I'm a landlady....

[SomeOtherGirl]

I'm going to try to word this carefully. It's to do with making different life choices but it's in a sensitive area which could imply that I'm being judgemental. I don't mean to be. I'm just wondering if this sounds normal to the ears of anonymous mumsnetters.

So we have a rental property - our old place. I will try to give as much info as possible though some probably isn't totally relevant, but people might ask otherwise :-)

A nice couple moved in and they have a baby.

The deposit was covered by the council, and the monthly rent is £600, which was to be paid by them. They are on UC - they had asked me if I minded and I answered of course not!

I am 75% sure that the guy has a job of some description as he talks about it on Facebook.

They moved in and after the first month immediately fell into arrears, with a late partial payment and then a missed payment. They are a little more than a month behind on rent.

I did some research and found that the UC people can pay us about 90% of the rent directly to us, which sounded easier for everyone so I applied for that and all has been well, aside from the outstanding rent.

We asked the tenants if they can catch up this money and they said they'd have to do so in drive and drabs. This was last autumn. They have yet to make a payment but with Christmas and then corona virus I didn't push it. UC said we could apply to have it taken out from their other benefits in small chunks but I think the debt needs to equate to two months for this.

So now there are some bits and bobs to do maintenance wise so we've been looking at that and working out how to sort them out.

In the conversation, we asked if they'd be able now to start repaying the arrears as it would help with sorting out the maintenance bits. They said they could only do £10 a month as they have to pay for other stuff - namely Sky which they have at £90 a month.

I was really surprised at this. We rely on this rent as an income. I'm not able to work at present and we live modestly. I know people tend to think of their landlord as being Mr megabucks but it's not like that with us. We have netflix at 5.99 a month and thats the extent of our entertainment luxuries.

I'm just surprised that a lovely couple who get their housing costs covered plus additional benefits - and a job - see repaying this rent debt as so low priority.

Am I a bit mad? Should I sell the place?
I've not got cross with them or anything about it by the way. But I am wondering if I should sell it. They wanted me to come change a lightbulb recently. I think they've also moved an older step child in, which is fine I guess But they didn't mention it.

I try to be a really considerate landlady as far as I can but it's never going to be a perfect situation.

Just wondering what your thoughts are ? Obviously not planning on evicting them over this.

I'm also a landlord.

What you have to understand that this is a business, the personal stuff takes second place.

So it doesnt matter if you are not rich or if the rent is in arrears, if maintenance or repairs need doing (I dont mean changing a lightbulb here) you have to do them.

In return your tenants pay rent for use of the property. If they dont, you take action.

If you cant at least break even, sell up. It's really straightforward but it is a job of work.

I used to deal with mortgage arrears and if someone said they could not increase their payments because of paying sky £90 per month I would say that sky won’t be much use to them when they had no roof over their heads .

That and high monthly phone rentals used to really wind me up .

They’re being cheeky AF! And taking advantage of your good nature. Change a lightbulb my arse! We’d all like things we can’t afford but we get our priorities right, grrr they’ve really got my goat 🙄 so annoyed on your behalf OP

@SomeOtherGirl

Gosh I should have enabled voting... I thought I'd get flamed

I think you still can.

I thought you were going to have to call the fire brigade too, hence the popcorn.

They’ve got to understand that they have responsibilities as well as rights

Fortunately most tenants (and LLs) are decent, but the attitude of these invites the comment "good luck with that"

Sadly, to some, "responsibility" is a dirty word - and I wouldn't fancy OP's chances of getting them out with the rent and property intact

they helped me do an eviction with paperwork etc plus advice
legally your tenant is 2 months overdue a day after their second rent is due ie if its first of month & say they didn't pay July on than august 2nd they are overdue 2 months - but be aware even under normal circumstances section 21 can take up to 6 months - & usually they will be advised to stay until bailiffs which can be another 3 weeks
You need to make sure you are up to date with your checks & paperwork

just get the arrearsthrough uc if youve asked and they said they cant afford it then youve tried to be reasonable

sky packages dont cost that much theyre all add ons that can be removed-i.e movies, sport

Get rid. Serve them the correct notices to quit, then when they leave deduct the rent arrears from their deposit.

Agree with mentioning that you're thinking of selling because you can't afford to subsidise their underpayment
Are you getting the 10% top up if only 90% is covered by the direct payment.
Find out if you can recover the old debt through UC payments. (or can you increase the rent by a small amount to make it up when they get to the end of tenancy and want to renew? - eg increase rent to £620 so that you get £20 towards the arrears) - or just not renew the tenancy - how long does it run for?

I hate the idea of landlords. I hate that people have more than they need.

It’s not generally the case that people have more than they need. A huge number of landlords come about because they move in with partners and rent out their own. Also with a vast lack of council housing without private landlords their wouldn’t be enough housing. However I am a huge advocate of council housing and think there should be much more and wish Maggie hadn’t sold most of it off!

You need to stop worrying so much about being a lovely landlady! You can be fair and professional without caring about how you’re viewed - by your tenants, or people on here.

What’s all this, “lovely couple” nonsense? You sound like one of those patronising women who bang on about the wonderful cleaner they couldn’t live without.

That said, I think the repeated, “lovely couple” is less about being patronising and more about you caring how you’re perceived, by posters.

They are not a lovely couple.

• they stole over £600 from you, the minute they decided to picket the UC
• they have no intention of paying you back if they’re offering £10 a month
• they’re taking the piss having an additional child living there that wasn’t agreed with you

They know what they’re doing. They were brazen enough to stop paying you IMMEDIATELY. They know, that it is so difficult to get tenants out, and costly, and that there’s often a void period with no rent, that for one month of rent - most landlords are going to write it off.

I’m even going to suggest that you do - for the reasons that they damn well know.

Continue renting to them, accept in writing the £10 towards their debt but state that it’s not a fixed agreement - you expect it to be increased ASAP.

And forget ANY nonsense about them being a, “lovely couple.”

I work for a HA and we apply for 3rd party deductions for arrears as well as direct payments. I would do that - UC do deduct high amounts but that isn’t your problem. Once cleared, you can cancel them.

I think you need to get tough

They need the arrears paying. I’d ring UC and have it taken out

Or if they don’t want that. Then I would write a letter explains that they have till the end of the year to pay back the arrears or you’re going to start the eviction process

You need to grow a backbone in regards to this situation. You sound so so lovely and I think that’s being taken advantage of.

Please start eviction and get some good tenants when you’re able too

My bil is a LL and as he is overseas, we handle his property.

I think you're being more than fair here and the Sky package is irrelevant.

The current Covid-19 restrictions on hearings for possession are currently on hold until August 24th. This may be subject to change though if the government decides to extend.

However, if the tenants are in 8 weeks or more arrears and you've made every reasonable attempt to come to an arrangement with your tenants, as in the £10 p month repayment arrangement, have you accepted this arrangement?

My bill tenants have had difficulty as the main wage earner has lost their job. We did give a three month payment break as they're really excellent tenants and brought the problem to us straight away. Having lived there for six years, with no problems and they really do care and look after their home, we have agreed that if they can repay 50% back following a new job, then we would be satisfied with that arrangement. However, for now, they have resumed full rent as it is being covered by UC of which we don't have a right to know about. They're a lovely family and the last thing we wanted was for them to be worried they were going to lose their home.

If you've accepted the £10 pm arrangement, then you'll have to go along with it. There is little you can do about this. If they've resumed their normal rental payments, plus the £10, then if they break this arrangement, you can the issue a s8 notice of seeking possession. Now , that doesnt mean that you'll be immediately seeking possession, it gives them time to address the arrears and come to a further agreement.

Unfortunately, you're legal responsibility is to maintain the structure and keep the property in a good state so the tenants are able to enjoy quiet enjoyment. Them being in arrears does not absolve you of those requirements. Changing a light bulb is their responsibility.

Our sky bill is about £100 a month (DH pays it all, I'm not bothered with it). We have all channels including movies and sports.

You sound like a proper good 'un. I'd be claiming the arrears directly from UC.

Oh, we have Sky broadband too.

You are being more than fair and they obviously do not see paying the rent as a priority.

Evict and sell - you do not need the hassle.

Landlords are the most hated..really I thought it was Teachers.

Get firm OP....you sound lovely....give them 1 month to make substantially more payments or explain you will have to take further actions to recover the money.

I think they need to be shaken up, I would write to them laying out the extent of their arrears and explain this cannot go on and unless some sort of payment plane is put into place you will consider eviction. You are clearly too kind.

You are getting yourself confused because you are nice

It does not matter if they are nice or not. It does not matter if they like you or not. It does not matter if they have Sky or how they spend their income.

The only thing that matters is the contract (please tell me you have a proper tenancy contract)

And they need to pay on time. If not, start the eviction process. This needs to be done by the book, correct notices served etc.

You need to fulfil your duties as a landlord, ie has and elec safety certificates etc. Lightbulbs are probably not part of this.

It is a business arrangement, start treating it as such.

It’s futile and pointless to try and be liked by your tenants. I am a landlord, I have tenants, they are good tenants as they always pay on time and aren’t a nuisance to the neighbours. I am (I hope) a good landlord and deal with any issues that arise, keep the house in good nick etc.

UC or Sky or whether they are nice is all irrelevant

Hey ho, OP. Just one of the risks of running a business I suppose. Sometimes clients pay late for whatever reason. Sounds like they are potless (that £90 a month for Sky may be their only pleasure, and whatever the rights and wrongs, are unlikely to relinquish it) so it may just be a case of sucking it up. As a businesswoman, of course you'll have made contingencies for this.

£90 a month for Sky? I didn’t know you could have a monthly subscription that high!

They are CFs and don’t deserve any more time. Give them notice and get rid.

UC are now paying the rent and it makes it feel like THEY are paying, blinding me a bit

You sound lovely, OP, but in the nicest possible way are you sure you're cut out for this?
Because an alternative assessment could be that they're already getting their largest expense met - even the deposit was paid by the council - and that any suggestion that they move on or reconsider their priorities may not be well received

As PPs have said it's a shame for the counless decent benefit claimants, but this is exactly why some LLs avoid them at all costs

OP , you're far too nice , your tenants are taking advantage as they know you're a soft touch and unfortunately , they're probably laughing behind your back ~ change a light bulb ffs !

I would take steps to evict them. You should have cracked down from the start. Sod Christmas and Sky - you pay your bills first.