To ask how much of your income you spend on school fees? And pls tell me its worth it...

[Claliscool]

Not rich by any means.
Decided to send both children to independent school in September due to all sorts of covid and other reasons. The fees are about one third of our household income. Just bricking it slightly.

I went to private school × 2.
Both my kids went to local State school, university, and professional careers.
'Nuff said !

Who do you think lives in those?

Rich men like to keep someone on the side...

Yes, sometimes they will rent as well as own something, while filming etc, that's obviously not what I meant.

We've move our child from private to state. It was absolutely not worth it in my opinion and actually has exposed a lot of weaknesses in the teaching when compared against the KS critetia. We often got the feeling thay parents' evening was a big marketing push rather than a realistic assessment. Everything was great and everyone was fabulous. The primary we are now sending our child to has been inundated with parents trying to swtich and they have been highlighting the discrepancies in perceived levels of attainment and actual ability. They've had to do a lot of remedial work to catch up.

We are actually getting far more from the state primary than we got in the independent sector. When I look back I get quite cross at how much we spent on not much more than a posh uniform and some lovely grounds. They spent more time in the lovely drama and sports facilities than in thr classroom actually learning the foundations. I used to wonder why they did so much preparation for the school play, rehearsal schedules were intense. Now I know it was part of the marketing machine.

In terms of academic attainment, all the other kids in the family went state and got steller results on their exams. Plus my friends daughter also went to Oxbridge having gone state so I'm even less convinced on the 'buying results' argument. Its down to individual ability and you won't necessarily get that extra push in private. If they need a tutor we will get one and in the meantime will save our money and buy them a house when they are old enough. That will get them a lot further in life. Once they are at uni the school they went to matters very little.

In your shoes OP I think its going to be a millstone around your next on the margins you are talking about. It's not worth the stress you will be putting yourself under.

Ds went to a normal school his best friend went to private school. They both got the same a level results more or less. My ds was one grade higher in one a level. Both now at university.
I’m not sure if there is something secret which is going to give him an advantage over my ds. I’m pleased they are still friends.

I'm sure you've thought about this but what about getting a tutor instead of it's only covid related? Are you concerned by impact of covid on education or is it that the school itself is rubbish regardless of covid?

My child is in a class of 13 with only one year group per year, With two teachers to a class. They have outstanding facilities, and amazing pastoral care. The school leavers destinations are impressive too. Most importantly- she is happy and is thriving.

To me it depends on the child. DS1 went to state grammar and did well but they didn't really chase him as he was very bright but lazy. He pulled it out of the bag in the end, with me on his back for the last two years and has done well at GCSE and is on track for good A levels. DS2 similar. But DS3 I moved from state to independent at year 5. He is a more quirky character and had terrible behaviour going on in his class that was disrupting his learning and the ability of the teacher to teach. He is quiet and therefore the teacher didn't give him the attention he needed in a big and disrupted class. While we have a good state secondary near here I still think I will keep him in private for secondary. He thrives with the small class environment and because he has some slight learning issues which mean he completes work slowly even though he is able, he would, in the state sector I think, be setted with students at the lower ability end who are likely to disrupt learning. It's a big sacrifice / I have saved the money so it's there, but in real terms it is about a third of my annual salary.

My child was in a class of less than 6 with two teachers. My son was happy sort of (although small class size was actually a major draw back) and the grounds were amazing. If we hadn't moved house I would never have known about the gaps in the teaching they were delivering. Because destinations are amazing doesn't necessarily mean they will be year on year or that the children wouldn't have got their by their own accord.

I sound very negative and if its working for others that's great. But now I've had a chance to stand back and look critically I'm not so sold on all the padding and marketing spin anymore.

I have got zero sympathy for anyone who gets into financial difficulty due to sending their children to private school.

It really is horses for courses.

Both mine went to a reasonable local comp, got excellent academic results, did music lessons etc, lots of extra curricular, sport available (though both focused on sports outside school). Neither had tutors.

We’ve always taken the view that much of education isn’t actually what’s learnt at school. The money we’ve saved has gone towards books, holidays focused on nature, art, history and so on, funding one DS’s (expensive) sport to international level, helping both at university, funding the other DS’s Master’s year and so on.

One DS spent the gap year between Masters and (funded) Doctorate tutoring and cover supervising/teaching at a very tough comp. Most of his tutees were at private schools with a few at grammars. As a young cover supervisor he tended to end with the less productive classes, let’s say, but also saw that there were bright, hard working kids who did go on to get decent results and go to Oxbridge/Russell Group etc universities. These tended to be the ones with the supportive parents, unsurprisingly.

Obviously, there aren’t overall conclusions to be drawn from this, just that it’s not black and white. Some children will need the extra support they might (but don’t necessarily always) get at private schools. Many won’t need that extra support and can get the extra curriculars from state schools or elsewhere.

For us, the difference was paying for secondary education and not being able to support DD through university, or sending her to state school and being able to top up her maintenance loan.

We chose the second option, and with hindisght, apart from the lack of self confidence, I think we made the right decision.

We have an outstanding, in every way - not just ofsted, primary school in our village, so going private for primary school was never considered. The school offered a very rounded education with loads of extra curricular activities, and has an award winning orchestra that has played in the Albert Hall.

I must admit that I am at the costs of private education, and the kind of money posters must earn to be able to afford to send 5 children to private school without having to make any sacrifices.

Crazy to do this due to COVID - couid have kept them in state school and got some good tutoring instead - might be worth it if your kids want to learn and excel - but they might not be academic etc my brother went to private school - he is now a builder.

96k! Woke up this morning mortified by my expensive rental income horror. And yes, people on high incomes rent or they wouldn’t be advertising these places.

Am finding this thread more and more amusing as now apparently sending your children to private school is an act of socialism in keeping good school places free for the less privileged. I’m in awe of the nobility of it all!

On average the academic private primaries work about 1 - 2 years ahead of state primaries although it sounds like upstart pretty much found the opposite so do choose carefully. Look at destinations of leavers - the schools they go to at 11 or 13 as a good indicator. If you have a lot getting into very academic private schools that tends to mean the primary level prep school is academically good and of course some private school children are not bright and they go to different kinds of private schools for those who find academic work more challenging. Most parents know in areas with a selection of private primaries which are hard to get into academically and which are not.

Confidence depends on the person. I knew I was pretty clever (not least because I got the best A level results in the private school) but I was shy despite private school, even from age 5 I was shy, i can give public talks to people all round the world and have but I still prefer to be alone. I don't think private school can change innate personality.

I said up thread that we spend about 30% pre tax income on private schooling. But i realised (after shrieks of horror about spoending that much) that we don't have anything else we really spend money on. We are very lucky that we are mortgage free. When DFIL died we could pay off our mortgage. We have a Victorian mid-terrace down south worth about "230k. We have modest cars etc and we have very modest holidays (all inclusive and things like that). But I feel very well off in that I really value being able to pay for the school the Dcs attend without having to juggle and sacrifice. We do not value edpensive cars por expensive holidays and so we choose to pay for education.

Also.... we are in a fairly rural area. There is one decent primary school here and it is massively oversubscibed. At one pojnt, when our eldest was about to enter school we made an active decision. We knew we could afford private and we knew it would free up a space for a fmaily who could not. So we chose private. I actually think it was quite a morallly responsible decision- although when i said this once to a friend of mine (who does not have children) she disembowlled me for my privilege. But actually we did consider that as an argument.

At the moment, we can afford it and we choose to spend our disposable income on it. I genuinely care little if the Dcs 'make anything' of it. My eldest has ASD and Tourettes and is a very anxious little chap. His school has been amazing for him. If he ends up just relatively happy with friends and a job he enjoys that is all i want for him. Same goes for the youngest.

@Extracurricularfatigue the problem is that the uk school system is deeply screwed. the difference between schools in one sector is much, much bigger than the one between state and private. Spending £200k extra on a house next to the only decent non-faith primary and then saying you would never send your child to a private school is as much (if not more) rigging the system in your favour as sending kids to an independent school, and dishonest on top.

Oh- and as for other parents. There are other parents who are richer than us. to date neither of my Dcs seem to care about what their friends have, and tbh neither do I. I feel so lucky in my life. Lovely husband and family. Lovely house that is big enough for us and little trips away (we do a weekend at a holiday camp every year plus mroe recently we went to Greece for a week). I have a friend who lives on the Isle of Wight who goes away alot and we go and stay at hers for a weekend in the summer and house sit. I occasionally think it would be nice to have mroe but we have enough to do what we want. One of our friends lives in a serious manor house with 100 acres. I have house envy, but they are the minority and they never shove it in your face.

On average the academic private primaries work about 1 - 2 years ahead of state primaries although it sounds like upstart pretty much found the opposite so do choose carefully. Look at destinations of leavers - the schools they go to at 11 or 13 as a good indicator

Agree. This is where we ballsed up the first time. Our friends recommended the first school to us and I didn’t do my due diligence. Two years of money down the pan ( although she had a great time in the school woods having class bonfires ect.. Our new school is a world away academically than the first one.

100% agree newday.

Also I would steer away from schools that go from 4-18. Ours felt like the junior school was a bolt on to the more lucrative senior school, which may explain why there wasn't the same care in teaching in the core curriculum. An independent junior school might be better and more focused.

[quote Newdaynewname1]@Extracurricularfatigue the problem is that the uk school system is deeply screwed. the difference between schools in one sector is much, much bigger than the one between state and private. Spending £200k extra on a house next to the only decent non-faith primary and then saying you would never send your child to a private school is as much (if not more) rigging the system in your favour as sending kids to an independent school, and dishonest on top.[/quote]
They are both very privileged actions, sure. But I do find it very funny to see the action of sending your child to private school, with the enormous social privilege it often carries (as exemplified by so many of the posts on here) justified as some sort of social act. I’ve seen the transforming effect that articulate confident parents with high expectations can have on a low performing state school - a far more altruistic act if you’re looking for the best way to contribute.

Anyway, as ever on Mumsnet and private school threads, we are operating in a bubble of ‘sacrifices’ that look like the sort of privileges many people in the country would kill for. If I could wish just one thing, it would be for the users and students of private schools to have an iota of understanding of what the world out there is like for most people. I’ve met so many over the years who think that they are ‘normal’ and given the positions of power they were in that has real consequences for public policy in the UK. I speak as someone who has plenty of money (in the wider sense, not school fees sense) but appreciates just how little many people have.

I don't plan on sending my children to private schools. We are so lucky our local school is one of the best in the country and our local school is the feeder.

But different for pre school (get a 50% discount - it's not what you know it's who kind of thing) so per week it's £60 instead of £120. That for three full days only. I have seen the difference it makes though to little ones. Especially when the limit is 12 children, the attention they get is second to none

Yes, but with a caveat. My daughters went to Haberdashers and North London Collegiate (one at each) and at 11+ it is like a new school with loads of competition from children from state primaries sitting the exams, no guarantee you will pass to the seniors, different school buildings etc so it did not have the same issues and everyone in the juniors had to pass the exam for the seniors. In fact they thought one of our daughters would fail so we sat her for about 4 or 5 other schools at 11+ just in case although she did then pass so it was fine and she did very well - much better at secondary stage than primary.

We spend 0%

In reality I'm not sure you can find someone who pays £2000 a month for something that will tell you it's a waste of money, so much so that they'll actually pay it every month for decades.

If I'm going to work full time and give every penny of that to a school (as is common I think, one parents salary is for living, the other for school) I'm going to think it's definitely worth it.

So will you pay the money and buy into the idea it's worth it? Well absolutely because the schools have every interest in you believing that and you're in a school filled with other parents that believe it.

Important to this is the myth of state schools being horrendous places, when many of them can out Hogwarts Hogwarts just without having kids sleep there. My secondary school had it's nice drama studio, recording studio, ski trips, 6th form in an old mansion, tennis courts and grounds. It was free! Yes the class sizes were big but if anyone thinks the teacher were too busy on the struggling, disruptive kids you would be very deluded. If they couldn't keep up then they couldn't keep up, if they were disruptive they were sent out of class or excluded.

My only criticism was that perhaps the teachers could have been better but I have friends who work in private schools and I'm sure they're good at their jobs but they went private after being turned down by the state schools. Getting a teaching job at a very good state school is very difficult.

My friend was privately educated and chooses not to work, so it depends really on your motivations. Is it for an education or a lifestyle?

My DD went to a boarding prep as a day pupil and no, not every child was working ahead of the national curriculum. There are Oxbridge bound dc in state primaries and they are extended by the teachers. Of course some dc in primary schools are years ahead! Reading and maths are obvious areas of excellence.

A decent prep will have dirvueliwt teachers. Specialist resources. It will take music, sport and drama seriously and will get dc with scholarships to decent senior schools. Their list of destination schools should be impressive but also will have dc going to more modest schools. If loads just go to the local comp, save your money! Preps prep for decent high calibre senior schools. If you are not aiming for that, why pay if you cannot afford it? You’ll end up at the same place.

Exam results are not everything. Social circle matters in some jobs. Some kind it makes not one jot of difference. Interests can be fostered at private schools. Just look what you can do at Harrow or Rugby! Way more then any state school. If you have money why wouldn’t you want that?