AIBU or is DH over this petty argument?

[StupidArgument]

For background, DH has a brother in law, Brian, who is quite pedantic, he likes things his way, he doesn't like windows or doors open or unlocked, even in the recent hot weather.

DH and I today have had a nice day, went for a long dog walk and made a nice dinner, watched a film etc but towards the end of the day we were both feeling a bit bored.

DH asked if we could go to bed early tonight, it was 8:30, I said fine shall we finish watching this program and go up at 9? He said "I have to be up really early" so I said should we just go up now then, but I was slightly irritated because we ended up having a conversation about it with him being a bit funny with his answers to me and me having to guess what he was hinting at instead of just saying "can we go to bed now as I have to be up really early".

Then, I was locking up and he had a moan at me about where I put my keys for the night and that I shouldn't put them there, I should put them there instead, and how I didn't lock the bolt properly. I didn't really say anything to him about it in reply.

He went upstairs before me, and as I was walking up he called to me "I wish you'd be a bit more security conscious" and I said "what do you mean?" and he said "you've left all the windows open up here". Five windows are open, 3 are just on the latches so can't be opened more, one was fully opened by him and one by me. I told him this and he started saying "don't come crying to me when someone robs you" and I just snapped and said "sorry, Brian"

He called me a sarcastic bitch and then he called me "Doreen" - my Mum's name. He said it was disgusting that I'd called him Brian and that I'd really hurt him. I said "Look, I'm sorry I called you that--" and he cut me off and said "you need to apologise to me". We got into a stupid, petty argument then with him saying "you need to apologise to me" and me saying "I just did" over and over, and writing all this down it just sounds absolutely ridiculous. He told me I can fuck off and that he doesn't accept my apology and went to get in the shower. I changed the bed sheets and when he came back I apologised again but he still told me to fuck off and that he doesn't accept my apology as I really hurt him. I left him for half an hour watching TV in bed while I came in another room and then tried apologising again but he said the same.

I do feel bad now for saying that as I only said it because I was annoyed and my temper flared, but I felt like I had kept my cool about the stuff before and having a go about open windows, when it is still warm and stuffy here, it just pushed me over the edge and I snapped at him.

AIBU or is he? Or are we both just BU and childish? He's gone to sleep now, what should I do in the morning?

@Phbq
"The mind boggles*
Why, it's pretty clear

@StupidArgument
"DH doesn't like him, and they fell out recently. To be fair, Brian isn't really a very nice person to be honest."
Neither is your DH by the sound of it

@BubblyBarbara
If you don’t even go to bed at the same time you’re more like room mates than a couple to me
Never has a username been so inappropriate
You should hookup with "Bubbly Brian"

Congratulations on your interview, OP, that was a brilliant achievement and all the best.

Your DH's behaviour towards you is that of a father to a teenager not a husband and a controlling one at that. My DH would never pick me up from a night out; he hardly ever did that when we didn't have our DDs because I could, you know, book a taxi.

It's great that the scales are coming off your eyes.

@StupidArgument
I'm 33 and DH is 35. We've been together 15 years.
From your posts I figured you were mid fifties.
Are you planning on having children with Brian?

He is sabotaging you and on some level you know that which is why you haven't told him about the job interview.

He is a humourless, coercively controlling bully.

I hope you can leave, you've only got one amazing life, why live it like this?

@StupidArgument I haven't remarried but bounced almost straight into another relationship because I was so desperate to have kids, which I did, but the relationship failed because again, it wasn't right. I'm now a single parent but much happier for it. I think I struggle with relationships and spotting the signs of abuse after growing up with emotional abuse from my mum. It took me years to realise that she was emotionally abusive and it only became clear how bad it was when I was doing safeguarding training at work. Until then I just thought she was a bit of a nightmare but the training made me realise how she'd chipped away at my confidence and self worth over the years.

I do have kids now and I'm staying single as I don't trust myself to not end up with another idiot and I'm not prepared to inflict that on them. If I could go back and do anything differently I would go it completely alone and use a sperm donor. In the future when they're older I might consider dating again but I'm really happy on my own, and for the first time feel totally in control of my own life. never again will I creep around on eggshells, for a man or my bloody mother, and I definitely won't put my dc in that situation.

Feel free to pm me if you want to chat x

This is heartbreaking to read-OP I hope you can find it in yourself to get out of this awful relationship. The trouble with being with one man your whole adult life is that you have no comparison or understanding of how relationships vary. Yours is abusive and not right in any sense. Please keep posting here and taking strength from the support of the wise mumsnetters who have been through similar and come out the other side. I know it’s scary but there’s a life out there waiting for you, away from this awful man. Where you can be you, be free. Good luck with your interview but prepare yourself for him to make life extremely difficult when he finds out about your plans. You will need outside support, can you lean on anyone in RL?

[quote StupidArgument]@nicknacky we've always just gone to bed at the same time at DH's insistence, I don't care much either way[/quote]
You know you actually don't have to now

@StupidArgument

Congratulations on the interview. Go in there, be positive and be clear about why you want to be a teacher and you'll be fine.

What follows isn't intended to piss on your chips. It's to allow you to prepare.

First of all, to study anything at higher education level, there is a lot of work to do. Essays to write, studies to carry out etc. The student needs a supportive family, and I don't think from what you've written you'd get that. There would certainly be some nights when there's no way you'd be going to bed at 8.30/9.00, you'll be lucky to hit the pillow before 2.00 am. The other people at home need to understand that you have to do these essays etc and be happy to take some of the other loads off you, to give you peace and quiet to write and think, to understand when you have to put your studies first.

But it can be worse. I've taught a few mature degree students whose husbands/partners have been actively antagonistic. Examples include...

Burning the student's work the night before it's due in - when it's a project that can't just be reprinted from the computer.

Deleting the student's essays on the computer. They had to be very careful about backing up regularly, and emailing themselves the work in progress. A memory stick can suddenly disappear.

Putting textbooks in the bin the night before/day of the bin collection.

You get the drift. Getting the place to study would be great, but from your posts, I'd bet my last bottle of merlot that it would only be the start of your problems. Please think about how you are going to deal with him when he doesn't like what you're doing and will do whatever he can to sabotage you.

On a brighter note, doing their degree has led to most of my students in that position to realise that their DP/DH's behaviour is unacceptable and given them the confidence to leave the relationship. The benefits you get from higher education aren't always just the qualification.

[quote Feedingthebirds1]@StupidArgument

Congratulations on the interview. Go in there, be positive and be clear about why you want to be a teacher and you'll be fine.

What follows isn't intended to piss on your chips. It's to allow you to prepare.

First of all, to study anything at higher education level, there is a lot of work to do. Essays to write, studies to carry out etc. The student needs a supportive family, and I don't think from what you've written you'd get that. There would certainly be some nights when there's no way you'd be going to bed at 8.30/9.00, you'll be lucky to hit the pillow before 2.00 am. The other people at home need to understand that you have to do these essays etc and be happy to take some of the other loads off you, to give you peace and quiet to write and think, to understand when you have to put your studies first.

But it can be worse. I've taught a few mature degree students whose husbands/partners have been actively antagonistic. Examples include...

Burning the student's work the night before it's due in - when it's a project that can't just be reprinted from the computer.

Deleting the student's essays on the computer. They had to be very careful about backing up regularly, and emailing themselves the work in progress. A memory stick can suddenly disappear.

Putting textbooks in the bin the night before/day of the bin collection.

You get the drift. Getting the place to study would be great, but from your posts, I'd bet my last bottle of merlot that it would only be the start of your problems. Please think about how you are going to deal with him when he doesn't like what you're doing and will do whatever he can to sabotage you.

On a brighter note, doing their degree has led to most of my students in that position to realise that their DP/DH's behaviour is unacceptable and given them the confidence to leave the relationship. The benefits you get from higher education aren't always just the qualification.[/quote]

Of my goodness! How can people be SO evil? I thought my life had hard bumps along the way but it was nothing to any of this.

I really wish you strength and light OP and the focus to get away from your saboteur as soon as you possibly can! 🌹

@Feedingthebirds1 that is a great piece of advice! When we know what happens it's much less easy to accept them saying 'i threw them out by mistake' 'how was I to know' 'you should have told me it was important' etc etc. We start to see there are no honest mistakes just sabotage.

I'd strongly recommend backing up into the cloud via a secure online backup each night. I use dropbox and I could be wrong but I think it's got a lot of backup built in. Free too for smaller accounts. Plus you can set up two factor authentication so it texts you if someone's trying to log in..

@Feedingthebirds1 I think if I get offered this place, I will be doing it without DH. He wouldn't support me to do it. I know it will be hard work, I have friends who are Primary Teachers so I'm under no illusion as to the amount of work involved but I can do it.

That's so awful about what people's partners have done to them on their course. It's actually made me remember, when I was in my early 20s I started doing some wedding photography, and my first job paid me £200 by cheque and I thought it was so amazing. It was in an envelope with my name on it, and I went to get it out of the drawer to put it in the bank and couldn't find it anywhere. DH helped me looked for it but I could tell he knew where it was, he'd ripped it in half and thrown it into the bin and then taken the bin out to the wheelie bin. He said he thought the envelope was empty but I don't know why he wouldn't have just looked in it?

He knew damn well it wasn't empty. Did you ask the couple to cancel that cheque, and write you another one?

If you get the uni place, look into going into halls.

I hope you get a place. Good luck.

@StupidArgument because he absolutely knew what was in it?? !

Why else would he tear it in half along with throwing it in the bin?

That's not normal. Not normal at all.

Why did you apologise multiple times 😳 after the first apology you gave and he didn't accept I'd have just said fine and gone back down to watch TV.

We usually also go to bed together, but if I'm engrossed in something he's not, it's not a biggy. He just goes up and is usually watching something in the bedroom.

Oh crap....sorry I can see things have moved on, I though the full thread had loaded on the app!!

He is a sinister man, not a partner but an adversary.

He tore up the cheque because he didn't want you getting ideas about being a person in your own right. That cheque was a reminder to him that his reality was not Reality. He couldn't deal with it.

He does not see you as an individual. To him, you are an extension of his personality.

@StupidArgument

I think if I get offered this place, I will be doing it without DH.

You'll be doing it without his support, but also with his active opposition. Even if he doesn't destroy your work (which I think he may well do, the cheque story is unfortunately too familiar to me - not necessarily cheques, but passports and other documents) he will still expect you to do all the hours you do now in his business, he'll still expect you to go to bed when he does, he'll still expect to be the centre of your attention every minute. This will be something that's just for you, and he won't like that one little bit. Your story about the cheque adds weight to my theory.

So please start standing up to him now, before you have the pressure of coursework and need to be at uni during the week. See how he reacts, and that will enable you to judge what he's going to be like.

Another possibility, and again one I've seen, is that he'll appear to be very supportive when you first tell him. It's part of his plan. If he gets angry from the start he's showing his hand and you might decide against taking up the place. Then he wouldn't be able to destroy you and your work so it isn't in his interests.

I'm sorry, I know it sounds like I'm being really negative. I'm not at all, I really, really wish you every success, both professional and from the personal self esteem perspective. But I've been here with my students. Please learn from what I've seen.

@Motoko

He knew damn well it wasn't empty. Did you ask the couple to cancel that cheque, and write you another one?

If you get the uni place, look into going into halls.

I hope you get a place. Good luck.

It was only in two pieces so I sellotaped it together, and the bank said it was fine to cash it luckily.

@Feedingthebirds1 I don't think you're sounding like you're being negative, I appreciate the honest advice.

What I meant though is that if I get the place I am going to leave DH. I just feel really uncomfortable saying it so directly. I feel so guilty at the thought of it.

You need to have plans in place to move out.

Please contact Women's Aid and get to work on your options.

If residence halls are an option, pack your things and GO.

One more thing:

Change your MN password.
Log out every time you leave MN even if you're just going to the loo.
Delete your cookies.
Erase your history.

He's training you to be subservient and not to question him.

@StupidArgument, I think you're doing great. I get the guilt thing. I used to feel the same way talking out loud about my relationship misgivings.
It's the way we have been trained in these kinds of relationships - to never consider our own needs and feelings, as that is 'selfish' (a term the bastard abuser knows triggers shame in us and will shut us down). Keep going, you're on the way out!

OP I totally get that you have been with him all your adult life but if you read any of the threads on here to do with narcissists, it's all the same behaviours. The sex before you go out and picking you up from a hen do were the big red flags of a conditioned relationship. But this isn't anything you have done and it is always done so gradually that you don't notice and do indeed think it's normal.

I'm really quite sad that you thought this was normal, but 33 is still young!!! I have a friend who started her teacher training 9yrs ago when she was mid 30s, she now works in a well paid uni job. Women aren't having children until later these days..... Walk away whilst you still can.