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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Update on my DSD situation

154 replies

hotstepper4 · 22/07/2020 07:52

I'm not sure how to link to old threads but if you search my user ID I did a thread called "to think about her all the time"

I described how Dh and I haven't seen my dsd11 (12 in August) for a year. She cut him out of her life, after accusing him of abusing her. Recently, she confessed to her dm that this was a lie and that she said it because she didn't like the screen limitations at ours.

This was obviously a massive kick in the teeth as, you'll see from my other thread, I really adored her, and her accusations really affected Dh.

Something happened last night, and I'd like peoples views on it. Early evening, watching tv with Dh and there's a knock at the door. Dh opens it and it's dsd. She comes flying in, throws her arms around him, like nothing ever happened. I gave her a big hug too, we were both very aware of the strangeness of the situation but the last thing I wanted was to make her feel unwelcome.

After around half an hour, she told us that her dm, dh's exw, had no idea that she was even here, that she'd snuck out the back door while her dm was in the toilet. It was then that I realised she didn't have any shoes on! It's a 30 minute walk between our houses, thinking about what could have happened to her feet is 😫

Of course Dh immediately phoned her mum, who had been calling around dsds friends. It hadnt even occurred to her that she would be at our house as she has ignored every text message Dh has sent her in a year, and has strongly resisted contact. She immediately wanted to speak to dsd and I could hear her shouting at her.

Dsd was upset then, so I took her up to ds10s room and the 4 of us played Mario kart which broke the ice, ds was so happy to see dsd and they were laughing their heads off, after dsd was sitting cuddling Dh for a while. Then I suggested I'd walk her home to her mums as her mum had told her she wanted her back at specific time, however dsd asked if Dh could walk her instead which of course I was pleased about.

He got home a while later, and apparently dsd had had an argument with her dm about not cleaning out her fish tank. Her dm said she'd called her an idiot so she had confiscated her phone. This is why she ran away, however on the way home dsd was telling Dh that she doesn't know who she is, that she wants to wear boys clothes but that her mother keeps buying her dresses, and that she wants her hair cut short but her mother won't allow it. Dh suggested that he could see dsd again this coming weekend however she refused, my belief is that she'll go back to ignoring him as soon as her phone is returned to him.

Dh is going to just go back to dropping her the odd text and making sure she knows that we will always accept her for whomever she wants to be.

Is this what anyone would do? Does this behaviour raise any red flags?

OP posts:
BobbieDraper · 22/07/2020 10:25

They need family counselling. Have you ever tried to arrange counselling at all for her alone plus her and her father/mother? The girl needs some help.

Zaphodsotherhead · 22/07/2020 10:26

She forwarded his own daughters school report? Why does he not get a copy? My kids' school used to send out duplicate copies of reports to both parents....

Does this mean that he generally has no idea how she's doing at school? No parents' evenings attended or teacher interface?

hotstepper4 · 22/07/2020 10:27

I agree counselling between the three of them could be really good, however I think we'd have to wait until it was in person as I don't think dsd would respond well to zoom counselling.

OP posts:
CodexDevinchi · 22/07/2020 10:27

Hotstepper don’t label her as manipulative, she is a child and will have no real idea of what she is doing. She is a child stuck between two families. I can tell you from experience it’s not a nice place to be.

The fact she was so easily able to cut you all out shows that she wasn’t that close to any of you. And you and dh as adults need to recognise that. How did that happen? When did she be one disconnected from her dad? These are questions you really need to analyse.

Dh, dsd and her mother need to go to family therapy sessions together. Her father and mother brought her in to the world - they need to make sure she goes in to adulthood as mentally healthy as she can possibly be and ignoring will just make it worse.

The wanting to wear boys clothes can be discussed in the therapy sessions and why her mother insists on girls clothes. Boys clothes tend to be pants and t-shirts so in reality means nothing - yet.

Don’t underestimate where this child is emotionally, she may act completely fine but I bet her brain is a jumbled mess of confusion, rejection, love, hate, anxiety.

Being able to cut herself off from her father at such an early age is really worrying and it shouldn’t have been left unexplored properly.

The two main adults in her life are doing something wrong and they need to find out what it is.

hotstepper4 · 22/07/2020 10:29

She doesn't send him the kids reports. He usually calls the schools and asks them to make a copy for him. However due to covid that wasn't possible this time.

OP posts:
MagnoliatheMagnificent · 22/07/2020 10:41

Does she have other siblings? (your last comment sounds like it) What is his relationship like with them?

InTheWings · 22/07/2020 10:56

I don’t think she sounds ‘spoilt and manipulative’ as suggested by a pp, I think she sounds ‘distressed with no clue as to how to help herself’. And is projecting herself into all sorts of situations to comfort herself (that her little brother is a full brother) or to set off an alarm for help and attention: as a victim, or a misfit, in society or her own body.

What you do about this, especially as her Mum and Dad are not working as a team, I am not sure.

Unfortunately the direction of much counselling of young people who express gender divergence is unquestioningly affirmative and may not look at possible feelings of disaffection and disassociation or traits such as ASD.

Thislittlelady · 22/07/2020 10:56

Think dh and ex have to work together on this so really need to set aside differences firstly. Dsd does appear to be playing them off one another so be aware of that. Dsd needs support and understanding. Kids can be going through phases, or making realistic decisions about the person they are , so need to be open to this. Dressing is a non issue - let her wear what she wants. The hair, maybe a compromise get it a bit shorter and see how she feels? My dd is same, but I wouldn’t allow her to fully crop all her bum length hair off. I said it can b quite a shock and if u don’t like it , it takes ages to grow back .... so we settled on a good foot off even though this left it shoulder/blade length. She said she was actually happy she didn’t chop it all off as she likes it the way it is. And as long as you’re willing to be supportive I would imagine things will work our well. She needs her m and d to work together as a team so the treatment and rules are consistent.

Brefugee · 22/07/2020 10:58

Why the leap to “gender issues”? Maybe as she enters puberty she’s simply conscious of the focus on her looks, and her mum always wanting her to be “pretty” and feminine.

yep, how does a girl wanting short hair and not to have to wear only dresses turn into a transgender issue? maybe she just wants to wear trousers and have short hair - many of us do and aren't transgender (not that it would be a bad thing)

Zaphodsotherhead · 22/07/2020 11:05

I wouldn't quickly jump to the 'kids don't know what they are doing, she's not manipulative she's just unhappy' conclusion either. I remember myself at 12, when the hormones kicked in and yes, I was most definitely manipulative. I thought I was deeply misunderstood and unhappy - looking back on it now, I was really just a bit of a madam.

Theluggagerules · 22/07/2020 11:07

If he has parental rights then he should be able to ask to have all school communications sent to him as well, without having to ask each time. He could also speak to her teacher about behaviour at school

hotstepper4 · 22/07/2020 11:08

She has 2 brothers, dss10 and dss8. She hates them. One of the other reasons she cited for not wanting contact with Dh anymore is that she didn't want to spend all the weekend with her brothers. They are hard work. Dss10 is diagnosed Asbergers and dss8 is a cheeky chappy but he is hyper energetic and will run you into the ground

OP posts:
Zaphodsotherhead · 22/07/2020 11:10

Does she mean that her brothers take the attention away from her...?

FlibbertyGiblets · 22/07/2020 11:11

Does DH have parental responsibility for the children? I can't think of another reason why the school/s aren't sending copies of reports to both of the seperated father and mother.
Odd.

hotstepper4 · 22/07/2020 11:14

Yes he does have PR.

He is calling dsds doctor today to discuss her with them. He is going to find out what they think and whether they can get any help for dsd without the dms input.

I was researching bpd in adolescence and this passage really stood out

Update on my DSD situation
OP posts:
1moremum · 22/07/2020 11:15

setting aside the gender issues, the child has behavioral issues that need serious attention. that have lied about sexual abuse. they accused their father of a crime. that is HUGE. and all the adults just maintained the distance that the child created. Then something triggered them at their other parents home, and they went running to the parent they accused of a crime and rejected, leaving the custodial parent in a panic.

This child is trying to play for control, they feel a lack of control. for whatever reasons. perhaps an extreme case of just being the child of a broken relationship. perhaps it is related to the trans issues. perhaps someone unrelated is abusing them. all their lies and dramatics are screaming for help. it isn't about screen time and fishtanks.

Destroyedpeople · 22/07/2020 11:15

'Hate' 'adore' 'devastated'...
It's all v dramatic isn't it?
I am sure she doesn't 'hate ' her brothers.
Do you think she might have picked up on the drama and be feeding into it?

ChateauMargaux · 22/07/2020 11:18

Read Irreversible Damage by Abigail Shrier (slightly hysterical and American centred but worth a read on the gender side of things) and try to encourage your DH to enter into a dialogue with her Mum.

Pinklynx · 22/07/2020 11:32

If she does have BPD the recommended therapy is DBT, which is a combination of support and boundaried therapy. In other words showing care but also tough love.

The worst thing for your DSD is what is happening at the moment because by playing everyone off against each other there are no firm boundaries. If it is at all possible the two parents need to present a united front: so if she accuses DH of being abusive for not allowing endless screen time, then the DM has to push back on that and agree that those are DH's rules and DSD has to abide by them.

Meanwhile if she runs to you because DM has taken away the phone, then DH has to support DM, at least to DSD's face, whatever conversation goes on afterwards between DM and DH. Consistency is really important because if she feels out of control (which is v common for tweens and teens) it will help her feel safe.

If DM refuses to play ball, it's still better not to undermine her decisions. Good cop/bad cop is not helpful.

Btw you sound like a lovely, caring SM and she's lucky to have you!

knittingaddict · 22/07/2020 11:55

What happened to "I believe you" ?

Haven't read your other thread, but are you seriously saying that no investigation was done after the accusations? "Because you knew" ? It doesnt matter what her behaviour is/was like, any accusation should be thoroughly investigated

I agree so much Midnight. I'm very confused by the vast majority of posts on here. Allegations of abuse should be taken seriously, even if just getting help for the child who has made it up. One of the consequences of abuse is disturbed and worrying behaviour by the victim. You can't just dismiss this.

Lollyneenah · 22/07/2020 12:03

Is there a court order in place for contact? I think that would probably be best starting pot

CodexDevinchi · 22/07/2020 12:25

What what? Your dh was accused of sexual abuse by his dd? Why wasn’t this investigated properly?

Puzzledandpissedoff · 22/07/2020 12:27

dsd admitted she'd made the whole thing up because Dh took her phone away from her one night and she was angry

That's all very well, but if she'd repeated her claim at school or wherever all hell could have descended on your DH

She sounds a very troubled lass and without doubt needs help - though given her parents' relationship it won't be easy - but in thinking what's best for her please don't forget your own security too

knittingaddict · 22/07/2020 12:30

Apparently it wasn't sexual abuse, which I think is where I go first if the abuse isn't described. However the op doesn't say what the abuse accusation actually was on this thread. You would think she would mention what it was.

knittingaddict · 22/07/2020 12:32

I have to say that if my husband had been accused of abuse and it hadn't been dealt with or investigated, I would be advising him to never be alone with her. That would be for his own protection as much as anything. Even that basic doesn't seem to be happening here. Failures all round from what I can see.

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