Confused by this conversation, does anyone have an idea what went wrong

[SkatingWithPenguins]

I’d just used the self scan machine at the library. It’s broken, you normally just pile up the books but at the moment you need to open them to scan the barcode inside. Everytime you scan it opens a meaningless error message too. You have to click the x to close it. Annoying, but it works.

I was talking to my friend, librarian just finished a shift and in uniform, her son isn’t well and we were probably very deep in conversation in a corner. Very angry woman cut across us and said ‘the machine doesn’t work!’. My friend was approached from behind and was a bit wrong-footed, had jumped out her skin in surprise and as collecting herself (it was like someone shouting ‘boo’ from behind it was so sudden and loud). So I just smiled and said
‘It works, it’s just playing up. You need to open each book individually And scan the barcode inside. It’ll give you error messages, but ignore them and close them. The books will still be counted’
She glared at me- ‘IT DOESNT WORK!’
I’m, ‘give it a try, just open them’
‘IT DOESNT WORK, I have tried‘
‘Did you open a book?‘
So she throws them, closed, onto the machine and angrily points at the error message.
So I just said, calmly ‘the books need opening’. She picked them up, still both closed, and started flinging them back down to raise her voice more.
My friend then starting offering to do it for her (not really meant to with Covid rules, but was trying to diffuse it). Got as far as ‘shall I do it for-‘
The women then screamed at her, I’m not standing here being told off by you! I feel like I’m being told off! I’m going to the desk!
The new librarian on the desk looked over worried, people are mean to use the machines right now. I didn’t stay to see how it panned out.

The machine does have a sign on it explained how to currently use it.

She was about 30, seemed well presented and otherwise normal.

It’s bugging me as I’m struggling how it went so wrong, how I ended up being shouted at in public. I was genuinely happy to help her use the machine that annoys me, no edge to my voice.

@TwentySixPointTwo I think the difficulty was with Covid is that she either needs to use the machine alone, or not take the books out under the rules. Normally it’s a bit more ‘scan them at the desk’. If she won’t accept it’s possible then she needs to leave the books

@Coriandersucks

Only on mn do I read about people “screaming” at others. Not raising a voice, or shouting even, but literally screaming...

People absolutely do scream at staff. I had people scream at me. Makes you wonder how they behave when they are not in public when they can do that in front of people

@DianaT1969 there is a large and a small sign on and by the machine saying exactly how it works and describing the problem.

Explain, genuinely don’t get it? It's a long ago thread about a woman who screamed in bliss at the Sistine Chapel ceiling - might have turned out to be a troll, but it was amusing at the time. Probably made Classics.

Sorry, I see someone linked to it whailst I was typing, searching unsuccessfully for the thread and being interrupted by a phone call.

Sorry!

@SchrodingersImmigrant for context I use the words like this: if someone raises their voice I use ‘shout’, if someone’s voice is raised and also goes high pitched with potential for bits of spit flying I use ‘scream’.
I don’t use it to mean out of control wailing and flailing limbs or something, like a toddler tantrum screaming. Make more sense?

Can you really not imagine that sometimes, people just lose it? What’s to understand? You’d have to be a bit dim to not get that 🤷🏻‍♀️

If you want to post in Chat that you had a shitty experience for a combination of gossipy drama and attention sympathy, fill your boots. No need to falsely turn it into an AIBU (for more traffic... )

FWIW, I wouldn’t have shouted at anyone, but I’d have been irritated by some random butting in, combined with the person who actually worked there (in uniform, not obviously off shift) not helping.

The woman was a cunt.

Just because she may be having a bad day does not excuse her behaving badly to staff.

I hope the library puts up signs saying that abusive customers will be asked to leave and have their accounts cancelled.

@SkatingWithPenguins

I guess it was a joke, but I’m just feeling a bit crap over it all and maybe not on form

Someone once shouted at me on the tube because my feet were too close to hers. Someone else on a bus was eating big prawns and deliberately dropping the shells on the floor. I hadn't even said anything and she shouted at me that it was none of my business and what the fuck was my problem.

People get angry and shout becuase they are twats. People get angry when tech doesn't work quite right, especially if she wouldnt normally have used it and was being forced to becuase of covid.

You really need to try to just brush it off. You did nothing wrong.

And the idea of someone being so overwrought about a scanner that they actually screamed in what is meant to be a generally quiet place is pretty funny.

Can you really not imagine that sometimes, people just lose it? What’s to understand? You’d have to be a bit dim to not get that

People shouldn't be "losing it" at other people. If you can't hold of from behaving aggressively at people in public, you shouldn't be in public. Would people be ok with someone "just losing it" at their partner? No. So why is it ok to abuse strangers

I work a till for a living.

I STILL can't get self-scanning machines to work for me and I get quite annoyed (with the machines) whenever I am trying to use one in a shop. Anyone listening to me would think I was being a right cow - but it's just frustration.

Customer was frustrated, that's all. It happens. Don't worry about it.

There are a lot of angry people about. Some are stressed etc and some just bad mannered.

She was unreasonable and you tried to help but she wasn't open to listening. It would probably be better to just say nothing after she ranted back at your first attempt to help. She wanted someone to shout at (for lots of reasons) and because you interacted with you - you got it.

itsgettingweird
"Sounds like she already had stuff going on and was stressed.

If you are feeling like that and then something goes wrong you're usually already past the point of being reasonable"

SchrodingersImmigrant
"People should stop excusing abusive behaviour towards staff..."

Strongly agree with SchrodingersImmigrant. Nothing excuses that sort of behaviour. If you are so out of control of your own temper that you can't cope with a minor setback like that (and listen when somebody tries to help you) then you have no business in a public space and need to walk around for a while to calm down.

I can't stand people who think it is OK to behave like that to another person and then try to find excuses for it. No excuse, just an ill-mannered dick.

I think we are very accepting at people 'just losing it' .... some seem to lose it a lot and over very trivial things. Some adults have a very toddler like response to anything that goes wrong. Strange though because when children act like that some adults are very judgemental! Anger management course might be useful.

As a society we seem to be becoming more angry (an opinion before the angry MN's jump on it) and seem to be unable to control emotions - hence the toddler like reactions over silly things.

She was also presumably frustrated at what she saw as a member of staff chatting to her friend instead of working. She couldn't be expected to know either the intricacies of your friend's personal life, or that she had finished work. Additionally, your friend could have defused the situation by explaining the non-working/working machine to her. Even though she was off duty she was still standing in a uniform in her workplace. I think most people would ask a nurse, in a uniform, where the lift was in a hospital, without stopping to think "she/he might be off duty"

@SchrodingersImmigrant

Can you really not imagine that sometimes, people just lose it? What’s to understand? You’d have to be a bit dim to not get that

People shouldn't be "losing it" at other people. If you can't hold of from behaving aggressively at people in public, you shouldn't be in public. Would people be ok with someone "just losing it" at their partner? No. So why is it ok to abuse strangers

@SchrodingersImmigrant I’m not suggesting for a moment that it is OK!!!! Of course it’s not. I only said I don’t see what there is to understand.

• some people are arseholes, full stop
• some people are generally OK but have been pushed the end of their tether and this was the straw that broke their back
• some people have mental health issues

None of those make it OK for the recipient, but I guess we’d assign different levels of arseholery to each of those potential explanations.

It’s not OK to lose it at anyone. But I don’t think this is an AIBU question. Some people do - wrongly - shout at innocent people tying to help. It’s not reasonable. But no-one can why it’s happened here, and I’m surprised the OP doesn’t have the imagination to come up with arsehole / end of tether / mentally unwell possibilities herself.

Totally this (adults shouldn't really 'lose it' with staff over the simple things, especially when some judge when children have a similar behaviour pattern:

*SchrodingersImmigrant
"People should stop excusing abusive behaviour towards staff..." *

For the reference about this being better in chat, I think it’s more likely to get insight in aibu. You have a certain different mindset to shout at people in public, and people with this mindset tend to go to Aibu. It’s where you find the angry people who would react like this, and where you might hear WHY people do things like this. Some posters here do think it’s quite normal or explainable to shout at people in public, get irritated really easily. Chat would just be a load of photos she’s horrible’ responses. I’m wondering and trying to unpick how it happens, I like to avoid situations like this- and you only really can if you learn to understand people like this.

People absolutely should stop excusing abusive behaviour towards staff.

I'm still not convinced from the OP that ScreamingWoman didn't have a point.

I assume that people behaving aggressively in public abuse people in their household. I do. If someone is so out of control they can't behave in public and end up abusing people around, I can only imagine how horribly they must behave behind closed door...

This behaviour wouldn't be tolerated in any other setting eg. Boss-employee, partner-partner, child-parent, ot shouldn't be tolerated towards strangers eother.

@Ellisandra you miss the other reason, that I think this reinforces: she just simply considers this a normal way to act and an acceptable way of getting her needs met.

Personally in any store if I see a staff member I begin with ‘excuse me, can you help?’. They could be engaged in helping someone else, off duty, not working in that area, or any other reason why I can’t just cut across them and demand they jump to serving me that second. I’d approach a nurse yes, but not with an immediate expectation she dropped everything to direct me.

I like to avoid situations like this- and you only really can if you learn to understand people like this

But you've been given lots of theories. That technology not working frustrates people, especially if they don't want to use it in the first place. That you sounded like you weren't listening by stating "it does work" rather than agreeing it doesn't work and that there is a way to get round that. That as you weren't in uniform she could have seen you as interfering. That a lot of people right now are more stressed than usual and reacting worse.

None of the above make it ok that she shouted at you but they possibly explain why it happened. But you seem to still be looking for some deeper reason to unpick and I don't think there is one. Nor is there any point dwelling on it further.

Librarian here who had the joyous task of getting self-issue installed in two previous jobs (small libraries, thankfully) - it doesn't sound like you did anything wrong; but lots of people are having real issues dealing with the pandemic (and lots of other things right now). Plus, as I've learned over the years, nobody EVER reads instructions, no matter how clear you make them. Plus, there's a reason (some) Aussies used to refer to us as "whingeing Poms"...

And on the uniform thing, none of the libraries I worked in made us wear uniform though it was intermittently discussed. I mean, you know, giant sized (or in my case pint sized) human shushing machines are scary enough without making them wear uniform...though I did know of one that made their staff wear bright green sashes. (Usually the name badge gives it a way a bit.)

I don’t think it’s the posters who are different between Chat and AIBU.
It’s largely the same posters, and their behaviour changes because of the board environment.

Generally in life, it’s not seen as acceptable to go around telling people that they’re wrong. “If you can’t say anything nice, don’t say anything at all.”

AIBU turns that on its head, because it’s very title invites you to tell the poster that they’re wrong. Obviously there’s a lot of posters who don’t want to be told they’re wrong at all! But that’s the basic premise, and many do want he ruins opinions.

To me, it’s like showing your appreciation at a football match vs the theatre.
I am one person, but I will:

• loudly shout, “get in there, you are a fucking legend!!!”
• softly clap, and stand at the end

I am more likely to challenge on AIBU than on chat, because that’s what it is for.

Of course if someone is an argumentative arsehole they’ll be keener on AIBU than Chat... but I think that’s a minority, and the main factor is the environment of the board, not the person. I’ve seen far too many lovely, kind, funny, caring, helpful posts on AIBU to think that AIBU posters are argumentative en masse.

I think it’s a bit much to suggest you’ll get better insight from AIBU posters as they’re more like this rude woman than Chat posters

[quote SkatingWithPenguins]@Ellisandra you miss the other reason, that I think this reinforces: she just simply considers this a normal way to act and an acceptable way of getting her needs met.

Personally in any store if I see a staff member I begin with ‘excuse me, can you help?’. They could be engaged in helping someone else, off duty, not working in that area, or any other reason why I can’t just cut across them and demand they jump to serving me that second. I’d approach a nurse yes, but not with an immediate expectation she dropped everything to direct me.[/quote]
How did I miss it?
It’s right there in my reason number one: “some people are arseholes, full stop” 🤷🏻‍♀️