To ask how you keep Friendships after kids?

[Danni290]

I do not yet have kids. But most of my friends now do, and an ongoing problem is that I can’t seem to see them.

And if I do, the kids are there. Not just some of the time, or even half the time. All of the time.

I’m not expecting them to always leave their kids - but equally I’m not a massively kid person (as they were not before they had their own!) so I’m finding it difficult.

Any suggestions? Would it be reasonable to say something? Or just keep quiet and keep meeting up with them and their kids?

I’ve hinted to not bring the kids - like let’s have a girls meet and it just doesn’t happen. Their kids are aged between 1-4 so I appreciate they’re young but like I said I’m not expecting them to always leave them just perhaps one in three or four times we meet, as we only meet every few months as it is.

I probably sound selfish but, as cute as the kids are I just feel like didn’t sign up for this! Conversation just isn't the same.

AIBU?

If I AIBU (or not) - suggestion please?

You aren’t selfish. I am one of the last in my group of friends to have a baby, and my 30s have been quite lonely as a result

In my experience, generally people meet new friends (other mums) on maternity leave and if they go back to work part time at toddler classes on days off. So things do start to grow apart. I don’t know what the answer is (I had my own, but I did want children anyway!)

I'd keep suggesting dinner / drinks / early evening dates. Or pedicures, bottomless brunches, cinema trips or theatre tickets. Something that's very kid unfriendly.

But also keep in mind that parenting during lockdown is bloody exhausting and they might be too mentally spent to jump at these days out for a bit.

I'm trying to think what would tempt me out. Tbh dinner and wine would do it!

The problem with the above suggestions is that they are costly too, and that needs to be a consideration.

As someone without kids but with a lot of friends who do have them, I’d suggest you do what you can to maintain those friendships even where compromise is involved e.g. accepting that the kids will usually be there when you meet up. As the kids get older things may change. You may also be rewarded with nice relationships with the children themselves.

It depends on what you want to do. When kids came along I couldn't do dinners out easily, and nights out were tricky and frankly I was so exhausted I didn't want to anyway. But I would happily do lunch with the girls if I had someone to look after the kids.

I was the first in my group to have children, and those girlfriends who didn't mind hanging out with my kids in the early days are still close friends and we often do days out without the children now. I just wasn't in a place where I could prioritise time with girlfriends over my kids in the little family time we had outside of work in the early days.

Also, if you are trying to get a whole group to meet up without kids, that's extra difficult. Not everyone have childcare on tap.

I imagine they'd much rather meet up without their kids too but at those ages its just really hard to get any child free time. Its the biggest adjustment of having kids, every single moment of childfree time has to be arranged with your partner or a babysitter. Even when both partners are totally committed it's still difficult.

Thanks for replies. I guess I also get frustrated and find it hard to understand why 2020 we are still unable to leave kids with partners for an afternoon - just literally three hours . I know for a fact when the guys go out they are not bringing the kids.

It's just annoying. The fathers are responsible too they're not useless men in the stereotypical sense.

Luckily I had friends who didn't mind he kids - as the main reason to see me was me. Babysitters here are very expensive, few want to do as hoc hours where I am (and to be honest I'm not happy with leaving them with some random off of care.com or whatever), and I have no other family here to watch the kids for me. They might not be your cup of tea, but very rarely can life even have a semblance of pre-kid normality for the first few years, at least until they're in school/can better entertain themselves for a while. Whilst I can't afford right now a £40 evening fee for a few hours babysitting, luckily.my friends have always been really understanding and we try our best to do our chat catchups whilst the kids are distracted with whatever.

If they're your friends, surely you'll be able to actually ask "why can't you leave them with the dad for a few hours?". Then you'd have your answer instead of having to guess via mn.

@YouJustDoYou lol that's a good point!

I’m currently in the stage of having young children and they are frequently there when I see friends; i grab opportunities to see friends without them but it’s few and far between and I kind of have to share those opportunities out between my friends so perhaps that means once a year I get to see individual friends without my DC. The other side of it is that as much as I want to see my friends and manage to finish a conversation I don’t see enough of my DC when I’m working so I don’t always want to be making plans where they then have to be with their dad.

You aren't selfish, as much as I love mine they're hardly the idea social accessory, I was desps for a night/brunch/dinner out and as soon as I’d finished breast feeding I was there!!

Everyone is so different though....i’ve had a few friends who've just not wanted to go out and leave their kids - even with DP/DH, which I was respectful of but even after having my own I still think is weird! Also depends how they're sleeping if yours doesn't sleep you’ll prioritise going to bed super early above everything else so evenings/nights are tricky.

There’s the DP issue as well, a lot won't admit it but some partners can be a bit lacking in confidence or just a bit useless so leaving them to do bedtime can be more trouble than it’s worth.

All these things can put a kibosh on evening activities.

A boozy brunch might be a good shout, no bedtime to navigate and you can be back and tucked up in bed at a decent time!!

@horsecalledseptember there's an expense - as there is with any sort of excursion, just look at soft play or cafes etc, but it doesn't have to be expensive to do those things. I live in London (for reference, not stating this to be a wanker) but there's £10-£15 manicure places, restaurants where you can eat for £8-£20, bars where you can get good drinks deals etc. Plus, there's things like groupon etc to get vouchers for.

I'm not sure where OP lives, but there's also free talks, exhibitions etc at museums, libraries and other local community hubs.

Or she could suggest an auction house or antiques fair or something.

As she's said 'friends' plural I'd assume she knows loads of people with kids so wouldn't be asking the same person to do a £30 activity each week

I'm still friends with those who embraced my children when meeting up. Those that didn't, those friendships fizzled out.

My DD1 refused the bottle and had an evening feed until she was almost 2. So nights up we're very rare as she would usually scream herself to sleep.

During the daytime, it was hard leaving DH with the children, if I'd been home all week. And when I went back to work, I wanted to spend as much time as possible with my DD. Money was also incredibly tight, with reduced salary and expensive nursery fees, so I didn't have the money for meals or big nights out.

I did meet friends, but on my own probably no more than once a month. Couldn't afford any more, but split that over the different friends, and it ends up that you don't get to see them without children very often.

Of course, when my friends then went on to have their children they got it. Now my children are older, I'm more than happy to leave them at home.

For me because I work all week and my kids are in child care so I don't really see them mom-fri- the 48 hours of the weekend are the only time I get to see them

There's been one or two childless friends I've actively cut out or avoided since having a child, and that's because…

They've not understood that I'm different now. Binge drinking, drugs, night clubs and holding her bag when she chats up randoms isn't fun for me

They pressure me too much to go out if my comfort zone - trying to get me to drink alcohol when I was pregnant, or go to all night parties when I was breastfeeding.

They got overly drunk and/or did drugs when I was sat their sober

They wanted to criticise my parenting choices (breastfeeding was disgusting) and told me I wasn't fun any more because I didn't want the same sort of nights out as when I was 25

Wanted to meet up with big groups of their friends and I didn't want to waste rare nights out making small talk with drunk strangers

Couldn't understand that my life was a lot smaller now - I didn't have the mental capacity for a night out passed 10pm on a work night when I had a non sleeping child and worked full time so was existing on 4 hours sleep a night

Bitched about how my child was 'always' sick or teething because they wanted to go out (I didn't cancel plans - just couldn't go out / drop everything to see them). But actively cancelled on me if they were tired or hungover.

(Was actively glad when I had miscarriages and was annoyed that I wanted more dc because they thought that I'd go back to being 25 again, somehow, when my dc was a toddler)

As long as you're not doing any of the above then you're probably ok to just ask them for a child-free meet up. The biggest reason for slowly fading friendships is when you're feeling exhausted, judged or guilty. So if you don't sulk or pressure and just ask if they're real mates they would either agree or give you a reason why it wouldn't work for them.

@Sarahbeans has pretty much summed it up!

Totally depends on the person. Some mums live and breathe every moment of their kids life. Others , look forward to them away. You need to find these ones!

Sorry I meant ... look forward to being away from them!

I've always met up with friends without my kids, if it's the evening. Nice to get out and feel non-mumsy. Also meet up with kids, but I don't do that with childless friends unless they ask! One of my closest friends has not met my three year old son, and last time she saw my daughter was 8.5 years ago!

I loved/love meeting up without kids whenever possible, it kept/keeps me sane

My friends and I made a commitment of the first Wednesday of every month, we do more now, kids are older, but we always had that one night.
We only missed when there was no option (e.g I was away on business sometimes but the other 4 met).
We have done this for 8 years non stop up until lockdown.
It took effort and commitment but I KNOW it kept us all close.

It's really hard to sustain friendships with people who don't particularly like my kids. Your post made me think of the good friends who have fallen by the wayside over the years. It's a shame but it was just too hard to find the extra child free time.

I remember calling my mum when my DS (my first) was little and saying he is there all the time and I never get a real break. I had no real idea. My kids are my responsibility 100% of the time. When my partner had him, I slept, got my hair cut, read a book or did something for me. Everything changed and nothing was the same.

I understand your point and YANBU, but if you feel like this imagine how your friends who have had kids feel. Today I didn't even pee alone, I have just sat down and my entire body aches.

Things are easier now the kids are slightly older and the friends without kids who embraced my new self (with added little people) are still around. The ones who didn't drifted away...

If they work full time, then they’re probably struggling massively with guilt over leaving them and wanting to make the most of their weekends - small children grow and change every day; blink and you’ll miss it.

There’s also lack of sleep to contend with and the complicated calendar organisation with partners. Throw a bad sleeper into the mix (yes, kids are individuals and cannot all be ‘trained’ in the same way) and an evening out just isn’t worth it.

Most of my friends had children before me, and I was always happy to do days out to parks/farms/soft play etc or even just a cuppa in the garden. A few of them are now at the stage where their oldest ones can be left home alone for a few hours of an evening so are more free, yet are understanding that I am at the bottom rung of that particular ladder right now!

Children change your life outlook, regardless of how much you insist that it won’t happen to you. Be accommodating now, and your friends will do the same for you in the future.

I think when you next make plans you need to make it clear it’s a girls night eg evening out, spa day. If you just ask them for a coffee or lunch or something she’s child friendly then I don’t think they’re being unreasonable.

Another point to consider is do they have childcare? We have no help so I have the baby when DH is at work and visa versus so for me to have a child free day out he would have to take time off work or it would have to be an evening when he’s home.