Friend and children still in complete lockdown

[madbirdlady22]

I am getting quite worried about a friend of mine, and wondered if there is something I can or should be doing do to help her.

Since mid March she has been in lockdown with her dh and children, and along the same lines as everyone else stayed in. Back then she would not even take the children for a walk, they stayed at home 247 with shopping delivered. I asked her why not go for a walk, but she said there was no need as they have a garden.

Now we are in mid July, and the children have still not been out. They decided against going back to school in June, and they have not been out anywhere at all since March. I am feeling quite worried now, not just for her, but for the children as well (they are ages 7 and 4) she has not seen any friends or been out of the house at all since the lockdown began.

I suggested the park, she said it was too busy, I mentioned going to the gardens nearby for a picnic with her dc, and she said they couldn't get a ticket, but I know it is possible to get tickets easily. She lives an hour and a half away, so I can't just pop in and check on her, and I feel I should respect her wishes.

She is now saying she doesn't think the children will go back to school in September after all. I am getting very worried about her.

I think/thought her MH is fine, her dh has PTSD at the moment. I am feeling concerned, she has no family nearby and no other support from what I can gather.

They spend all day every day in the house or in the garden.
They are not shielding, are not vulnerable at all and they are all perfectly healthy.

Should I say something? Are other people also doing this? Should I just leave them to it? She has been a friend for 35 years plus and we grew up together.

@Hearhoovesthinkzebras i’m Really sorry for your situation Why come on Mumsnet though if it makes you even more sad?

@AnneOfQueenSables

There's a difference between being aggressive and judgey, and being concerned. It's fairly easy to spot.

I completely agree with this. This thread has been quite aggressive and tending to the extreme. Which in a way is not surprising as the OP started not by concern. Concern would mean

• wanting to be more of a friend and understand. Reach out to her friend.

But all over this thread is a bit of a witch-hunt to be honest!

[quote Alex50]@Hearhoovesthinkzebras i’m Really sorry for your situation Why come on Mumsnet though if it makes you even more sad?[/quote]
Because it is boring and isolated being stuck at home and it's a distraction from being in constant pain but then it just ends up with people thinking it's ok to criticise and gang up. Constantly tagging me and asking questions which, when I reply, results in "ok another me rail".

So yeah, I don't enjoy life much because there's not much enjoyment to be had. But no doubt some of you will just use this to have another go about how I should be driving out to some remote spot (with no toilet) or walk the streets looking at weeds.

As you don't have young children, I don't think any of what you consider to be a 'go' has actually applied to you.

The main topic has been whether children should have left the house between now and March.

Then I come on here to face constant criticism

Perhaps it would feel less like constant criticism if you considered that not every thread is about you?

This thread, for example, is about a family with small children and nobody shielding. But you, who are shielding and have no small children, came in here getting all indignant that people were ‘judging’ you. You also were angry that posters were not fully appreciating the limitations shielded people have had to live with, while at the same time being angry at the same posters for suggesting that voluntarily imposing those limitations on small children would be a bit shit for those children.

You now seem to be convinced people are telling you to go out for walks and look at weeds and birds, which you don’t want to do. You seem to have entirely kissed that people are talking about walks for small children, not you.

Not everything is about you. Not everything needs to be taken as a personal attack.

@Hearhoovesthinkzebras why not do an online course, the OU have a quite a few free courses. I love mumsnet to gage opinion but it can be quite negative. Why not try and do something positive with your time.

Well, I am off out with my children. We hav

I don't think it's right to be suggesting a MNetter is difficulty has to leave the site.

It's really not easy being shielded.

And I still,think the simplest explanation for the friend's action is that someone in her household is shielding, but they've chosen to keep their medical info private.

Some people do this; they want a period when they're friends don't treat them differently (until it becomes inevitable that people must be told)

I don't think anyone has said it's easy being shielded though? I think anyone with an ounce of empathy could understand how tough it must be.

However, it's not top trumps about who has it hardest. And OP was very clear on this thread that the family isn't shielding and doesn't have a medical reason to cut themselves off. So all the stuff about shielding is completely irrelevant to this thread.

@Coronabegone

The thing is that *@Hearhoovesthinkzebras* comes on a lot of these threads, whilst she doesn't want to go out, she's also constantly criticising others for going out. No one else apparently is able to social distance and she has to walk in the road. Surprising as she hadn't been out that she's so aware.

The story does change a lot and the most recent is that she doesn't ever want to step outside her door as it's an awful area, previously it was that she couldn't even go out early morning as she lives near a station and the entire at it was too busy. As I've said before, she maintained she couldn't drive, now it's too far a drive 30-40 minutes (that's a lot of ground to cover early morning at the weekend) to find anywhere worth walking.

Fine, if she doesn't want to go out, but to criticise others and the amount of times she's predicted a spike because of VE Day, IKEA, beaches etc which people are allowed to go to is ridiculous.

Many times people have suggested she stay off these threads, but she is insistent that her thoughts and needs are above everyone else's.

Remember some people will gladly opt out of normal life and this has given them the option to do that. It's not healthy and will lead to more issues in the longer term. Especially those with young children.

My story isn't changing at all. I live in a very built up area. Yes, there's a station and houses and roads. Why is that implausible? I honestly don't get it. There's no inconsistency. I have been out for walks since I've been allowed to. Each time has been really busy and yes, I have had to cross the road, back and forth or walk in the road. You are completely misrepresenting threads that I've posted on. Just because I keep my user name rather than constantly changing it and hiding behind new names it gives you all the chance to do this.

I can't just drive out to the middle of nowhere to go for a walk. I have Crohn's, I need to know there's a toilet fairly close. You obviously don't understand but that doesn't give you the right to just keep having a go. It really is just bullying.

@GoldenOmber

Then I come on here to face constant criticism

Perhaps it would feel less like constant criticism if you considered that not every thread is about you?

This thread, for example, is about a family with small children and nobody shielding. But you, who are shielding and have no small children, came in here getting all indignant that people were ‘judging’ you. You also were angry that posters were not fully appreciating the limitations shielded people have had to live with, while at the same time being angry at the same posters for suggesting that voluntarily imposing those limitations on small children would be a bit shit for those children.

You now seem to be convinced people are telling you to go out for walks and look at weeds and birds, which you don’t want to do. You seem to have entirely kissed that people are talking about walks for small children, not you.

Not everything is about you. Not everything needs to be taken as a personal attack.

The poster talking about looking at weeds and wrecked cars was directly responding to me, so yes, they were telling me to do it.

This thread wasn't solely about people with young children it was also about why people more widely aren't going out yet and how the op should go and ambush her friend forcing her to go out.

No matter who is reluctant to go out, or why they are, I think that is wrong. We all have the right to live how we want to and to not see friends if we don't want to. I don't think it's right to force people to do what you think is best for them. We all have agency to make our own choices.

Buggeration, auto-post.

Children need exercising, and we also need supplies as I can't get deliveries. I will be wearing my homemade mask to the shops as usual!

The poster talking about looking at weeds and wrecked cars was directly responding to me, so yes, they were telling me to do it.

Nuh-uh.

There were no imperatives, no instructions to you.

Someone (it may have been you) asked what the benefits of walking round the streets were for children and I provided them.

You shot back to my post about things for children to see by insisting there could be nothing like that near you, with the implication that anyone with children near you would find nothing.

I replied to that, and I clearly followed this up by confirming that of course it was of no interest to you, because it was directed at people with young children.

I know I’m as guilty as anyone for engaging, but once again the thread has been hijacked.

What is galling for me is I am shielding too, have stated it numerous times as have others, but oh, no. HearHooves has it all so much worse. She has absolutely no clue what others’ lives are like.

I Know a few (perfectly healthy) Lockdown Champions who are not going out till there’s a vaccine [sceptical] . They are horribly irritating in that they are happy to have heat/power/water/food deliveries in spite of baying that we should all remain at home. However, they do not have children. Raising fearful children who are taught that outside is dangerous is dangerous itself.

I think my definition of a tiny village and @maxdash definition differs greatly, and that is not a criticism by the way, I assume it is just down to perception.

I live in a small rural town which has a couple of supermarkets and a few other shops, and a couple of schools.

There are numerous villages surrounding us, some quite large with a pub or two, a shop and a church, but there are also some much smaller villages which is what I would call tiny where there are a spattering of houses, no streets and possibly a church .

I still think if you have young children and are not in a shielding family, then you should be trying to go out of the house at least once in a while. The family the OP is concerned about has a 4 year old. If they haven't been out of the house since before lockdown and are not planning to go out before school in September, that is 6 months which is a hell of a long time in a 4 year old's life.

Pre COVID a child of that age not being out of the house for such a long time would be a safeguarding concern, and even with COVID now restrictions have been eased, there really is very little excuse. You don't have to meet up with people or go to busy places, but just go out to let the 4 year old know that the world still exists outside their front door.

Here look, this is earlier in the conversation.

Me: "I still point out the flowers, the birds and intereting features. It's part of parenting and teaching my children not to wander through life totally ignorant of common British wildlife. "

Hooves: 'That's great.

'We have sparrows and pigeons here and the only flowers in our street are some artificial hanging baskets a neighbour has - that is deadly serious. All the gardens are concreted over.'

As Hooves has adult children, I manifestly cannot be telling her to go and teach her children what a dandelion looks like.

Which in a way is not surprising as the OP started not by concern
Exactly and is now posting about how the schools should have went back earlier. An opinion shared by less than 1% of parents with school-age children but, for some reason, is being vocally and aggressively pushed on MN by certain posters.
None of this is about concern ... for friends, for DCs, for other MNers.
It's also counter-productive for those trying to push an agenda. Bullying posters may mean they leave or are quiet but it doesn't change minds. As one of the medical experts said, you can't bully people into going out or shopping. The only proven ways to encourage the population is to have effective track and trace, accurate reporting of figures and a robust respite to changing infection rates.
But it seems much easier for certain sections to shout at people than create sustainable, effective, reasonable processes or to direct that 'passion' at the people who can make a difference ie MPs.

None of this is about concern ... for friends, for DCs, for other MNers.

Yes. It is. I have been seriously genuinely very worried for the children in the family I know who were doing this. (They are now taking the children outside a bit and all seem much happier for it.) I can absolutely see why the OP might be a bit concerned at a friend who's entirely isolating herself and her family while drinking more and dealing with a child who's physically lashing out.

OTOH you said earlier that anyone who thinks this is concerning is only doing so because they see it as an attack on Boris, so I'm guessing you won't believe me.

And I still,think the simplest explanation for the friend's action is that someone in her household is shielding, but they've chosen to keep their medical info private.

I think this is quite possible too. It always makes me laugh when people state that they know someone isn't at high risk as they wouldn't necessarily know . The great majority of people don't know about my medical condition including many my friends. I just don't want to discuss it. It doesn't make me at particularly high risk but even if it made me very high risk I still wouldn't want to discuss it.

That isn't what I said Golden. I said this thread was attracting a certain type of poster:
the posters who are supporting the government on other threads are coming to this one too
I didn't say they were the only posters on the thread.

Well this thread has taken a ridiculously 'mean girls' turn. Some posters seriously need to back the fuck off and have a word with themselves.

Never have I seen anywhere like MN for seeing a poster who is quite clearly struggling and others see it as an opportunity to stick the boot in. Fucking awful.

Today I got the train (quiet, everyone wearing masks proudly and no-one within four metres of me) to a city where I met a friend and we walked to the large city park for a socially distanced picnic. There were lots of young families doing the same. I loved watching the children playing, clambering over the trees, riding their scooters, having fun and just having a normal life.

I thought of this thread and felt so sad for those children confined to their own house and garden for four months and more while other children are out having fun in the outside world.

Yes, she is clearly in a bad place, but as any regular poster will attest, she is posting hundreds of times on multiple threads and just turns the subject to herself and this hijacks the conversation. People - especially new posters who are not familiar with her - try to offer kindly advice or a different viewpoint and she gets angry and accuses them of bullying, at which point posters get a bit fed up. It’s difficult not to rise to the bait, especially when you have seen all the other 50 million threads!

@IrmaFayLear

Yes, she is clearly in a bad place, but as any regular poster will attest, she is posting hundreds of times on multiple threads and just turns the subject to herself and this hijacks the conversation. People - especially new posters who are not familiar with her - try to offer kindly advice or a different viewpoint and she gets angry and accuses them of bullying, at which point posters get a bit fed up. It’s difficult not to rise to the bait, especially when you have seen all the other 50 million threads!

No excuses. I'm a regular poster, I've been here 15 years with various user names and I have seen her on many threads. It's never made me want to be a dick to her. You can try and convince yourself all you like.