Confused by this conversation, does anyone have an idea what went wrong

[SkatingWithPenguins]

I’d just used the self scan machine at the library. It’s broken, you normally just pile up the books but at the moment you need to open them to scan the barcode inside. Everytime you scan it opens a meaningless error message too. You have to click the x to close it. Annoying, but it works.

I was talking to my friend, librarian just finished a shift and in uniform, her son isn’t well and we were probably very deep in conversation in a corner. Very angry woman cut across us and said ‘the machine doesn’t work!’. My friend was approached from behind and was a bit wrong-footed, had jumped out her skin in surprise and as collecting herself (it was like someone shouting ‘boo’ from behind it was so sudden and loud). So I just smiled and said
‘It works, it’s just playing up. You need to open each book individually And scan the barcode inside. It’ll give you error messages, but ignore them and close them. The books will still be counted’
She glared at me- ‘IT DOESNT WORK!’
I’m, ‘give it a try, just open them’
‘IT DOESNT WORK, I have tried‘
‘Did you open a book?‘
So she throws them, closed, onto the machine and angrily points at the error message.
So I just said, calmly ‘the books need opening’. She picked them up, still both closed, and started flinging them back down to raise her voice more.
My friend then starting offering to do it for her (not really meant to with Covid rules, but was trying to diffuse it). Got as far as ‘shall I do it for-‘
The women then screamed at her, I’m not standing here being told off by you! I feel like I’m being told off! I’m going to the desk!
The new librarian on the desk looked over worried, people are mean to use the machines right now. I didn’t stay to see how it panned out.

The machine does have a sign on it explained how to currently use it.

She was about 30, seemed well presented and otherwise normal.

It’s bugging me as I’m struggling how it went so wrong, how I ended up being shouted at in public. I was genuinely happy to help her use the machine that annoys me, no edge to my voice.

😁

I laughed out loud at that trolling from @EatsShootsAndRuns, thanks for lightening my mood. You do need to really work on being cutting if that is your aim.

I certainly don’t miss working in customer facing roles. I think Covid has probably added a level, normally people just get placated by someone doing it for them and it wasn’t offered straight away.

All libraries I’ve been in have logged polo shirts or similar

She was just in a bad mood. You were right to leave it to the staff. Who should have taken over anyway rather than standing back.

If you want a critique the obvious problem in the exchange is that you didn’t accept and acknowledge what she said. Doing that means she feels less stupid about saying the machine is broken, which it was. Then the issue becomes about helping her scan. From her perspective you would come across as refusing to agree the machine was broken.

What was the ceiling decor like?

Maybe it was the sign on the machine that was masterful.

@EatsShootsAndRuns

It’s not about being the perfect citizen. When strangers are randomly rude or aggressive for no apparent reason it can be quite shocking and demeaning. It can knock your confidence too.

I had someone behave like that towards me in Tesco and it did play on my mind for a while because it made me feel tiny and of little worth (already have issues in that department). I talked myself up and told her she was the one with the problem, not me, and felt sorry for her not realising how rude she was.

I guess those working in customer services must deal with this shit daily!

OP don’t give it much thought, she could be having a bad day, going through a stressful time, have mental health issues or is just generally like that.

@WorraLiberty

I can't believe someone actually screamed in the library.

What was the ceiling decor like?

Hang on- is the librarian in the uniform the OP's friend? I'd missed that bit.

So, librarian/friend has explained to OP you have to basically ignore the error message and do a different thing to what you usually do and machine works, then ScreamingWoman approaches and wants to speak to librarian/friend about non working machine and OP cuts in? And SW screams because she doesn't realise librarian is off duty (because uniform) etc?

SW can hardly be blamed for not knowing librarian/friend is now off duty or that machine works if you do the opposite of what it's telling you.

I can't believe someone actually screamed in the library.

What was the ceiling decor like?

Explain, genuinely don’t get it? It happens. Shit happens. Libraries are multi use spaces nowadays, dealing with everything from blue badge, benefit supports , various applications for the council such as housing forms. Agreements to use PCs for job hunting. It gets heated at times, people get frustrated , not infrequently. Some homeless people use it for shelter in corners, occasionally it spills over into disagreement around this. This isn’t a 1950s picture book of libraries. A modern city library in the real world, lots of staff around

@Villanemme

She wanted to talk to the librarian and wondered why you were butting in?

This

Sounds like she already had stuff going on and was stressed.

If you are feeling like that and then something goes wrong you're usually already past the point of being reasonable

You did nothing wrong and it's something you just have to account happened, would have happened to whoever was there and move on.

People should stop excusing abusive behaviour towards staff...

Op, search for Sistine chapel screamer😂

I can't believe someone actually screamed in the library.

What was the ceiling decor like?

It's a reference to a Mumsnet Classic thread about someone who screamed in the Sistine Chapel - her Stendahl Syndrome moment.

@OnePotato2Potato that does sum it up. I walked home feeling quite shit and it played on my mind. I think because it was unexpected, I was actively trying to be decent. If I’m being a cow it doesn’t upset me, but the shouting when I was being open and not defensive or aggressive got to me. Guess you also feel stupid in these situations, you get looked at by other people and feel like a right twat

@SkatingWithPenguins the bit about the ceiling decor was in reference to this classic - www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3178898-DH-embarrassed-by-my-sensitivity.

And was excellently slipped in by Worra!

So, librarian/friend has explained to OP you have to basically ignore the error message and do a different thing to what you usually do and machine works, then ScreamingWoman approaches and wants to speak to librarian/friend about non working machine and OP cuts in? And SW screams because she doesn't realise librarian is off duty (because uniform) etc?

Not sure about the last sentence but yes, it was OP doing the explaining.

Maybe this is the library equivalent of going to the GP and having the receptionist trying to diagnose you?

Oh, I get the link now. It’s a bit tenuous with the image I had in my head to crying and wailing at paintings until your husband drags you out/ you’re asked to leave. This one was a in control person

@SkatingWithPenguins

I can't believe someone actually screamed in the library.

What was the ceiling decor like?

Explain, genuinely don’t get it? It happens. Shit happens. Libraries are multi use spaces nowadays, dealing with everything from blue badge, benefit supports , various applications for the council such as housing forms. Agreements to use PCs for job hunting. It gets heated at times, people get frustrated , not infrequently. Some homeless people use it for shelter in corners, occasionally it spills over into disagreement around this. This isn’t a 1950s picture book of libraries. A modern city library in the real world, lots of staff around

I know, part of my job involves working in a library and a lot of them have become community 'One Stop Shops' now. Totally different to how libraries once were.

The ceiling reference was to an old thread in classics.

@SkatingWithPenguins

Oh, I get the link now. It’s a bit tenuous with the image I had in my head to crying and wailing at paintings until your husband drags you out/ you’re asked to leave. This one was a in control person

It was a joke! You said then woman was screaming which seems a little unlikely. Shouting maybe. The screaming just made the link to another famous screamer. Nobody was actually suggesting they were similar situations.

Seriously sometimes people are just dicks and aggressive and shout at strangers. There's nothing more to unpick.

I suppose in future the response is ‘can you go to the desk and stand in the queue’ rather than being helpful!
My friend, off duty but in uniform didn’t owe a reply any more than I did. Even if she was on duty the woman has no idea what we were talking out, it could have been sensitive benefit help, and there were other staff free within her sight line. She was slow replying herself as a combination of Being startled from behind and being a bit emotional over the conversation, she just stood there- so I spoke pleasantly

She absolutely shouldnt have been rude but even a reasonable debate that goes

"It's not working"
"It is"
"No it's not"
"Yes it is"

Can escalate into a arguement because by contradicting what she is saying you are automatically putting each of you on opposing sides and pushing her towards the defensive.

To de-escalate you would respond to agree with her and - in fairness - a machine that errors when it's not supposed to is NOT working correctly. So instead of responding with "It is working", you respond with " It's not but you can get round it like this..." This places you both on the same side and requires no defence.

Of course, humans are all sorts of unpredictable so she might still have blown up...

I'd assume she has a similar mindset to the many many MNers that don't read an OP or other relevant posts properly - the information is there but it doesn't go in before they react, then they can't "recalibrate" their being in the wrong with what they've been told.

Not really intended to be a dig, just something i've observed.

I follow a few librarians on social media, seems like this is in the realms of normal behaviour for a public space like this.

Things like this are tipping people over the edge at the moment.
My local M&S never have staff on a normal till these days. The self-scan machines are only suitable for about 5 items due to the tiny shelves. They are also obsessed with 10p bags, asking about 4 times if you used one. It is inducing rage. M&S isn't cheap and we'd shop at the supermarket across the road which does have spacious 'real' tills if they were up front about offering awful service.

I guess it was a joke, but I’m just feeling a bit crap over it all and maybe not on form

Only on mn do I read about people “screaming” at others. Not raising a voice, or shouting even, but literally screaming...

Also, haven't read the full thread, but why on earth didn't library staff put a sign on the machines saying 'open books to scan code and ignore error messages. Apologies while we wait for our IT department to fix this'.