To be annoyed that partner looked during childbirth?

[IsoBordem]

I recently had a pretty terrible birth experience. It was the most dehumanising experience I have ever gone through. The hourly internal exams (done twice due to a student midwife) was already pushing my limits.

Before the birth I had one request for my partner - I did not want him looking down there at any point. During the delivery the doctors offered for him to have a look, even though I said I would prefer if he didn't. He ended up watching twice.

I know I am likely being unreasonable to be annoyed. I just wished the one person who was meant to be supporting me would have listened to my wishes rather than dismissing me like my doctor did.

It is a shame that some of the more moderate views on this thread are being drowned out.

OP, I am sorry that you had such an awful birth experience and that your partner didn't advocate for you as he should have done.

If you love him, if he's a good man, then I really do believe that you need to find a way to understand his reasoning - since I'm sure he didn't intentionally set out to hurt you - and forgive him, so that you can enjoy your new baby together.

I am appalled at many of the posts on this thread.

OP, I think a debrief would be a good idea when you feel ready. I'm sorry you had to go through that

For goodness sake it's nothing to do with hating men.

If a man undergoing a painful, intense, medical procedure I would also expect his wishes for his wife to not do X Y or Z. It just so happens in this case that OP is a woman and we are discussing birth.

No one has the right to look at anyone's body at any time, for any reason if they are told no, whether you are male or female.

If the roles were reversed, I doubt very much anyone would be talking about women-haters. It's funny how it's only when we are discussing women's rights that anyone who disagrees is a 'man hater'.

And that he, of course, needs to understand that he has hurt and disappointed you, regardless of reason, and genuinely apologise without defensiveness.

I would also expect his wishes to be respected**

Ok so I am speaking from the position of having a traumatic first birth (stirrups, ventouse, episiotomy etc), and two subsequent straightforward births.

OP I am so sorry this has upset you so much. I think YANBU to feel your views weren’t listened to, sadly I think this is not unusual particularly during complicated deliveries. Your hospital should have a PALS group you can contact to give your feedback as a patient. There should also be a Maternity Liaison Committee and in future it might be something you want to join to help change the maternity services at the hospital.
I think it would be good to get a birth debrief to enable you to come to understand what happened during your labour.

DH remembers clearly in my first birth once things got ‘serious’ - suddenly there were loads of people in the room, he didn’t know who most of them were, it all got pretty urgent and scary, the doctors were issuing orders, and I think if a doctor had told him to look he might have done it without thinking.

This is a new very frightening experience for the dad too, they have no knowledge of what to do, they are seeing the person they love most in a lot of pain and distress, and some men cope better than others. I do think you should talk to your partner and explain how you feel though.

I think for the sake of your baby and your relationship, it would be good to try and get some support for your birth trauma so that you can focus on building your new life as a family.

For what it’s worth, DH has since supported me through two subsequent ‘regular’ births and turned into a very good birth partner - and when number 3 was born a little too quickly with only one midwife he ended up having to help deliver the baby! And that experience has not affected how he sees me sexually / as a partner, in fact I think he was in awe of what my body was able to achieve.

Also are there any postnatal support courses in your area? These can be a good space to talk about your feelings. Sometimes they are run by the GP, sometimes by NCT.

It may seem impossible now but hopefully in time you will be able to see some positive sides to your birth, your body is amazing and you birthed a wonderful little person!

It genuinely makes me feel sick that over half the posters believe it's ok to look at someone's genitals without their consent and knowing they had said no.

The father wouldn't miss out on the birth experience at all. They just wouldn't be gawping at the baby coming out of the birth canal.

It's horrifying that so many posters believe it is ok to do things with women's bodies without her consent just because there may be a tiny chance a man's feelings/pride/whatever may be hurt.

I'm not surprised though. There are quite a few posters who don't seem to believe in the concept of consent which then supports rape culture.

@rawlikesushi

It is a shame that some of the more moderate views on this thread are being drowned out.

OP, I am sorry that you had such an awful birth experience and that your partner didn't advocate for you as he should have done.

If you love him, if he's a good man, then I really do believe that you need to find a way to understand his reasoning - since I'm sure he didn't intentionally set out to hurt you - and forgive him, so that you can enjoy your new baby together.

Most of the views are being moderate. No one is saying LTB or that OP's partner is a horrible human being. We're just saying that she has the right to say no, and the right to be upset that the no was ignored by both her partner and the doctor.

It really is ok for a woman to say no. It is also ok for her to be upset when she is ignored. That's what it comes down to.

What isn't moderate about that?

"It genuinely makes me feel sick that over half the posters believe it's ok to look at someone's genitals without their consent and knowing they had said no."

If you are standing at the side of a woman giving birth, say holding her hand, you are not very far from the birth itself. He shouldn't have looked, agreed, but I think some people can see how it might have come about and I suppose are trying to help op to consider his reasoning - assuming that she doesn't want to divorce him or remain angry forever.

And be made to feel like a rapist for daring to take a glance at my baby coming into the world?

Interesting that you think being a man would automatically mean you disregarded your partner’s feelings and right to bodily autonomy. That’s a pretty poor expectation you have of men.

"It really is ok for a woman to say no. It is also ok for her to be upset when she is ignored. That's what it comes down to.

What isn't moderate about that?"

I'm not going to trawl through to c&p all of the horrible comments.

Yes a woman can say no, yes a woman has a right to be upset when her wishes are ignored.

Now let's offer something productive that might help op move forward.

You are absolutely not being unreasonable. I’m really sorry that you had such a negative birth experience, I really genuinely feel for you.

In that moment you were in pain and vulnerable and your decision (one of the only ones you could control at that point) should’ve been respected and adhered to.

Now let's offer something productive that might help op move forward.

I think lots of people already have done this? Many suggestions of birth debriefs and talking to PALS and conversations with the husband.

I think it’s definitely best to separate the behaviour of DH/medics out though. Husband was likely (hopefully?) very stressed and not thinking straight anyway, and might well have acted badly out of not thinking rather than not caring. Plus, best to work it out with him and hammer out any potential resentment going forwards.

But the medical staff had no excuse for overriding her clearly stated wishes like that and need to be pulled up on it if she feels able to do so.

(My husband was unhelpful during a big part of my first labour - not on this scale, just stressing at me a lot - and afterwards I thought, well, what’s done is done no point bringing it up now. Until I got pregnant the next time and got to the birth plans stage and went “I do NOT want you to do that again!”, and by that time it was years later and he’d mostly forgotten and couldn’t understand why I hadn’t brought it up sooner rather than sitting on it in silence. But at least it didn’t happen the next time round!)

@tableflowers you would be surprised how many men do have this feeling though. Their wife is no longer just a sexual being. Some people not just men would struggle with this. I dont think it's done on purpose.... Why do you think mennused to wait outside. And still do in a lot of cultures! Even I see my vagina in a different light after seeing my daughter born. Maybe I'm not explaining myself well. But before birth a man sees your vagina as something sexual. Aftwr seeing a baby come out that thought process changes. He never views the other functions our vaginas vulvas do. I.e urinating and menstruating so they never think about it. But once you see something like birth it can be hard to forget. I know I have seen it and it was my own daughter being born. It doesn't make a man less of a man.

some people can see how it might have come about and I suppose are trying to help op to consider his reasoning I don't think any reasoning is ok though because she expressly said no to it beforehand. I don't think it's ok to look at a person's genitals just because you've come up with a reasoning.

I do wonder though how much views on this comes down to birthing experiences
Well mine was similar to Ops but probably a lot worse. Spent 7 weeks in hospital , 2 days inducing , 24 hour labour failed ventuese and forceps in theatre in case forceps didnt work.
I think she is being unfair to her dh, why focus on that, she gpt a healthy baby. One of the ladies in the neighbouring bed baby died and one of NCT group lost a full term baby as well, it puts a lot of perspective on things. I couldnt even remember who looked where over the24 hours i was in labour.

OP should not worry about two men ignoring her stated no when she was in a vulnerable state because babies and mothers can die.

Right.

I completely agree that the use of the rape analogy, is offensive to use as a comparison. It’s not the same

Actually it took an awful lot of counselling for me to come to terms with the fact my delivery was much like my rape. The sensation was the same, my feelings of helplessness, unable to do anything to stop it. Having a man force things in to me against my will and without my consent. It was scarily very similar.

bruffin Sorry but having a baby alive doesn't mean OP can't feel how she does. I lost a baby at birth and have had many miscarriages. That doesn't mean I was ok with my choices being disrespected when I finally got my babies. I was of course indescribably happy. It didn't mean I was ok with things being done to my body without my consent.

do wonder though how much views on this comes down to birthing experiences Whatever birth experiences you've had you should not be looking at or saying it's ok for people to look at other's genitals without permission.

In that situation, Your request was completely unreasonable IMHO.

@lljkk

In that situation, Your request was completely unreasonable IMHO.

Is this addressed to the OP?

If so I think the word request has been wrongly applied. She wasnt asking if he would mind not looking so that he could consider and give her his answer. She was telling him the rules regarding his presence during her labour and childbirth.