Am I being tight or is he?

[Flymeaway4]

My fiancé and I are expecting our first child. We live in my fiancé’s house and I pay him rent of £300/month.

He also rents out 2 rooms of the house to a friend for £515, but because the baby is coming we’ve decided it’s best for him to move out. So, my question is about what my rent should be now.

I suggested he work out the cost of his mortgage and all bills and split it down the middle, which would come to £390. He thinks it should be more......

Together we have purchased a derelict farmhouse, which we intend to refurbish into our forever home - we paid in cash and the refurb should start in about 6-9 months. We’re both fairly well off, earn about the same salary, but he has other houses that he rents out, so he has more cash savings than me. When we purchased the farmhouse, he put in a larger proportion of cash than I did (I’ve so far provided just over 25%) and the intention is that it’ll even out when I pay off the mortgage that we’ll need for the refurb.

I’ll add here that I was a first time buyer and had he been as well we’d have had no stamp duty to pay. But because he owns more than 1 house it put it up to just over £8k. To keep the peace I just paid half.

Since then, he has managed to save all the cash he needs to provide towards the refurb, c. £100k. But he is saying, instead of keeping it as cash and earning nothing from it, he could use it to pay off the mortgage on one of his rental houses now. If he doesn’t do this, we can use the cash for the refurb first, then I could delay getting the refurb mortgage that I need, thereby saving me money (it’s more expensive than a normal mortgage). It would be delayed by about 4 months, but this would mean I can get one with a 1yr term instead of 2 yrs, before remortgaging. So, to compensate for him not paying off his rental property mortgage now, he thinks I should pay half of it as additional rent (an extra £160/month). But, I argued that if he were to pay off his rental mortgage now, then he would also need an expensive refurb mortgage too, so keeping the cash is saving him money as well, not just me.

As an aside, I am not allowed to do my regular job whilst pregnant (not corona related, it’s just how it is) and am working from home, but my take home pay is reduced by about £500/month. So I’m also losing about £4K in total each time I’m pregnant with our child.

Complicated I know, which is why I can’t tell who is being tight/unreasonable.

Does he write his name on yogurts in the fridge?

Whilst obviously you should still be contributing, if your income is reduced due to your pregnancy which presumably is a decision you made together, then you should both make up the shortfall there. Likewise if your income reduces when you are on maternity then you contribute proportionally.

Yes, being a woman and a mother doesn’t mean you don’t contribute but just because you are biologically the one carrying it doesn’t mean you should be the one hit more financially for it.

I do feel he is being tight in expecting you to make up what he loses from his lodger going, especially as it means he pays less towards the bills whilst you pay more, iyswim.

In terms of the 100k, it's his to do with what he wishes and, although, it would be nice if he'd put it towards the refurbed house to lessen a mortgage burden for you, there's no requirement for it, I guess. Just be careful--sounds like you might end up with the all the burden (of a mortgage) whilst he has capital and paid off assets. That's if I am understanding the situation correctly-I may not be.

My take would be - separate out the day to day from the investment in properties for a start.

Day to day I think you should split the £780 proportionally to your income each month. (You maybe want to give him half the mortgage and he changes the other bills to the joint account?) Your income will clearly vary over the next 18 months and is not easy to account for no matter how much you plan so and you shouldn't be left meeting additional costs on smp! Proportionality would also make some nod to your reduced income due to pregnancy.
Whether you include his rental profit in that I guess is a debate - maybe you could leave that alone on the proviso that an agreed proportion is put into a fund for your child. He should not be looking to make a profit from you whilst you are carrying his child.

The property investment you should probably look at on a pure finance basis. As someone suggested above work out the costs of each element over 5 years. Do bear in mind you might struggle to get a mortgage whilst pregnant if your contract says smp only. Remember the stamp duty. It is your leaver if needed.

Jesus fucking Christ, I just don’t understand all this mine and yours business when you are married and having kids.
You are creating a family unit. Everything goes in the pot and everybody needs are paid for out of the same pot.
Once you create a family unit it’s not always 50/50 financially, one person (normally the mother) ends up contributing less financially and losing promotions/pay rises/pension contributions while caring for children, often having to go part time. They lose out health wise due to the strain of pregnancy and breastfeeding, some mothers end up having lifelong issues. People contribute in many ways to the household unit - childcare, cleaning, cooking, life admin, etc. If you are going to be picky over who owes what financially then you need to make sure all input is accounted for and invoices for accordingly!!

You are having his child. You pay him rent.

I cannot get past that bit, sorry. He sounds like a prat.

So he wants you to pay more than he does? Even though you have lost income because you are pregnant with your joint child? Cant you see how shitty that is.
And even though you are going to be alot worse off will you be expected to pay the same on maternity leave?

Something just doesn't add up here.
You are effectively losing earnings in order to produce and bring up HIS child.
As any working mum will tell you, you can't guarantee that you won't lose out in ways that might be invisible now, such as pay rises, or promotion whilst you are part time. It often sets people's careers back by several years. Those invisible costs are usually shared between parents with one parent supporting the one who is taking the hit on pay to be the child's carer. Or look at it this way as he is so keen on splitting costs, perhaps he should pay you childcare fees during your time off.

As a joint unit you shouldn't be taking all the financial losses. Of course you want to contribute but you do sound very obligated to someone who is perfectly financially very comfortable.
Is that vibe coming from him or you?
When your earnings are down by £500 a month and you will soon be on maternity pay, but you plan to give him half your maternity pay? Will you split baby equipment and costs or are you paying more of that too.
I'd also be worried about this property you own jointly and all the talk about how he could use the refurb money to pay off other mortgages, because he could just pay them off and leave you with a half share in a property that needs £100k spent on it.
Is he taking out life insurance and making a will to provide for you both in future?
RE the current situation, by my calculations he is only paying £35 a month towards the mortgage and bills of the property. What a great deal for him.
The lodger is moving out to make room for the baby, a joint responsibility but because his income will be down, you are increasing the amount you pay whilst at the same time your pay has been cut by £500 a month.

There's lots of "fair" ways to approach this sort of thing.

Do you plan on selling the house you currently live in when you move to your forever home. Or will it be another notch on his property portfolio?

I think that for now I'd see current living arrangements as somewhere that you indeed rent. And together you are taking over the house costs of your flatmate (the lodger) moving out. So you have £800 costs to split between you. Yes this means your costs go up. But you've already accepted the principle of him making money out of you living there. And at least he then is "paying " some too.

Your new house I'd want to be sure is owned equally. If he's put in 75% of the deposit with the plan that you'd pay more towards the refurbishment costs (risky as these always cost more than you think), then you can't make him pay his 100k towards the costs just to save you money. But, arguably he should have paid the higher stamp duty too.

Oh it is a muddle.

I very much prefer the "all money in one pot. Everyone has same amount of individual spending money for presents and fripperies" approach

I think this is all somewhat clouded by the fact he owns the property you live in now and was generating an income from it.

To be fair, you would need to increase the rent you pay him to cover the fact that only 2 of you live there now (which is exactly what would happen if 3 people were renting and 1 person moved out). So basically covering half the lost income from the lodger, and he would have to suck up the loss from the other half.

Alternatively if he's really feeling the pinch of losing income from the lodger and you can't afford an increased rental contribution then you should both move out and rent somewhere smaller/cheaper. He can then rent out the place you live in now.

The jointly owned property is different and you need to see a solicitor about protecting your contribution.

What is his take on Child Benefit?

@katy1213 no, but don’t give him ideas!

@LittleOwl153 I think you’re right, we need to think about it completely separately. The amount I pay towards the joint running of the house we currently live in together (some might call it rent, others may not!) should be thought of completely Separately from any other expenses we incur, otherwise we make it too complicated.

I agree, I don’t want him to make a profit from me and he’d agree that too. I think he is arguing that the £100k he is keeping as cash is to save me money on a mortgage in the future, but it’s costing him money now (the cost being the mortgage he’s not paying off in the meantime). But we can’t think of this as part of any ‘rent’, that just makes it complicated.

If he charges you rent then you should charge him for rent of your womb. Baby is 50% his so he has to pay. And if your pay is down 50%because you are pregnant then he owes you £250.

Seriously my advice to you is get married now. Engaged is not protected. The house may come first but a marriage only costs about £250. You can have the party later once the house is finished.

I was on the other side of a similar situation OP (I owned the flat and had a lodger; when DP lives in we weren't ready for shared finances).

DP paid what the lodger had paid for the first few months while I finished paying off a big tax bill then we went down to half costs each. Fast forward, we're having a baby in a couple of months and he's paying me 75% of costs, 25% I put straight into savings for when my income drops on mat leave.

never ever get pregnant with a mean man or woman, it is the worst personality trait ever to deal with.

@roarfeckingroarr interesting to hear a similar situation from the other side! That seems like a fair and sensible way to approach it too.

I guess it becomes complicated in that I don’t know what I’ll be earning once the baby is born. If my employer lets me work from home, then it’s only a few hours a day, which I can cope with, especially given how much more I’ll earn compared to SMP. But given the redundancy situation at the moment, I haven’t really wanted to bring up that idea with them yet! So maybe a percentage of take home pay at the time would work better for us

@eveningfalls I agree. And don’t worry, he’s not mean, even if he is tight sometimes! And if that’s his one flaw, it could be a lot worse!

@Veganfortheanimals

Oh my god Your having his baby My dh would of given me his last penny when I was pregnant with his kids Are you getting married? If not don’t move in together ,keep your money separate and live separate He sounds like a tight arse ,you should not be paying him rent ..your having his baby ,

This exactly.^

MrsGrindah I’m not sure why you’re under the impression that we think the house is more important than the baby?! Our family will always come first (for us both), but the house is important for our family and our future too. It’s our forever home, with half an acre of beautiful gardens, in a lovely little village and means we can move out of the new build estate that’s overcrowded, with loud neighbours, where people drive too fast and the smell of weed occasionally wafts in (still haven’t worked out where from!)

You said in a previous post that you are getting married but the house comes first. My point is that marriage gives your baby more security than a house

He should be contributing to your loss of income during your maternity leave. It's not fair that you will be using savings. Those savings should be going towards the renovation costs.

Gosh I never can imagine having sex with someone who is mean with money. It's got to be the #1 most unattractive quality in a person. That's even before countenancing having a baby with such a person!! Talk about making a rod for your own back.

Anyway. He's essentially fretting about paying interest, when he could remove that expense - if I understand correctly. The rent thing is fine with me - you should pay the proportion of the mortgage /ct that aligns to your monthly earnings. The rest of it... whew. The reason it's hard to explain is because normal people dont think like this, tbh.

Normal people, assuming they were already financially ok, would remember that their partner is pregnant, her job/income/future earnings potential is a little bit up in the air, that this (along with the normal stresses of pregnancy) is a little stressful. And they would just pay interest quietly.

Your partner places his tightness first, before your feelings. You say that he has always been tight, and I presume you accepted this about him, since you're pregnant to him and talk about your family life with him etc. For reasons known only to yourself, you have implicitly made an agreement that you will partner with someone whose relationship with money is primary. Personally I think that's madness, and the situation you're in now is illustrative of this.

Imo, he is BU, but you say you knew he was tight? So you're BU to expect him to magically transform into a family man who puts you first. This is going to be the rest of your life, op, so learn to refuse to bend to his tightness, or, get on with enriching him in whatever way he requires you to.

£390 is more than fair. Making a profit from a lodger is one thing, making a profit from his partner and mother of his child is totally different.

If your income goes down during ML, or if you have to drop hours to care for the baby, then your share of the bills should be proportional to your incomes.

Equally, we’re not married yet and he’d have no rights to the baby!

Being married doesn't change parental responsibilities in any way.

This situation is bonkers. With any one this tight who insisted on separate finances, I would never pay rent. I would want to be added to the mortgage if paying any significant part of it, or would take out a loan/mortgage to buy a part stake in the house from him, and repay the loan. You should both be benefitting from building up capital in a property.

If he wants to marry you, he should want to share his life & wealth with you. Honest to god I bet you a million quid he doesnt ever actually marry you. Sorry.

We’re both considering part time once I go back properly.

You'll be losing out financially in a big way because you have had HIS baby

What amount has he agreed to pay you per month to make up for this loss?

@kerrymucklowe2020

"The OPs partner isn’t her landlord either."

So why is she paying him rent ????!!!!

He actually is, in the same way I am my fiancé's landlord. He pays me a set amount which I then put towards bills and mortgage.