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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

I'm a landlady....

352 replies

SomeOtherGirl · 03/08/2020 17:32

I'm going to try to word this carefully. It's to do with making different life choices but it's in a sensitive area which could imply that I'm being judgemental. I don't mean to be. I'm just wondering if this sounds normal to the ears of anonymous mumsnetters.

So we have a rental property - our old place. I will try to give as much info as possible though some probably isn't totally relevant, but people might ask otherwise :-)

A nice couple moved in and they have a baby.

The deposit was covered by the council, and the monthly rent is £600, which was to be paid by them. They are on UC - they had asked me if I minded and I answered of course not!

I am 75% sure that the guy has a job of some description as he talks about it on Facebook.

They moved in and after the first month immediately fell into arrears, with a late partial payment and then a missed payment. They are a little more than a month behind on rent.

I did some research and found that the UC people can pay us about 90% of the rent directly to us, which sounded easier for everyone so I applied for that and all has been well, aside from the outstanding rent.

We asked the tenants if they can catch up this money and they said they'd have to do so in drive and drabs. This was last autumn. They have yet to make a payment but with Christmas and then corona virus I didn't push it. UC said we could apply to have it taken out from their other benefits in small chunks but I think the debt needs to equate to two months for this.

So now there are some bits and bobs to do maintenance wise so we've been looking at that and working out how to sort them out.

In the conversation, we asked if they'd be able now to start repaying the arrears as it would help with sorting out the maintenance bits. They said they could only do £10 a month as they have to pay for other stuff - namely Sky which they have at £90 a month.

I was really surprised at this. We rely on this rent as an income. I'm not able to work at present and we live modestly. I know people tend to think of their landlord as being Mr megabucks but it's not like that with us. We have netflix at 5.99 a month and thats the extent of our entertainment luxuries.

I'm just surprised that a lovely couple who get their housing costs covered plus additional benefits - and a job - see repaying this rent debt as so low priority.

Am I a bit mad? Should I sell the place?
I've not got cross with them or anything about it by the way. But I am wondering if I should sell it. They wanted me to come change a lightbulb recently. I think they've also moved an older step child in, which is fine I guess But they didn't mention it.

I try to be a really considerate landlady as far as I can but it's never going to be a perfect situation.

Just wondering what your thoughts are ? Obviously not planning on evicting them over this.

OP posts:
Bonelesschuck · 03/08/2020 18:55

I am a landlord (and also American, so apparently super hated on MN, oh well) and if it were me I would wait until the end of the tenancy (let's hope you have this rented under an AST) and say you won't be renewing. If they don't leave at the end of the tenancy you have a much stronger claim to get them out. If you don't have a proper lease then I am afraid you will need to think about either evicting them or writing off the rent that is in arrears already. As for the maintenance requests, just ignore things as ridiculous as the lightbulbs and as for the others make it clear that you're not in a position to do the work right now as money is tight, rent arrears, covid etc (this doesn't apply to anything urgently needing fixing or dangerous, mind you). It took me a long time to become an impersonal (though efficient) landlord after being taken advantage of as you are. I like to say that being a landlord is like having children you don't love. NO way sell because you've had one bad experience! In future, your best protection against stress and drama is to really screen your tenants at the outset. Personally I ask for rent that is at the low end of market value and that gives me plenty of people to choose from who think they are getting a bargain and will therefore value the tenancy.

jammyjoey · 03/08/2020 18:55

Definitely CF however maybe theyre tied into their sky bill and cant change it?
When does their contract end?
Are they paying the 10% difference?
I would say £10 isnt enough and unfortunately you are considering selling you yourself have bills to pay. Tell you need X amount extra a month and see what they say?

Kaiserin · 03/08/2020 18:56

OP, you sound lovely, and they sound like idiots.

I hope you'll get the money they owe you, and I hope they grow up someday, without having to be taught the hard way (going to court, eviction, etc. With children in the equation, it's hard to contemplate, but it is a last resort...)

SunshineCake · 03/08/2020 18:57

Don't be changing their light bulbs.

No more of anything until they pay what is owed. Give them notice that if they haven't caught up by three months then you will have to rethink the situation.

Don't sell because of this Hmm. That is just silly as presumably you bought this place for a long term investment.

Time to get your business head on.

What make them lovely when it is the tax payer paying their rent? Someone paying what they owe doesn't make them lovely!

Cyberattack · 03/08/2020 18:58

You sound like a very considerate landlord. They need to repay the rent they didn't pay. I wonder does this put them in breach of their contract with you? Might be one way out.
Why on earth did they ask you to change a light bulb? I've never heard of anyone expecting their landlord to do that.

Boohoohoohooho · 03/08/2020 18:59

It’s wierd that you say they are ‘lovely’ when they are ripping you off. Do you actually think they are lovely or are you worried posters will think badly of you if you show more than a hint of irritation in them.

It’s just as odd to say you aren’t ‘cross’ with them.

I’d start the Eviction process.

OneTooManyBathtimes · 03/08/2020 19:00

We're on UC and were really lucky with our LL... although we also have 12 months of rent available as well in our savings so I think that helped him feel safe... and he knew I was about to give birth anytime soon. Your renters defneed to sort their priorities out

The changing a lightbulb is ridiculous. We've never asked our LL for something so trivial!

BakedCam · 03/08/2020 19:01

For posters saying evict. It doesn't work like that. It is a long and costly process. Any eviction without a court order, will be an unlawful eviction. That is a criminal offence and carries heavy penalties. It also gives the tenant the right to remain in the property and a landlord would be ordered to allow entry.

Original poster
SomeOtherGirl · 03/08/2020 19:01

@Bearnecessity

Landlords are the most hated..really I thought it was Teachers.

Get firm OP....you sound lovely....give them 1 month to make substantially more payments or explain you will have to take further actions to recover the money.

I used to be a teacher Blush They seemed nice that's all. Fwiw I don't have a cleaner, I live in a small apartment.

Selling would be more about hassle reduction really - though with the status quo of UC covering the rent, it's alright at the moment.

I've just looked at price estimates on Zoopla and mouseprice and sadly the value seems to have dipped a little so we wouldn't walk away with a lump sum once the mortgage was paid off - shame as we're keen to get a third bedroom.

OP posts:
Boohoohoohooho · 03/08/2020 19:05

BakedCam
I don’t think anyone who suggested starting the eviction process implied that it was easy.

Original poster
SomeOtherGirl · 03/08/2020 19:05

@Boohoohoohooho

It’s wierd that you say they are ‘lovely’ when they are ripping you off. Do you actually think they are lovely or are you worried posters will think badly of you if you show more than a hint of irritation in them.

It’s just as odd to say you aren’t ‘cross’ with them.

I’d start the Eviction process.

I suppose I'm trying to be philosophical. I don't need to raise my blood pressure right now, and the status quo with UC covering means it's not too bad. Just super weird how they prioritise the sky package.

A previous tenant got into much bigger arrears and trashed the place, and wasn't on UC so I had no option to reclaim, and she was racist to my DH, so yes, in comparison these guys are quite nice 😊

OP posts:
caringcarer · 03/08/2020 19:06

When a property is rented out it is rented with.all lights working. When they leave all lights should be working. Whilst they reside in property they are responsible for replacing any light bulbs that need replacement. Apply to get rent arrears from UC as this couple have no idea of budgeting and you won't get it back otherwise. I am LL to 6 houses and I always do a thorough check before I allow a tenant to move in. Make sure your contract is water tight, the tenant agreed to pay tent in full and on the every cm. That way if they fall behind they are clearly in breach of contract. A small thing but judges look for clarity if you end up having to evict.

Nancydrawn · 03/08/2020 19:06

OP, you have to treat this like a business, because it is.

What they do with their own money is manifestly their business.

However, whether or not they pay you rent is manifestly your business.

Now, there are situations where you might wish to give your tenants a break. For example, if they had been good and reliable tenants but fell on difficult times, you might lower their rent for a couple months. Or if they couldn't make the rent but agreed to do repairs in lieu of rent for a month, that might also work (though should be fully vetted by your solicitor and definitely written down as a contract).

These tenants have been unreliable from the start. I wouldn't evict them, as you're getting paid from UC and this is the middle of a pandemic (which, above and beyond any moral qualms, may well make finding good tenants difficult).

But I also wouldn't renew their lease or do anything but necessary repairs on the house (maintenance yes; extras no). As others have said, you'll be getting the money back from the deposit.

If you can't treat this is as a business, consider getting a property company to manage it for you. They'll take a cut, and you may end up with less money, but you also won't have to worry about fielding complaints or chasing after tenants.

NameChange657 · 03/08/2020 19:07

Please don't let this put you off tenants on UC. We are not all like that! I receive a small UC top up because my health condition stops me from working full time. I pay my rent in full every month and my home is immaculate. I have even done up the garden for my LL as she is so lovely, and I love the garden. She occasionally pops in for a cup of tea and to check things over and we have a really nice relationship. Your tenants are just CF's to the extreme, try and get it paid direct to you for the arrears!

Original poster
SomeOtherGirl · 03/08/2020 19:07

So far they're paying the remaining 10% yes -and not a penny more-

OP posts:
Anonincase · 03/08/2020 19:08

You sound like such a lovely landlord @SomeOtherGirl and clearly not grabby or trying to make bucket loads over someone's situation. They seem v. unreasonable in my opinion, should absolutely prioritize rent over luxuries, and it sounds like there is some potential fraud (job etc.).

I'd either let UC take money off them each month until you are repaid in full or sell. If they keep asking for light bulb changing then definitely sell.

So many people on a tight budget would appreciate a landlord like you.

cakeandchampagne · 03/08/2020 19:10

@Boohoohoohooho

BakedCam I don’t think anyone who suggested starting the eviction process implied that it was easy.
And if the tenants are simply told they must leave, they might. Then the legal process of eviction would be unnecessary.
heartsonacake · 03/08/2020 19:11

If you’re not even 100% sure whether or not he has a job, did you not do any financial checks on them beforehand whatsoever?

If you didn’t, you kind of walked into this situation. Evict them ASAP.

GisAFag · 03/08/2020 19:11

Wow end the tenancy agreement, get them out, gave people that will pay. Gives others a bad name

Hubstar · 03/08/2020 19:13

They also need to prioritise the rent over sky

I’d remind them of this and that the sky won’t be of much use if they’ve got nowhere to use it.

Original poster
SomeOtherGirl · 03/08/2020 19:13

@heartsonacake

If you’re not even 100% sure whether or not he has a job, did you not do any financial checks on them beforehand whatsoever?

If you didn’t, you kind of walked into this situation. Evict them ASAP.

No, they said they were on UC so I presumed they did not have jobs. I mentioned this suspicion of a job in relation the subsequently not being able to afford the arrears. I did do other checks.
OP posts:
AWryGiraffe · 03/08/2020 19:17

What are the maintenance 'bits and bobs'?

ZigZagPlant · 03/08/2020 19:17

OP, I have several properties and IME you give an inch and they take a mile. As soon as you let late rent slide, or allow the odd under payment some tenants start looking at their rent as optional and only pay when they feel they ought to.

For example we have some tenants with poor credit and two large dogs. We took them on, but made it clear that we were going out on a bit of a limb and all we asked in return was that they paid on time and looked after the place. We got texts like “bad news but my car is in the garage so I can’t pay my rent” and as soon as Covid came about they asked for a rent holiday - but they hadn’t actually lost their income! We have always considered our response, but ultimately said they need to pay. Since their requests weren’t really genuine and actually it was a matter of priorities.

Our other tenants, have all been great. We have had one or two issues with a property being trashed but generally they’re fine.

Be clear with your expectations. We don’t make money month to month and since starting a family we feel a shortfall a lot more. Hence we can’t act charitably and neither should we IMO.

If this property is a nice earner either short term or long term for you, don’t let these tenants put you off. But next time, or from this point on be clear in your expectations. A candid “I’m sorry if you’re having difficulties but if you can’t afford the property then you will need to leave” helps IME.

BakedCam · 03/08/2020 19:18

@Boohoohoohooho

BakedCam I don’t think anyone who suggested starting the eviction process implied that it was easy.
You're right. They didn't. Just so the OP is aware though.
Thelittleweasel · 03/08/2020 19:18

You can start proceedings to evict them [and it's a long road]. Section 8 if the rent is more than 2 months in arrear [if I recall] or section 21 at any time after the fixed period. When you serve notice what they may do is stop paying any rent so you go to court and get a possession order and a set date. After that date you can get High Court enforcement to physically eject them at 1 hour's notice. May take 6 months. they may - in the meantime - trash the place. It may - if it is suitable - be better to arrange for the arrears by UC or some other way. You are lucky in that UC pays the rent direct. I used to let only to DSS who guarnateed the state of the property and the rent rolled in every month. That was the system and it was wonder