To think no, there should not be additional support for people who are on holiday in Spain

[paellaandpies]

If you dashed off on holiday when it’s bleeding blindingly bloody obvious that this virus has not gone away but was just subdued by lockdown, no you shouldn’t be entitled to any extra help with having to quarantine when you come home!

Some of us haven’t seen family for months, we have taken pay cuts and lost jobs, we haven’t rushed into pubs and bars and onto beaches, precisely because we do not want to see a second spike.

If you choose to go on holiday and to travel, that’s your right and your choice and it’s not illegal, but you should have been isolating on your return anyway. Those of us who have been more restrained do not want to catch it because you couldn’t wait a bit longer for a holiday, and you’re spreading it all over the place when you get back. If you chose a holiday, you can deal with the isolation to keep everyone else a bit safer.

AIBU?

@lifeafter50 then the danger is they will at the very least break lockdown and risk wider infection - so a win win... not!

Now it maybe that we are all law abiding but it may also be the Police cannot enforce this law.

Honestly I think once furlough finishes, lots more people just aren't going to adhere. And most of them will get away with it. There are people who can't lose two weeks income and people who won't, and if you want people to stay at home and not work you have to pay at least some of them for it. We don't do ourselves any favours by pretending otherwise. TBH the Spain question is only a small part of that picture. It's going to be played out in lots more situations unless covid starts to significantly wane.

It was never declared "safe". The travel ban was lifted - it's completely different. The govt stopped banning it, but certainly weren't encouraging it.

Hence 'safe' rather than safe.

Seemed easier tbh than writing a huge post, as assumed people would know what I meant if I used ' .

So again, the question is whether we think it's worth paying people to quarantine who wouldn't be able to afford it otherwise. We're not going to get anywhere answering that question if we're pretending it doesn't exist.

If someone spends all their money doing something and as a result can’t afford do pay their bills because something unexpected comes up should the government step in and pay their bills? Did it happen pre-covid? People in that situation have been doing this for a long time. I don’t believe anything outwith the current support should be available.

I think the government should be making it clear to employers that they need to allow people to take extra leave either annual or unpaid to be able to quarantine, or to allow people to work at home. But in terms of financial support, I don’t think that’s necessary.

I think there should be support generally for people who have to self isolate. They’re being asked to do it to protect everyone else, some people may have to isolate multiple times and some people’s job puts them at more risk if they’re dealing with the public.

But I don’t really have sympathy for those who jetted off abroad at the first opportunity, despite knowing guidance could be changed again, they took that risk, now they have to deal with the consequences.

However, it’s probably best for us at a population level of nobody has to choose between isolating and keeping a roof over their head. But I would also stop airlines flying to countries the FCO are advising against travel to (other than repatriating the idiots already out there), and only give protection to those who travelled while guidance allowed it. If people choose to travel against FCO advice then on their own head be it.

starbuggy
sadly 3 million workers have not been allowed to work since March, but have not had any financial help at all. Roofs over heads have already gone.

If someone spends all their money doing something and as a result can’t afford do pay their bills because something unexpected comes up should the government step in and pay their bills?

In order for any analogy to apply here, it has to include quarantine in a pandemic. Someone not paying their bills isn't in itself going to give anyone else covid.

I'm perfectly open to the idea that the likely cost isn't worth the likely risk reduction, btw, especially if it's backed up with any knowledge of those things. As I'm not in a position to assess them myself, I don't feel able to make that call. But comparisons to situations where the material facts aren't the same get us nowhere.

I think the government should be making it clear to employers that they need to allow people to take extra leave either annual or unpaid to be able to quarantine, or to allow people to work at home. But in terms of financial support, I don’t think that’s necessary

I don’t think employers should have to be that flexible, they have a business to run and can’t control of their staff travel or not. Yes for a family emergency or funeral, not for a week or two in the sun just because they want one,

All just sounds like sanctimonious jealousy to me. So none of you complaining have gone to the hairdressers/pubs/visited friends and family etc since that's been allowed as you're all being much more cautious and smarter than following the government advice and taking personal responsibility for not spreading the virus, sticking to full lock down? Yeah, right.

I'm currently on holiday in Greece with my family. Both my husband and I have worked full time and done full time child care and home schooling throughout this whole thing. We've started our days at 6am and both worked until 11pm at night every single day to get through it all. We booked this holiday back in January and we needed the break more than most and are prepared to accept the consequences. The judgement of people on here sounds so much like sour grapes. When will you all be getting a haircut then? Not until the virus is eradicated I presume?

MrsAD fine to go on holiday and take the risk of quarantine, just no extra support.

This is such a toxic attitude.

In order to fight the virus where it is needed sometimes decisions will have to be made quickly and they will inconvenience us in some way or other. I think if we are being asked to self isolate for two weeks then our employers should be able to pay us and claim it back or we should be able to claim in some way.

Self isolating for 2 weeks is not just for people coming back from holiday but for anyone of us who may come into contact with the virus.

I don’t think employers should have to be that flexible, they have a business to run and can’t control of their staff travel or not. Yes for a family emergency or funeral, not for a week or two in the sun just because they want one

So you think employers should bully people in to coming in or risk losing their jobs? That’s not going to help the Covid situation now, is it?

I don't really see how it's any different to paying for furlough through my taxes. People doing nothing wrong, going about their lives within the government guidelines, who have been caught out by the virus. Life has to start again some time

and are prepared to accept the consequences

If you are happy to accept the consequences then this post doesn’t apply to you, does it?

I also am in the fortunate position that I can accept the consequences. But I don't object to helping those who can't and were only doing what the guidelines said they were allowed either

MrsAD tg it’s not the case. Support has been huge already. As you’re happy to accept the consequences then it doesn’t apply to you anyway.

I agree
If they u-turn on this (and I bloody well hope not) we will be going back to the dithering and delay in key decisions being made because the cost of compensation is too high.

I agree with the points that this unfairly affects keyworkers on low wages more than the wfh people and I am sorry that they were unlucky not to have returned a few days ago. However there was always going to be a risk of being stuck in quarantine overseas or in the UK and the only surprising part is the quick response for a change.

You can give money to someone if it makes you feel better. This country is piled high in debt. Luckily even Sunak has railed it in.

But those of us who are going to pubs, hairdressers etc are indeed taking the risk of having to self-isolate if we are tracked and traced as a result of a case arising there, and be unpaid for those two weeks, tho the Gvt has not spelled that out -they probably should!
The employer could, if they are able, allow people to use up two weeks of nexts year's leave, or take unpaid. Inconvenient for the employer, but better than them, or the taxpayer funding it.
The whole situation is difficult for everyone, so complaining about holidays is otiose. On one hand people were saying 'shut down the whole economy if it will save one life', now it's 'bugger the lives, I want my holiday or I want to cancel my holiday and lose nothing -let somebody else /anybody else take the hit - not me!'

However they went to Spain knowing full well things could change in a heartbeat so they should've considered whether they could afford to quarantine for 14 days should the rules change. I'm not willing to pick up the bill for people that just couldn't bear to forgo their holiday.

^

This. Lots of people have chosen to forgo their holidays because they have considered the risks and decided it was not worth it. They too have worked hard and homeschooled during lockdown, were desperate for a holiday and maybe out of pocket. Why should they stump up for those who decided to ignore any risks and go ahead? The culture in this country that expects the government to bail them out for everything is just ridiculous.

Here ia an analogy... Johnson has said "go out and spend on the high street, go to restaurant" Sunak will even pay 50% of the food bill BUT after enjoying your 1/2 price meal, you are contacted by track and trace and told the table next to you were riddled with CV and you now have to isolate for 14 days.....

Your employer sacks you, you now can't get UC (as you caused your dismissal by not being able to work)

Do you think you should get some help?

Hols restrictions were lifted in June and the Govt said at the time "this will enable Brits to have a summer holiday....

I worked full time during lockdown and would dearly love a holiday. I cancelled mine but kept one week of leave. I kidded myself I could sit in my garden and pretend. It rained all fucking week and still makes me upset and bitter a month later (I know, first world problems...). I wouldn't blame anyone for trying to get away.

But I think the Govt should now warn people (if they haven't already worked it out) that quarantine could be re-imposed at any moment . TBH I was surprised that Spain was ever okay given their infection rate was so bad.

We were warned that guidelines could suddenly change if the situation warranted it. Eg the local lockdown in Leicester

We were never told that it was safe to go on holiday. The aviation and tourism industries obviously pushed for reopening and the government were happy to comply. We should be more concerned about BA staff www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-53192185 than people who took a gamble and lost.

I think all holiday companies should have honoured a full cancellation if booked pre covid (not sure if hey did)

But if you have still chosen to go or booked since the lockdowns then no

It was a risk you can’t be that unaware to not know that the virus has not disappeared and that lockdowns can happen at any time and shall continue to happen

I sympathise but it was always a risk

We not seeing family (my dad isn’t getting on) and ds probably won’t see his dad for a year it’s very upsetting knowing that but that’s the situation and we have to live with it

If people have gone on holiday I don't believe they should have additional support offered. We'd love to go away, but even with air bridges we assessed the risks:
a) we could get isolated when we get back
b) there could be a local lockdown where we go and we can't get back and have to support ourselves there (this could still happen)

If you have paid for a holiday and can't get your money back in real terms you haven't lost anything because you paid for an experience. So obviously you won't have had a holiday but you haven't lost an asset (like a car or house).

It was for these reasons we decided not to go, plus it's bit silly to travel when we are all well aware that Covid-19 spreads in the air.