Update on my DSD situation

[hotstepper4]

I'm not sure how to link to old threads but if you search my user ID I did a thread called "to think about her all the time"

I described how Dh and I haven't seen my dsd11 (12 in August) for a year. She cut him out of her life, after accusing him of abusing her. Recently, she confessed to her dm that this was a lie and that she said it because she didn't like the screen limitations at ours.

This was obviously a massive kick in the teeth as, you'll see from my other thread, I really adored her, and her accusations really affected Dh.

Something happened last night, and I'd like peoples views on it. Early evening, watching tv with Dh and there's a knock at the door. Dh opens it and it's dsd. She comes flying in, throws her arms around him, like nothing ever happened. I gave her a big hug too, we were both very aware of the strangeness of the situation but the last thing I wanted was to make her feel unwelcome.

After around half an hour, she told us that her dm, dh's exw, had no idea that she was even here, that she'd snuck out the back door while her dm was in the toilet. It was then that I realised she didn't have any shoes on! It's a 30 minute walk between our houses, thinking about what could have happened to her feet is 😫

Of course Dh immediately phoned her mum, who had been calling around dsds friends. It hadnt even occurred to her that she would be at our house as she has ignored every text message Dh has sent her in a year, and has strongly resisted contact. She immediately wanted to speak to dsd and I could hear her shouting at her.

Dsd was upset then, so I took her up to ds10s room and the 4 of us played Mario kart which broke the ice, ds was so happy to see dsd and they were laughing their heads off, after dsd was sitting cuddling Dh for a while. Then I suggested I'd walk her home to her mums as her mum had told her she wanted her back at specific time, however dsd asked if Dh could walk her instead which of course I was pleased about.

He got home a while later, and apparently dsd had had an argument with her dm about not cleaning out her fish tank. Her dm said she'd called her an idiot so she had confiscated her phone. This is why she ran away, however on the way home dsd was telling Dh that she doesn't know who she is, that she wants to wear boys clothes but that her mother keeps buying her dresses, and that she wants her hair cut short but her mother won't allow it. Dh suggested that he could see dsd again this coming weekend however she refused, my belief is that she'll go back to ignoring him as soon as her phone is returned to him.

Dh is going to just go back to dropping her the odd text and making sure she knows that we will always accept her for whomever she wants to be.

Is this what anyone would do? Does this behaviour raise any red flags?

OP I remember the backstory no it isn’t what anyone would do. You need professional support and intervention and properly sitting down with her Mum
None of this is normal let’s ignore and send the odd text behaviour
But if I remember correctly your DH can’t be bothered with dealing with any of this

@DomDoesWotHeWants

He's right to tread gently, OP. The only sensible way forward.

Tread gently doesn't mean do fuck all. He needs to be proactive and involved in getting help for what is obviously a very troubled little girl.

The abuse claims were never acted on because her mother knew what dsd was like and I believe she always knew she was lying.

The gender issues I am not so sure of. I saw her 1 week out of every month for 6 years and my impressions were that she was never a girly girl. She always hated skirts and dresses. She hated pink. She had no interest in makeup and hair and I used to have to bribe her with sweets to let me braid her hair, as she would happily leave it unbrushed for days. She adored my ds10 and often used to call him her best friend. I found bits of paper in her drawer after she estranged herself with things like "I wish me and ds10 name were real brother and sister" yet she had no issues cutting him out of her life too.

Her dm used to bring her to ours wearing a beautiful dress, which she would immediately take off.

I agree she is incredibly manipulative and always has been but I do love her very much and I worry for her teen years and what behaviours she'll have

@isadorapolly

I’ve only read the op but she sounds very spoilt and manipulative. Not sure what to suggest to help but she sounds like she needs more boundaries and less pandering to.

I was thinking that.

She accused her dad of abusing her because she didn't like the screen time allowance at his house.

The she admits it was a lie-what brought that about I wonder?

Then she doesn't like something that her mum says so she's straight off round to her dad for sympathy?

Blimey she needs help!

She sounds very like someone I know (not the same age) who has a BPD/EUPD diagnosis.

Regardless of whether she's under CAMHS or not (and it sounds like some kind of intervention would be an idea) she's going to need a very unified approach from all of the adults involved here. Very firm and consistent boundaries which are the same in both homes. Consequences, which are the same in both homes.

I'd also recommend that she not be left alone in a private place with your husband, for his own safety. She knows she has all the power here.

Hi . So please do make sure he messages her. She is very troubled. I have been in a similar situation myself. I wouldn't be surprised if she is doing the male clothes for attention. As when I was doing similar I would say anything to get attention . I'm now a lot older and wiser. My family and myself r now very close. But it took me being honest which is hard . Once you start the lies they spiral out of control. What I would do personally is be there for her no matter what , let her no she is loved, try and get her counseling, also if she adiment she wants male clothes and short hair let her it is things that can be changed easy. If this is the case the novelties wear off. I was lucky I have the most amazing parents in the world. This helped my recovery. She is very troubled

@Destroyedpeople I don't think you've understood the situation or you wouldn't be making comments like that.

Pre baby I was a family solicitor in high conflict cases Scotland. I often was appointed by the court to represent the child.

In my view when a child behaves like this it is a reaction to the parents toxic relationship. Amazing what seeing them together can fix. Some do it by making up allegations, others refusing contact, others playing parents against each other with false stories and versions of what mum or dad said.

Remove the parental conflict and help the child.

I'm another one who wonders about the abuse situation.

Did she tell her mum at the time?

If not, what did her mum think was going on?

Your husband never mentioned it to her mum?

Her mum did know a year ago, but did nothing about it?

She knew for a year until her daughter confessed to making it up and just sat on it?

She didn't contact the police or social services?

If this is true then lots of adults seem to be failing this child.

Definitely starting to play parents off. Both her DF and dm need to put on a united front, not criticise each other in presence of dd and check out stories with each other before believing everything dd says. She sounds like she’s getting to the age where she is more aware of the power she might hold in this respect, and will test the waters.

BPD is something I have wondered about.

There's also a type of autism called PDA and to me it's like reading about dsd. Dh agreed and passed the information link to dsds mum but she disagreed that she shows signs of this.

You know what, I think I would be minded to call the safeguarding team at the local authority and ask for help. If she’s truly this troubled and her mum and your DH are clueless/unable/uncertain/unwilling to help her in a way that is beneficial for DSD then professional support is needed, for the whole family.

@userxx....

What comments? Asking why OP chose the phrase 'scared off? It wasn't nasty it was genuine. Choice of phrase is interesting on a sub conscious level and often telling.
And I do remember the other thread quite well so have as much 'understanding' as the next person. Which is limited as OP might not be a 'reliable narrator'.

Sounds to me like she's easily influenced by what she sees either online or in the news. Every issue she's suggested (your dh abusing her, the trans suggestion) is a high profile one that will get a massive reaction. It seems she's looking for attention if you ask me

She's too young to have BPD - her personality is still forming. But she's showing really troubling behaviours and you need to tread with extreme caution around the trans issue. That can lead down a path it's difficult to scramble back from. I would be investigating the possibility of abuse and autism sharpish.

What a prince among men.

That wasn't necessary.

Sorry op you posted while I was typing.

So a child who appears to be struggling emotionally accuses a parent of abuse and no adult in her life takes it seriously. They just dismiss it for a whole year. I don't really understand that. Isn't it possible that a child acting this way may actually have been abused some how?

I understand why your and your husband might have wanted to keep it quiet, but why would her mum?

One thing I should have mentioned in my OP - it's dhs birthday next week. Dsd turned up with a card she'd made, which looked like it had been made in haste - a piece of folded paper with happy birthday scrawled on the front in biro. She also had a box of "presents" for him which were things from her bedroom - a small cuddly toy, a pink floral make up bag, a library book, and £1.40 in change. She also had her lovey toy with her, that she's had since babyhood.

The gifts suggest me that she was worried that after the way she has behaved, that she was worried Dh wouldn't want her here so it was a sweetener.

The lovey was because she was feeling so insecure?

I wonder if she is on the autistic spectrum too. It can be really typical for autistic girls to struggle with identity and conforming to gender stereotypes

11 is way too old to be being forced into dresses by your mum! Poor girl, if that had happened to me at that age, I'd be screaming that I was a boy, too. I'm guessing she just wants to have control over her clothes and hair, regardless of her gender identity.

She does sound like she needs more help than either of her parents seem willing to get her.

The gender issues I am not so sure of. I saw her 1 week out of every month for 6 years and my impressions were that she was never a girly girl. She always hated skirts and dresses. She hated pink. She had no interest in makeup and hair and I used to have to bribe her with sweets to let me braid her hair, as she would happily leave it unbrushed for days

Why the leap to “gender issues”? Maybe as she enters puberty she’s simply conscious of the focus on her looks, and her mum always wanting her to be “pretty” and feminine.

Plus her mum having such control over her clothes and hair isn’t healthy. She’s nearly 12, if she wants to wear jeans and a hoody, and keep her hair short, her choice. She doesn’t need to change gender to do so.

@Mumoblue I agree I think she is just lashing out in general.

I think some people here didn’t read to the end of the previous thread, where the OP’s DH said he wasn’t sure that he loved his daughter any more because ‘she wasn’t the little girl he thought she was’. I imagine that’s where the harsh responses on this thread are coming from.

I agree that the DD was failed by all the adults in her life. You cannot just ignore accusations of abuse, even if you’re 100% sure that they’re false: the correct thing to do is to involve Social Services, so that once it becomes clear no abuse has taken place, help such as counselling can be offered to the (obviously very troubled) DD and the family at large. You’ve all put DD in a unsafe position, because if she is ever abused or hurt in the future, she will know that none of the adults in her life will do a single thing about it, so she likely won’t bother telling you. Additionally, the ‘shock’ of seeing proper authorities involved might well have shown her that there are consequences to lying, but now she has just picked up where she left off.

As for the clothing comments - not sure why it necessarily has to be a gender expression thing. She could literally just mean “My DM wants me to wear fancy dresses but I’m not comfortable in them, I want to wear trousers, I like it better here because I can wear what I want” etc.

Cross post with @bluebluezoo re the last paragraph.

It's just complete attention seeking behaviour. I would take everything she says with a large pinch of salt op. She's not 'having a crisis'. I think just stay consistent, gently support but don't go getting dragged into the drama.