I'm a landlady....

[SomeOtherGirl]

I'm going to try to word this carefully. It's to do with making different life choices but it's in a sensitive area which could imply that I'm being judgemental. I don't mean to be. I'm just wondering if this sounds normal to the ears of anonymous mumsnetters.

So we have a rental property - our old place. I will try to give as much info as possible though some probably isn't totally relevant, but people might ask otherwise :-)

A nice couple moved in and they have a baby.

The deposit was covered by the council, and the monthly rent is £600, which was to be paid by them. They are on UC - they had asked me if I minded and I answered of course not!

I am 75% sure that the guy has a job of some description as he talks about it on Facebook.

They moved in and after the first month immediately fell into arrears, with a late partial payment and then a missed payment. They are a little more than a month behind on rent.

I did some research and found that the UC people can pay us about 90% of the rent directly to us, which sounded easier for everyone so I applied for that and all has been well, aside from the outstanding rent.

We asked the tenants if they can catch up this money and they said they'd have to do so in drive and drabs. This was last autumn. They have yet to make a payment but with Christmas and then corona virus I didn't push it. UC said we could apply to have it taken out from their other benefits in small chunks but I think the debt needs to equate to two months for this.

So now there are some bits and bobs to do maintenance wise so we've been looking at that and working out how to sort them out.

In the conversation, we asked if they'd be able now to start repaying the arrears as it would help with sorting out the maintenance bits. They said they could only do £10 a month as they have to pay for other stuff - namely Sky which they have at £90 a month.

I was really surprised at this. We rely on this rent as an income. I'm not able to work at present and we live modestly. I know people tend to think of their landlord as being Mr megabucks but it's not like that with us. We have netflix at 5.99 a month and thats the extent of our entertainment luxuries.

I'm just surprised that a lovely couple who get their housing costs covered plus additional benefits - and a job - see repaying this rent debt as so low priority.

Am I a bit mad? Should I sell the place?
I've not got cross with them or anything about it by the way. But I am wondering if I should sell it. They wanted me to come change a lightbulb recently. I think they've also moved an older step child in, which is fine I guess But they didn't mention it.

I try to be a really considerate landlady as far as I can but it's never going to be a perfect situation.

Just wondering what your thoughts are ? Obviously not planning on evicting them over this.

So sorry OP, they sound dreadful CF’s.
I was a landlady once but I was a soft touch too and got taken advantage of.
Hope you toughen up and get them out.
They are not nice people.
I guess this is why 99% of rental ads specify no DHSS.

I wouldn't worry too much about the arrears, £10 a month isn't great but it's better than nothing and you have their deposit, and a guarantee of 90% rent from UC. If you've been into their house, does that mean you've seen how they are keeping it? That would be more of a concern for me, potential damages.

If you do want them out, them don't bother chasing the arrears side, you won't get anywhere with that level of arrears. Instead, assuming a 6 month contract, give notice at the end of month 4 to leave at end of month 6, which I would expect them to ignore, and then start a section 21 to evict, which takes a few months. But expect them to stop caring for the house in the meantime or paying the missing 10%.

All those people who are outraged about the sky instead of rent have clearly never been a landlord and learned about the screwed priorities of some people 😂 it's not right, but the current eviction process leaves very little manoeuvre room for landlords to do anything. All those saying make them pay- how exactly?! If you're the type of person with those priorities, you've not got great principles to appeal to!

If you have a guarantor for them, that's a different matter, get chasing!

And perhaps hang off from doing any repairs till they pay what they owe you. Changing lightbulbs?! Do they think you are their slave? 😳

There was a case in the last month in which Shelter was involved where the court said "no DSS" was illegal. However you can have credit check requirements eg some lettings in London you need a salary over a certain amount so it is of course still possible not to let to people who may not pay you.
I agree - chase the guarantor for the whole sum due to be paid immediately

Re eviction to start “at fault” proceedings for rent arrears OP would need to serve a section 8. You can’t do that until the rent has been unpaid for 2 months, or the equivalent of. So stop saying eviction is an option, it’s not.

a salary over a certain amount

It should be an income. But it’s of course entirely possible to avoid DSS.

Not helpful at Al but I'm wondering why I'm paying twice as much as OP for netflix?!

Hi....presumably the £90 sky also covers internet access and possibly mobile phone charges.

If you want to evict them it can take four or five months going through the courts. I am assuming they have a contract with you just give them notice that you will not be renewing their contract...you can say you are going to sell the property if you want to give them a reason. What were their references like? Their deposit/bond should cover the lost months rent, otherwise use the small claims court to get any back rent.

If you decide to continue renting think about using an agent ...you will have to pay them but that is tax deductible.

They owe you money I would set up a meeting with them... listen to their reasons for not paying , set up a payment plan? and if this isn’t stuck to evict.... it’s a business .... you’re not a charity I’m afraid.

These are the type of tenants that make it so difficult for lots us who are renting and have to rely on UC!
This and this again. I really would have no issue letting to a working family reliant on UC, but it's the bad experiences that made me change my mind.

In my case, the issue is that they had 3 children, but two close to the age UC stopped. This is what happened over 2 years and suddenly they couldn't afford the rent when they could only claim tax credit and CB for one child. They stopped paying rent as they were not prepared to make other cuts.

It turned out the bailiffs were looking for them for other debts. The stress of it all is just not the risk, however much emotionally I genuinely feel for families in these circumstances.

Get rid of them nicely and do not threaten them with eviction because the process can take months in which time they are bound to wreck your lovely home. Unfortunately this happens all the time. Don’t renew the tenancy at the end of the term and certainly do not replace lightbulbs as that’s not your responsibility as a Landlady unless it’s a Built in special one for the oven or cooker hood or bathroom cabinet. Start feeding them a sob story that you need to move back into the property at the end of the tenancy. Carry out monthly inspections as you are entitled to do. You should not have to sell your ppty. You work hard and they clearly don’t give a sh*t from their attitude. This is why Landlords run a mile from tenants on benefits because the rent is not paid directly to them. Your deposit won’t cover all the arrears from the figures you have provided. The “Sky” attitude doesn’t surprise me at all, very commonplace along with the latest Nike trainers ( stereotype but true!)

I rented my home when we needed a larger property but couldn’t afford to buy one at the time and rented ourselves. Two days before tenant moved in we were informed that council was paying deposit (no problem we thought!), tenant worked, didn’t smoke etc. We were good landlords, fixed everything required immediately, kept going over to look at boiler (although there seemed to nothing wrong with it) 6 months down the line, tenant bought a car, couldn’t pay rent (which we needed for our rent!), and then fell continuously into arrears. Got evicted. When we received the house back found tenant didn’t work (landlord insurance specifically says they must!), smoked heavily throughout the property (walls penetrated with the smell), burnt holes in 18 month old asto turf and much more.
We had independent inventory report cataloguing damage but because the council didn’t want to pay for the damage they got there own assessor who didn’t view the property to rip the report apart and give us a fraction of the cost back. Damage £4K they offered a few hundred! It was a huge and very stressful battle. The law is in the side of the tenant now but we managed to take the guarantor to a small claims court and they paid up in the final hour.

With all the changes tax rules I’d personally sell the property (which thankfully we have now!)

I would put it through an agent, you sound too nice to do it yourself. Evicting might be too hard at present but I would approach UC to get arrears. Good luck

@langley0509

I would put it through an agent, you sound too nice to do it yourself. Evicting might be too hard at present but I would approach UC to get arrears. Good luck

Just out of interest how much do agency's quote to look after your property?

Be very careful with the agency you pick. I had a bad experience with the one we were using and many people have said the sane. They wanted 10% of the monthly rent to supposedly fully manage the property.

Except that they didn't do that. All they would do was call me as soon as they fit a call or letter, never cared to find out more about the issue and whether it was something the tenant could resolve themselves. They hardly bothered to take details of the problem but we're always very quick to suggest sending their tradespeople.

Then we found out that they made deals with these tradespeople sending them their business and tradespeople charging 20 to 50% more than similar tradespeople in the town.

We even had a time when the tenants had no water coming but despite calling the agency, they did nothing, closed at 5 without following it up and I had to manage the situation myself directly with the tenants.

I also had issue with their inspections ( claiming brand new items were just in good conditions, claiming things were broken when perfectly working, taking very dark pictures so you can't really see any damages, and overall providing a very minimal service at quite a high cost.

I was in the end spending more time they were doing what they were supposed to (once the deposit was still not protected after 4 weeks, claim they were about to when I'm sure it wouldn't have been if I hadn't chased) so however much I don't like managing it myself, it's a much better alternative than using an agency.

You sound tooooo nice!

If their rent is being paid no and they are not doing any damage think about the hassle of finding new tenants and consider taking the hit on the arrears.

I don't bother with deposits any more, just insist on tenants providing 2 guarantors who are property owners and who pass credit reference checks.

Any late or partial payment tenant gets a letter stating that the guarantors will be asked to make up the payment if it doesn't arrive in the next 7 days.

Sky is shit. Also, why don’t you tell them exactly what you have written here? I think some people need to hear that they are doing bullshit in order to get a grip on themselves. I would tell them exactly what I think.

Give them notice, get different tenants with references from previous landlords. The fact that you accept tenants on benefits is admirable, most won't. It's these kinds of tenants as to why that is.
The longer they are there, the further into disrepair it will become. Be prepared for a long eviction process, but it's definitely worth it for your sanity.

YANBU. You are a nice landlord and they know it.

Go over to change the light bulb but only as a conversation starter then tell them not only will you not be coming over to change light bulbs in the future but they need to catch up on their rent ASAP. Tell them you will be contacting UC in the near future to recoup your losses and explain their rent is paying the mortgage so the losses come directly out of your pocket as some tenants assume the mortgage has been paid and the money is extra income.

Make it clear they are not prioritising their bills appropriately and you are aware he is working so there is no excuse. Set a time limit and say if it is not pay by X date you will not renew their contract as currently you've no confidence that this debt will not worsen over time and you cannot afford to take the hit.

Mean it.

We're landlords and our tenant is lovely but we've had enough, generally it's been too stressful over the years with previous tenants so we're selling once the pandemic is behind us and we're giving her 1st refusal to buy.

I'd evict them without a second thought. They are ripping the piss out of you. As a pp said, you won't see a penny of those arrears from them and this sounds like the start of a very slippery slope. How they can possibly afford £90 Sky fees a month on UC is outrageous! Benefit should be for those in need (I could go on but I won't as it's not that type of thread).

Good luck OP.

Get the rent direct from Unemployment, then it becomes the tenants problem. I'm a tenant and I would never, ever, do this. Go straight to the top and claim your money. Also, give them notice of eviction at the same time.

They are not a lovely couple, they are trying it on.
evict them

Thread is from 4 years ago so they've probably sorted it!

This situation will not improve. Your tenants have different (financial) priorities from you and have shown a lack of respect to you (light bulb changing and extra tenants in your property).
You have to decide if you want this to carry on ( is it financially viable for you?).

The eviction process is long and stressful but an end will be in sight. There is an excellent fixed fee legal firm who can handle this for you.
Or just let the current situation rumble on which will be stressful, expensive and harder to sort as legislation changes are imminent.
There are tenant checking services and prospective tenants can be asked for financial proof of outgoings/budgets for next time to help avoid this for future tenancies ( if you want to carry on as a landlord).
Good luck