s batshit crazy it’s our child therefore we can choose (as long as we aren’t causing her harm obviously) what happens.

Big hugs OP stay strong.

Winterwoollies · 24/08/2020 19:30

I think @Rennlau got a rough time here. Why the fuck are people putting babies’ hands in their mouths??? And if I was nagged by my ILs for an overnight stay with my newborn, they’d get told to do one. How OP raises her baby is up to her and that trumps anything her MIL demands.

NoSquirrels · 24/08/2020 19:37

I have instincts of what to do, but often second guess myself and just need some confirmation I'm on the right track and other times I'm at a bit of a loss, but don't have another woman I feel comfortable with to seek advice from so I reach for a book or the internet.

All good. I think every first time mother experiences this to a greater or lesser degree. It’s why MN exists! As you’ve had great advice from other posters in this thread - it’s in the explaining your decisions, principles etc where you’re going wrong. People get super defensive over parenting decisions, even relatively uncontroversial ones. They hear your explanation of how you’re doing it, and they project onto that ‘They’re saying I did it all wrong with my baby’. Amplify this by 100 for mother-in-laws...

Decide your boundaries. Assert them politely but firmly, with as little fuss as possible. Accept others won’t necessarily agree and will always have an opinion. Decide not to care too much, and know when it matters to give in a little and bend a rule.

You’ll be grand.

mbosnz · 24/08/2020 19:40

When I was a new Mum, I was lucky enough to have a thread on a different forum, with the Haven Fruitbat Aunties. They were our rock and our saviour, far too often. They had kindness, wit, humour, wisdom, and much experience.

I think there's a few of those ladies on here too. . .

Jellybeansincognito · 24/08/2020 19:43

‘ MIL did swoop in and do it once and we meekly protested beforehand, she put him across her lap, tried to be super speedy without saying a word him and he was hysterical, we didn't stop it and it's the most inadequate I have ever felt as a mum’

This speaks volumes op.
Feeling inadequate as a mum because your child cried during a nappy change is not healthy for you or your baby. It needs addressing.

You’ll end up making your baby feel uncomfortable with others op. We all have our own ways of doing things, you can’t do a nappy change wrong op.

You can be supportive to your child’s needs and respect them as a person without being this OTT.

Incrediblytired · 24/08/2020 19:43

....and there was me thinking this would be another post where the MIL was unilaterally slagged off the whole way through!

OP

You are not bonkers.

You are not precious.

You are not OTT.

Someone has been pestering you to take your baby over night and you don’t want them to. That’s totally normal and ok, you know as well as I do that no one has the right to have your baby overnight apart from you. You should never have been put the position whereby you have to refuse.

The hand sucking think is revolting and germy...who the fuck does this? The pandemic makes it a worse. You know your baby will immediately put their hand in their own mouth, saliva and all...

Passing babies round strangers is odd. I know people like babies but they aren’t public property...and there’s a fucking pandemic.

Carry on as you are, you don’t have to explain your parenting style to anyone.

I cannot believe people think that you are precious and bonkers because you didn’t like MIL yelling in front of your baby. Yelling in front of a child is unacceptable and uncontained. How vile.

Tell MIL you are the mum and it’s your way or nothing.

Jellybeansincognito · 24/08/2020 19:47

I agreed with your post @Incrediblytired until op said about the nappy change stuff.
The mil can’t even do that right for goodness sake, imagine feeling like that about your own grandchild, must be awful.

ConquestEmpireHungerPlague · 24/08/2020 19:50

I've never heard of RIE parenting but it sounds like common sense to me. As does not letting people put your child's hand in their mouth during a global pandemic - or any other time for that matter. You have had some great advice from @rvby. Ignore the rest, especially all the bitchy mockery. And don't let MIL have him overnight until he's at least a teenager.

derxa · 24/08/2020 19:55

Do as you see fit OP but your baby will be what he is. You cannot manufacture a personality.

Shizzlestix · 24/08/2020 19:57

I think your mil is the mad one, not you. The only aspect where you’ve been unreasonable is walking on eggshells and waiting 6 months to tell her to get lost. What is the obsession with having a new baby overnight/alone? Now that you’ve told her, don’t back down. Putting his hand in her mouth is exceptionally obnoxious in the current climate. Passing him round to strangers is equally obnoxious: does social distancing not exist in your mil’s area?!

Sh05 · 24/08/2020 19:57

I see I'm late to the thread so haven't read the whole thing but I don't think it's normal to put a baby's hands in your mouth unless said baby pushes them in ( which is what my nearly 1 yr old has started to do.)
I also think that in covid times it has become less normal for babies to be be handed around for a cuddle and you are definately not over reacting.
You need to be more assertive but give no explanation just tell people to stop if you don't like what's happening, you are the parent and you are in charge

Alwaysinpain · 24/08/2020 20:01

[quote Rennlau]@Alwaysinpain, exactly I don't want him to become accustomed to thinking if an adult wants to give him a cuddle then an adult is intitled to do so, he can decide. I might be being para or overly cautious, but 1 in 20 kids are abused in the UK, I hope by doing what I am doing now that it somehow protects him - again, who knows if I'm right, but I'm trying really hard to be a good mum and do my best by him - that's my intent although, how I have articulated it comes across arsey af, so I understand where you are coming from.

I imagine one day he will spend the night, but as a baby I don't see any possible reason for him to do so, why stress him out with a new environment and have him have to feed from something he's never fed from before and I really can't be arsed having to pump before he goes or having to get up to do it while he's gone to avoid getting and sore boob, just so his gran can have him over night.

Just to be clear, he does let you know when he is okay being held, he puts his arms out if he wants held when you ask, he does this with the people in our 'bubble', but of course he doesn't always do this for his dad or I, we just tell him what we are doing as we are about to do, it might seem absolutely bonkers, but it works for us with little effort.

There are lots of reports of lockdown babies being overwhelmed and uncomfortable around people other than their parents, my baby fortunately has not been affected this way, he is self assured and confident baby (sorry mumsnet) I hope this has something to do with our parenting, we could just be lucky.

RIE isn't about not letting a child ever be held by anyone, of course he has and will be held by others.

I hope our parenting doesn't result in what you have described, our intent is the opposite, fingers crossed.[/quote]
Allowing people to give h a quick cuddle when he's 6 months old and in a happy, non-grumpy mood will not cause him to become abused HmmHmmHmm WTH?!

Alwaysinpain · 24/08/2020 20:03

[quote Rennlau]@Alwaysinpain, exactly I don't want him to become accustomed to thinking if an adult wants to give him a cuddle then an adult is intitled to do so, he can decide. I might be being para or overly cautious, but 1 in 20 kids are abused in the UK, I hope by doing what I am doing now that it somehow protects him - again, who knows if I'm right, but I'm trying really hard to be a good mum and do my best by him - that's my intent although, how I have articulated it comes across arsey af, so I understand where you are coming from.

I imagine one day he will spend the night, but as a baby I don't see any possible reason for him to do so, why stress him out with a new environment and have him have to feed from something he's never fed from before and I really can't be arsed having to pump before he goes or having to get up to do it while he's gone to avoid getting and sore boob, just so his gran can have him over night.

Just to be clear, he does let you know when he is okay being held, he puts his arms out if he wants held when you ask, he does this with the people in our 'bubble', but of course he doesn't always do this for his dad or I, we just tell him what we are doing as we are about to do, it might seem absolutely bonkers, but it works for us with little effort.

There are lots of reports of lockdown babies being overwhelmed and uncomfortable around people other than their parents, my baby fortunately has not been affected this way, he is self assured and confident baby (sorry mumsnet) I hope this has something to do with our parenting, we could just be lucky.

RIE isn't about not letting a child ever be held by anyone, of course he has and will be held by others.

I hope our parenting doesn't result in what you have described, our intent is the opposite, fingers crossed.[/quote]
It's actually been proven that babies & young children benefit both emotionally & physically from plenty of physical contact.

Alwaysinpain · 24/08/2020 20:07

@rvby

OP you need to learn to not talk so much.

I know that sounds harsh but hear me out.

You are very earnest, have all sorts of reasons for the things you think, etc. and you are obviously very interested in your own thoughts and opinions, as we all are. Additionally I think you probably like to be liked (as most of us do) and dearly wish to feel understood by others.

But part of becoming a grown up is realising that other people (speaking specifically of people you are not intimate/close with) very rarely give a shit what you think or how you feel. Typically they care about themselves only.

So if you want someone to not do something, just tell them "don't do that, thanks." That's it.

Do not launch into a carefully worded argument to convince the person that they shouldn't want to do the thing you've just told them not to do. Folk don't care what you think and they will feel attacked and patronised by your attempts to get them to think as you do. Explaining your reasoning does not help others get on board and do as you've requested - in fact it makes it more difficult, for the average person, because it makes them defensive.

By launching into a defense of your request, you're essentially inviting the other person to argue with you.

Keep it simple. Never complain, never explain - just tell your MIL (or whoever) to stop fucking doing that, and leave if she continues. Stop with the talking, start with the doing. You'll get better results that way.

People very rarely give a shit what you think or how you feel. Typically they care about themselves only.

I massively disagree. Rvby, you sound extremely damaged and have a disturbingly negative opinion of others, wow. Who hurt you?!