AIBU to wonder what 'very Catholic' means?

[Graunaile2017]

I read a comment on another thread describing parents as 'very Catholic '. I'm not from the UK so sometimes miss the nuance or underlying cultural meaning of comments like this, but it seems to imply negativity. What exactly constitutes 'very Catholic' and why is it bad?

OP, just to confuse you, to have 'Catholic tastes' in something - e.g. music - is to admire a wide selection of music/have a big record collection.

I'm a lapsed Catholic who despises all religion

@chomalungma

Very Catholic, you ask?

That would be an ecumenical matter.

@RealLifeHotWaterBottle

Sayitagainwhydontyou put of interest, were you raised Catholic?

Just, as a Catholic Im getting a lot of awful stereotypes from you but nothing that aligns with my own, my family or my friends experiences.

No, but my mother was, and i went to a Catholic school for 10+ years. I have a great deal of experience with "very Catholic" families.

Ah, so no then. That explains a great deal

I grew us as a Catholic in Ireland. I don't know anybody my age (mid 30s) who is very Catholic. My experience of very Catholic people are those who are in the same generation as my grandparents.

So, in my mind, very Catholic people are those who have very old fashioned and traditional views about the role of men and women in society and that the main authority in all aspects of life is the Church. It is quite a narrow interpretation of what people can expect from their life and what is permissible in order to live a good life.

I do find that for some reason it is acceptable in the UK to be quite derogatory about Catholics. It's one of the shittier aspects of living here.

My husband's OW was very Catholic= church every week, no contraception...
She took the MAP though, and seemed happy to keep having sex with him, didn't show any signs of feeling very guilty or of suffering over any moral dilemmas.
I don't pretend to understand

@RealLifeHotWaterBottle

Ah, so no then. That explains a great deal

I spent a decade going to mass every week and being educated by nuns. I know what being "very Catholic" means. The fact that I don't agree with the doctrine doesn't mean I don't understand what it means.

I was brought up in what I'd describe as "half arsed Catholicism". However my mother was very Catholic, religion was a great solace to her and helped her through some extremely difficult times in her early life.
She went to mass every Sunday, prayed at least twice a day, went to regular confession and was very active in church groups, etc. I think it would be fair to describe her as Very Catholic.
However, she is not homophobic, has been completely accepting of me and my girlfriend, turned a blind eye to the extensive pre marital sex my siblings and I engaged in with our partners and certainly does not condone child abuse.
I've yet to find a Catholic who does condone child abuse. Or literally believe in transubstantiation. Very, very few forgo contraception.
I went to secondary school with a lot of people from Baptist and Evangelical backgrounds (am in UK) and have found them much, much more likely to openly protest against abortion or gay marriage, or to believe in Young Earth Creationism and deny evolution. (I don't think my mother is entirely sure where she stands on this but she is very open to the Bible being taken metaphorically in parts).

There seems to be a vast chasm between what the Vatican preaches and what the majority of Catholics believe. I wouldn't call my mother "a little bit Catholic" just because she doesn't follow the Bible ad verbatim and, instead, tries to be as loving and tolerant a person as she can. Similarly, I wouldn't call people in newer denominations "a little bit Christian" just because they don't adhere to the teachings of the early church and have reinterpreted certain teachings. I imagine they'd find that quite offensive.

@newusername2009

Fascinated - I don’t use contraception so now you know someone. Nor do any of my sisters

I imagine it's fairly safe to assume someone is "very Catholic" (or at least from a very Catholic family) when they refer to "any of my sisters".

Gosh, I know some Catholics and they are more the SJW types to be honest, I don't think they're guilt tripping their kids about sex and are not homophobic, or women hating. Catholicism has a big PR job do in the UK I think :) Maybe push the fasting and fish on Friday's for the health benefits, and bury the sex rules.

Think it was my comment you’ve started thread on

I meant my gran has for example, told me I should be very afraid of the devil and hell . That I’ll end up there for being fat and gluttonous and various other things .

Topics of conversation are usually abortions, pre marital sex, why contraception is evil, why a woman’s place is in the home ... all other churches are wrong and the thought that you might respect them and their beliefs is insane and sinful .

Yes to masturbation being dirty - sex is for beasts and only ever if you really have to, ie to conceive and woe betide you if you enjoyed it .

Pope in every room, we were taught catechism as kids after school and confirmation was something you had to do - not a choice . Although sister with autism was exempt as told it was pointless her bothering .

Strong belief in corporal punishment ie belting .

When I was sixteen she told me if I was one of those ‘lezzies’ I needn’t ever think about coming home .

Funnily enough I have never yet told her . I was 27 when I told my mother - spent every night from 15 praying for hours to not be taken to hell !!

My gran was convent educated though, by nuns, in the 1950s and has always told me - you never question a nun or a priest, their word is final . She doesn’t believe that children and women have ever been abused by either .

Funnily enough most family have left the church now . Only a handful still go .

I believe in God, but I don’t believe He would want to punish me or have me suffer for being a lesbian (for example) . I don’t think I believe in hell .

Ballygowenwater you see I know loads of Catholics like that, so I’m not sure I’d call that “very Catholic”...ah, I don’t know. I think the phrase is loaded with negative connotations, but I mostly don’t have negative connotations of devout Catholics like your grandma so I wouldn’t apply it to them?

I remember my son asked me when he as about six “isn’t it hard to to be English and a Catholic?” And I think he had a point

Sayitagainwhydontyou so lets be clear, you didn't grow up in a household where the idea of confession vs absolution was taught, you didn't have a balance and clarification of what the lessons from school meant in a family basis. You didnt have conversations within a catholic family and with your priest on adult relationships and how best to navigate them.

Frankly, you don't know and the snatches you have had have biased you (see the child abuse comments) so that you come across not as either knowledgeable or dissenting but as ignorant and toxic.

Very Catholic to me means adhering very strictly to Catholic doctrine:
-no premarital sex
-no contracepted sex
-no masturbation
-no same sex experiences of any kind
-no divorce
-no interreligious relationships
All the while turning a blind eye to child sexual abuse

Wow. This is out of the ark! At least 70 years or more out of date I'd say! To add some balance to this thread ...

I'm RC and I am acquainted with hundreds of Catholics and while of course I can't tell you for sure if they masturbate or have had same sex experiences (pretty sure many of them do and have, and some of those are priests....!) most (but not all) use contraception, have had pre-marital sex, have inter-religious relationships, and all of them that I know well enough to talk to about the subject of child sexual abuse, decry and abhor it and feel utterly disgusted about the church's involvement and countless cover ups . And I can assure you (speaking for the laity that I know well and speaking for my Catholic school community ) we would NEVER turn a blind eye to any abuse of any kind , in fact rather the reverse is true , and everyone is on tenterhooks looking out for it.

Op, in this day and age, "very Catholic" in the UK could mean anything from weekly Mass attendance and observing the Sacraments, to being a fully paid up member of Opus Dei!

@BGirlBouillabaisse

OP, just to confuse you, to have 'Catholic tastes' in something - e.g. music - is to admire a wide selection of music/have a big record collection.

I'm a lapsed Catholic who despises all religion

I think catholic tastes is with a small 'c'.

Someone mentioned High Church. I thought this was an Anglican thing - the section of Anglicans who behave most like Catholics, but are not actually Catholics at all.

We aren’t Italian or anything btw - all raised in Scottish highlands (in relative isolation to be honest in my gran’s case) but Irish and Glaswegian ancestry .

@Sayitagainwhydontyou LOL "Vatican Roulette" love this. Made me laugh. Yeah I know a few crazies like this too. Generally baffling why in 2020 anyone lives by 6th century fairytale nonsense, but hey.

@RealLifeHotWaterBottle

Sayitagainwhydontyou so lets be clear, you didn't grow up in a household where the idea of confession vs absolution was taught, you didn't have a balance and clarification of what the lessons from school meant in a family basis. You didnt have conversations within a catholic family and with your priest on adult relationships and how best to navigate them.

Frankly, you don't know and the snatches you have had have biased you (see the child abuse comments) so that you come across not as either knowledgeable or dissenting but as ignorant and toxic.

I don't know many people who would call themselves "very Catholic" who have had that degree of interrogation of concept as part of their religious journey. You can rationalise and minimise as much as you like, but the fact remains that strict adherence to Catholic doctrine as per the Vatican is homophobic, anti-choice, anti-divorce, anti-women in leadership positions, anti-contraception and anti-premarital sex.

[quote jolokoy]@Hollywhiskey High church is a Protestant term - basically means those Anglicans who are still a bit Catholic (in vestments, liturgy etc). By definition cannot mean very Catholic.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_church[/quote]
Cross-posted Jolokoy

Hm, in lots of ways, and of course it varies depending on where you are. I mean of course there's the obvious things like the parades of burning crosses and signs saying NO POPERY (OP if you are not from the UK google this, it will blow your mind! . The littlest things like the reaction if you mention naming your children anything Irish on MN Baby names. It's deeply intertwined into our culture. The last penal laws were repealed in living memory, after all. It's not surprising.

It’s the confession.

Do what you like, then confess. I call it the Southern European variant of Catholicism as laughingly explained by various Italians.

Doesn’t work in the north. Too much Calvinism around!

It means more than just a bit catholic.

@jolokoy

Hm, in lots of ways, and of course it varies depending on where you are. I mean of course there's the obvious things like the parades of burning crosses and signs saying NO POPERY (OP if you are not from the UK google this, it will blow your mind! . The littlest things like the reaction if you mention naming your children anything Irish on MN Baby names. It's deeply intertwined into our culture. The last penal laws were repealed in living memory, after all. It's not surprising.

What part of the UK do you live in?

Sayitagainwhydontyou its unlikely you would, very few Catholics of any persuasion would describe them selves as "very catholic". I'll make sure the multiple priests I know - cousins, uncles and friends - are all aware they, especially the gay ones, just aren't catholic enough in your limited yet arrogant mind. Because despite dispensation from the Vatican, your own narrow beliefs dont fit in to what they can be.