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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To understand the first, but not the second, third, fourth...

329 replies

Sayitagainwhydontyou · 15/08/2020 08:59

I know that lots of men only show their true nature once children are born, that abuse very commonly starts with pregnancy, and that many women are completely blindsided when their husbands become abusive/neglectful/selfish/useless/detatched after they have a baby...

I am absolutely not saying "what possessed you to have a baby with this man??"

But i am baffled by women who's partners are shit dads, who then go on to have more children with them. It just seems so hugely unfair on the kids.

OP posts:
Original poster
Sayitagainwhydontyou · 15/08/2020 15:39

I'm blown away by the numver of people on this thread who seemingly can't read. I specifically stated, right at the beginning, that I'm not talking about abuse. I'm talking about the men who never change a nappy or do a load of laundry and think that going to work means they should never have to spend time looking after their own children.

OP posts:
Neron · 15/08/2020 15:40

Cam2020 yes it angers me too. Even here, other PP falling over themselves to present women as victims.
This isn't a thread about people suffering from REAL abuse, it's about women making poor decisions and having made their bed then to lie in it. Accept responsibility for choosing to have more children, with a less than ideal partner, because they wanted to. Conception isn't a miracle.

Original poster
Sayitagainwhydontyou · 15/08/2020 15:41

*number. Sigh.

OP posts:
Gancanny · 15/08/2020 15:42

And it's been answered why, both for reasons relating to abuse and reasons relating to social conditioning and expectations as well as finances. It's also been asked back at you why you think the blame lies with women and why they're responsible for tackling it.

Noneformethanks · 15/08/2020 15:42

But I believe that not changing a nappy, never helping out at home and leaving all the work of children to the mother is at the very least low level abuse. And very often is indicative of financial abuse (spends “his” money on himself)

I am also saying (and you have refused to acknowledge) that you cannot know what is inside the relationship. Very often all outsider sees is a shit dad. They don’t see the rest of it (because the men paint the women as mentally disordered or otherwise unwell or because the women know they won’t be believed if they tell the truth)

Original poster
Sayitagainwhydontyou · 15/08/2020 15:44

@Gancanny

And it's been answered why, both for reasons relating to abuse and reasons relating to social conditioning and expectations as well as finances. It's also been asked back at you why you think the blame lies with women and why they're responsible for tackling it.
Again, reading comprehension - I'm not talking about abuse!

And I can see why financial and social reasons would stop women leaving useless men, but i don't see how either of those things mean that women have to continue to have children with said feckless wonders.

OP posts:
Original poster
Sayitagainwhydontyou · 15/08/2020 15:46

@noneformethanks

But I believe that not changing a nappy, never helping out at home and leaving all the work of children to the mother is at the very least low level abuse.

I'm sorry, that's ridiculous.

OP posts:
PicsInRed · 15/08/2020 15:46

I specifically stated, right at the beginning, that I'm not talking about abuse.

What you don't consider to be abuse, but not which isn't actually abuse.

I'm talking about the men who never change a nappy or do a load of laundry and think that going to work means they should never have to spend time looking after their own children.

That is Lundy Bancroft's "King of the Castle". He's not "useless" he's a deliberate exploiter of women.

Noneformethanks · 15/08/2020 15:47

If you have no money and no access to money how do you get contraception? How do you get to any of the places where contraception is available? If you have no money and no access to money. It’s impossible.

I’m not the only one on this thread who has had it happen.

Noneformethanks · 15/08/2020 15:47

@PicsInRed

I specifically stated, right at the beginning, that I'm not talking about abuse.

What you don't consider to be abuse, but not which isn't actually abuse.

I'm talking about the men who never change a nappy or do a load of laundry and think that going to work means they should never have to spend time looking after their own children.

That is Lundy Bancroft's "King of the Castle". He's not "useless" he's a deliberate exploiter of women.

Exactly this.

You should Read some Lundy Bancroft op. It might open your eyes.

Neron · 15/08/2020 15:47

Contraception is free.

Noneformethanks · 15/08/2020 15:48

[quote Sayitagainwhydontyou]@noneformethanks

But I believe that not changing a nappy, never helping out at home and leaving all the work of children to the mother is at the very least low level abuse.

I'm sorry, that's ridiculous.[/quote]
If you’re going to quote me, please have the decency to do so accurately. Thanks.

user1471462428 · 15/08/2020 15:49

But as many pp have told you the behaviour you described is low level abuse. Or you from the outside may not be aware of the abuse going on. If walks like a duck and quacks like a duck .........
The real question is why our society allows men to behave like this?

Noneformethanks · 15/08/2020 15:50

@Neron

Contraception is free.
Getting there isn’t when you have no access to transport and no access to money and the doctor is miles and miles away (5 miles according to google maps)
Original poster
Sayitagainwhydontyou · 15/08/2020 15:53

@Noneformethanks

If you have no money and no access to money how do you get contraception? How do you get to any of the places where contraception is available? If you have no money and no access to money. It’s impossible.

I’m not the only one on this thread who has had it happen.

That's abuse, which I've repeatedly said isn't what I'm talking about
OP posts:
PicsInRed · 15/08/2020 15:54

@Neron

Cam2020 yes it angers me too. Even here, other PP falling over themselves to present women as victims. This isn't a thread about people suffering from REAL abuse, it's about women making poor decisions and having made their bed then to lie in it. Accept responsibility for choosing to have more children, with a less than ideal partner, because they wanted to. Conception isn't a miracle.
"Real abuse"

See also:
"Real racism"
&
"Real rape"

These are all phrases used by abusers and apologists to prevent any work being done to change bigotry, abuse and exploitation. Phrases used to use shame to ensure the persistence of the status quo - or to convince and delude themselves that their own situation is just fine.

Neron · 15/08/2020 15:55

@Noneformethanks if that is the case for yourself, then this thread clearly isn't about you or others in your position.
For the most part, the women OP is referring to, do have access to contraception, which is free, and can make their way to a GP/FPC etc to obtain it.
This is not a thread about people in genuine abusive or coercive relationships.

Noneformethanks · 15/08/2020 15:55

And as I’ve repeatedly said. You can never know what is going on behind closed doors.

PicsInRed · 15/08/2020 15:56

That's abuse, which I've repeatedly saidisn't what I'm talking about

You don't think so, I do believe that, but only because you don't know. I think you would greatly benefit from the Freedom Programme, OP. I think it would open your eyes to the reality of what's around you.

Neron · 15/08/2020 15:57

@PicsInRed I'm referring to REAL abuse for those in DV or a CC relationship. Someone with a lazy partner isn't in an abusive relationship.

user1471462428 · 15/08/2020 15:57

“This really is an issue of a lack of public education in the dynamics of abuse/control and consequently a lack of knowledge of this amongst women - where that knowledge would do so, so much good.“
@PicsInRed hitting the nail on the head.
I repeatedly thought I would try and see the best in my ex. I encouraged him to read parenting books, seek help from the GP, talk to his friends about his role as a father.
Why does he do that should be on the secondary school curriculum. Honestly the lack of understanding from the op and several pp is mind blowing and depressing.

Noneformethanks · 15/08/2020 15:57

[quote Neron]@PicsInRed I'm referring to REAL abuse for those in DV or a CC relationship. Someone with a lazy partner isn't in an abusive relationship.[/quote]
Wow.

What a breathtakingly ignorant statement.

KeyWorker · 15/08/2020 15:58

I haven’t read the full thread but just wanted to say yabvu to assume women who have second and subsequent children with their abusive partners have a choice. Often they don’t.

Neron · 15/08/2020 16:01

@Noneformethanks ignorant? I'm speaking from experience of my rape, of my own abusive partners, about being born in to DV and being abused my by parents.
Yeah. I'm ignorant because I don't believe that a women complaining about her partner not doing much around the house and further procreation knowing that, is being abused/in an abusive relationship.

Noneformethanks · 15/08/2020 16:03

I am sorry you were abused. Your background sounds similar to mine. How do you know what is going on in an intimate relationship that you are not a party to?

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