Making the wearing of a mask manditory

[weepingwillow22]

Has anyone else noticed the worldometer projections for UK deaths have changed significantly since the relaxation of restrictions last week?
covid19.healthdata.org/united-kingdom

The deaths are now predicted to be back up to 800 a day by november with a second peak in cases surpassing the first one.

The graphs do however show that this can be avoided if mask wearing is made compulsory.

AIBU to think that the wearing of a mask or visor (excepting those eho cannot wear them for medical conditions) should be made manditory in all indoor public places in order to avoid this second peak.

If cases rise again to the extent projected here another national lockdown will be required resulting in more job losses, school closures and unnecessary deaths.

Surely the wearing of a mask is a small price to pay to avoid a second peak particularly as the scientific evidence now points to it being highly effective in preventing asymptomatic spread.
www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/417906/still-confused-about-masks-heres-science-behind-how-face-masks-prevent

OoPs meant to delete the first link to sleeping, sorry about that.

I smiled yesterday when Michael Gove, the rudest man in politics, talked about wearing a mask indoors as good manners.

Though I think in shops it should be compulsory.

*sleepingpup I suggest you read the whole thread again. No the words fuck off weren’t used but they might as well be.
*
You're hilarious.

You were endlessly rude, dismissive and domineering
AND you misquoted me as I didn't say anything even like fuck off - or off anything other than i disagreed with you.

You are a joke.

And like I say it's all here in black and white.

*But then I don’t believe everything I read in the news and go searching for the original sources.
*
🏅

👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

Excellent .

Did I say you told me to fuck off? No I said some. Ie when yellow told me to go away because of my mh. I took that to mean fuck off and countless other insinuations like this.

Dismissive? Because I engage, post links, give highlights of some of the other links?

Domineering - I’m engaging with people who are asking me direct questions and of course with other posters.

Now can we please get back on topic? If you find this rude oh well I am sure you will get over it.

Why bother to engage with me if I am such a joke? You alone aren’t going to sway me either way and I will continue to read more.

I think I’m about half way down the list a pp posted. Some interesting reading and some funny as fuck. Thanks I forgot your name.

Dismissive? Because I engage, post links, give highlights of some of the other links?

You don't listen. You are always correct. You do not 'engage' . Look at this thread you have written half of it.

You are rude when others don't agree.

And just for the record you are very unclear.

But crack on and have a nice life.

@Worldgonecrazy

WHO guidelines list the potential risks of masks. The potential for harmful micro organisms is mentioned.

• potential increased risk of self-contamination due to the manipulation of a face mask and subsequently touching eyes with contaminated hands;(48, 49)

• potential self-contamination that can occur if non- medical masks are not changed when wet or soiled. This can create favourable conditions for microorganism to amplify; • potential headache and/or breathing difficulties, depending on type of mask used; • potential development of facial skin lesions, irritant dermatitis or worsening acne, when used frequently for long hours;(50) • difficulty with communicating clearly; • potential discomfort;(41, 51) • a false sense of security, leading to potentially lower adherence to other critical preventive measures such as physical distancing • waste management issues; improper mask disposal leading to increased litter in public places, risk of contamination to street cleaners and environment hazard; • difficulty communicating for deaf persons who rely on lip reading; • disadvantages for or difficulty wearing them, especially for children, developmentally challenged persons, those with mental illness, elderly persons with cognitive impairment, those with asthma or chronic respiratory or breathing problems, those who have had facial trauma or recent oral maxillofacial surgery, and those living in hot and humid environments.

Thanks for posting this, it’s an interesting read. And super reassuring for me as a mask wearer that out of 10 points, 5 of them refer to “problems” that aren’t actually illness related - like increased litter, potential discomfort and not hearing people clearly. All of which aren’t ideal, but are better than an infectious disease.

Out of the health related points, the first two can be easily eliminated by people knowing how to safely wear and remove masks. You learn not to fiddle with them pretty quickly, and to change them when they feel damp. It’s something you can easily control to keep the risk low.

Skin lesions are unlikely with surgical masks and cotton masks (unless you have a skin condition, then see the final point); would be worse with N95 type masks which most people aren’t wearing unless needed for work.

Points 3 and 10 are the most important and people who have those conditions should obviously avoid wearing a mask.

As for the rest? I can’t see anything that, as a healthy person, would put me off wearing a mask. I’m sensible enough to maintain distance when I’m wearing a mask, I’m sensible enough to change it frequently and not self contaminate by pawing at my eyeballs

And unfortunately, their will be downsides to most “helpful” things, as you’ll know if you’ve ever read the leaflet that comes with paracetamol, penicillin and every other medicine. I’ve worn a mask when I’ve needed to for enough years - even when heavily pregnant in a 40 degree summer - and can’t think of any negatives.

@TaxTheRatFarms

Do you live somewhere where masks are worn regularly?

sleepingpup

Not currently but I lived in Japan for about a quarter of my life and it was just common sense there. And no feeling of “control” or “muzzles” anywhere And if anyone had talked about masks causing microorganisms which rot your lungs they would have thought you’d gone mad! I had some friends and family who wore them all day at work (office/retail/restaurants/schools) as a choice, and this is years before coronavirus. Even my kids are super relaxed about wearing masks because they’ve seen other people doing it.

It’s (apparently!) a more community based society rather than individualistic, so it’s natural for people to do things that work for the good of the greater community whereas countries like the UK can be more individualistic and think more about what’s best for themselves.

Not saying one way is better than the others, but at times like this the difference really shows!

Having said that, where I live now in the UK there are generally more people wearing masks than not, and a surprising number of young men which is great.

I don't mind wearing a mask. I don't drive so I have got used to wearing them on trains.
I do object to the lack of clear guidance and rules though. The news today said boris said we should wear masks in shops.
Should means nothing to a lot of people as already proven by various outcries regarding people's lockdown behaviour.
It's either must or nothing.
If it is must then it needs to carry sanctions if not applied and those who are exempt need to be able to easily evidence this so that they're not caught up in distressing and embarrassing public arguments.

It also worries me that during the spanish flu pandemic early last century, all we had for protection was facemasks, exactly the same as the ones we're using now
We have not improved our testing mechanism since the beginning of the year and so far don't have any real way of protecting people other than complete shielding and wearing the same protection we used 100 years ago .

@canigooutyet I would be looking at how the sudden influx of people also buying masks, filters and kitchen roll is having on the economy. Who started this rumour to begin with.

This, along with the “toxic spores” and the “dangerous chemicals in cotton”, is another of your conspiracy theories on this thread.

Conspiracy theories are dangerous when they lead people to adopt unsafe behaviours. I don’t know what your political leanings are, but the right wing anti-mask brigade is spreading the same falsehoods as you are.

I have never tried to silence you, and I certainly didn’t tell you to fuck off. I did say that I was concerned about your mental health, and preferred not to engage if this was making you worse. This was based on your writing on this thread, where you seemed to be going in overdrive.

You have stated repeatedly that you are exempt and that you don’t intend to wear masks anyway.

And if anyone had talked about masks causing microorganisms which rot your lungs they would have thought you’d gone mad! I had some friends and family who wore them all day at work (office/retail/restaurants/schools) as a choice, and this is years before coronavirus.

I do question this point too as so many countries use them all day atm

Thank you @TaxTheRatFarms that’s really interesting and informative.

When you lived in Japan where the masks designed for this, a mix, home made etc?

Same with readers from other countries such as Japan who have a history of their use.

Is there any advice on the glasses issue others have mentioned and which types of material are the best to help this? Tips like that that could potentially be helpful to others.

@MarshaBradyo

And if anyone had talked about masks causing microorganisms which rot your lungs they would have thought you’d gone mad! I had some friends and family who wore them all day at work (office/retail/restaurants/schools) as a choice, and this is years before coronavirus.

I do question this point too as so many countries use them all day atm

Quite, especially as Japan and Hong Kong, where mask wearing is very wide spread, have among the highest life expectancy in the world.

They are bad for the skin though, particularly in the heat, but a few spots is a very small price to pay.

@canigooutyet

Thank you *@TaxTheRatFarms* that’s really interesting and informative.

When you lived in Japan where the masks designed for this, a mix, home made etc?

Same with readers from other countries such as Japan who have a history of their use.

Is there any advice on the glasses issue others have mentioned and which types of material are the best to help this? Tips like that that could potentially be helpful to others.

I can’t speak for Japan, but in Hong Kong many people use reusable cotton masks. These are not home made, they are sold in shops and online, and they have two layers of fabric with a pocket in between to insert a disposable filter. Filters are sold in packs (usually of 20).

There are other mask types, including neoprene ones, which don’t have a filter pocket.

Different people wear different types based on their preferences.

@Yellownotblue, what are the filters normally made from or do people buy them specifically made for the masks?

@famousforwrongreason,

the filters are a universal size, they work with all brands of cotton masks.

Here’s a link to the typical filter: www.hktvmall.com/hktv/en/main/COLOR-STYLE-INTERNATIONAL-DEVELOPMENT-LIMITED/s/H7628001/Personal-Care-%26-Health/Personal-Care-%26-Health/Medicine/Surgical-Masks/50PCS-PM25-Mask-Filter-Sheets-5-Layers-Anti-Bacteria-Anti-Virus/p/H7628001_S_M200011

It’s a PM 2.5 filter made up of 5 layers.

A pack of 50 filters costs around £6.

@Yellownotblue
Thank you for answering, and sorry to parrot Famous same question about filters and hope you don't mind.

The filter thing is very sketchy in the UK. Cannot remember where I read it advice from some has included kitchen paper, water filters, fish tank filters and those coffee machine papers.

I’m travelling to the U.K. soon, and bringing huge stocks of filters and masks to distribute to friends. May need to start an import business ☺️

[quote canigooutyet]@Yellownotblue
Thank you for answering, and sorry to parrot Famous same question about filters and hope you don't mind.

The filter thing is very sketchy in the UK. Cannot remember where I read it advice from some has included kitchen paper, water filters, fish tank filters and those coffee machine papers.[/quote]
I need to be clear though, that while cotton and other reusable masks are available, the vast majority of adults in Hong Kong use disposable surgical masks.

You also see some people with a disposable mask underneath a reusable one, and a face shield for good measure! Though that’s a bit unusual. Belt and braces and all that

Oh wow @Yellownotblue those are amazing. Before CV when I saw people wearing them I was always tempted to ask where they got them from. But it's hard to publicly ask if that makes sense sometimes. I've asked various medical people, I've walked into various shops etc for sometime!!

Although I am exempt it doesn't mean there aren't times I need to "suck it up" and those times I know it's doing its job effectively and I can rationalise wearing the ppe ones.

I couldn't rationalise folding up a bit of material on it's own because well medically they aren't advised. And of course, like others, I don't want to use proper ppe unless necessary, just like medical workers etc. Flu season etc are a pain in the arse when you have to avoid doing loads of things!!

Before anyone picks up on that. - no I am not saying this is the same as flu etc.

@Yellownotblue
You are being very clear to me. Wish you had come on before now tbh. Along with the handwashing, guidance about the frequency changing the material, the types of material, washing them, and now filters I and hopefully others can make an informed choice to not only protect others but also ourselves.

@canigooutyet

Glad I could be of assistance!