Is anyone else boycotting Tesco's for giving £80,000 to Mermaids?

[loveyouradvice]

Just that really... I was shocked, especially given all the news coverage there has been about the issues recently. I would have expected them to give it to an uncontroversial charity at the very least - and ideally one that most of their customers would like to support

So there are loads of transphobic comments, but you can't show any, as other posters would not consider the comments transphobic?

I’m not going to try to change anyone’s deluded, misguided mind

And here, everyone, is an example of why it's so hard to discuss different opinions on here. See, if you have a different opinion then you are deemed "misguided and deluded" because apparently there is only one "right opinion" 🙄

@G5000

So there are loads of transphobic comments, but you can't show any, as other posters would not consider the comments transphobic?

Wrong again.

@GreytExpectations

12boo that link is just a journalist article using emotive language and one person's experience to make a point. It does not mention any proven statistics nor does it explain where mermaids charity forced children to transition.

If children are being allowed to have untested and risky drugs to transition then that's completly the parents fault for not intervening and doing their own research first. You can't blame charities for bad parenting.

Yes it's just one person's story but there have been others in the press The stats are possibly hard to find due to the secrecy around the issue. But anyone who has looked at the "genderbread" teaching materials or seen the assessment criteria either has concerns about the application of regressive sex stereotypes and using inadequately trialed treatments on children or is operating under the delusion that it's possible to be born in the wrong body

Calling a trans woman on a thread a "Gloating manipulative male" is apparently not calling them a man

I thought for convos re gender and sex

man / woman = gender
male / female = sex

That’s what’s used outside of MN isn’t it?

Calling a trans woman on a thread a "Gloating manipulative male" is apparently not calling them a man, I said male! Try again!"

How is that not transphobic towards trans women though?

The Times, April 8 2018:

' Frontline clinicians who assessed the thousands of young people coming to the Gender Identity Development Service (GIDS) for help, said they felt families were 'systematically' demanding to be referred for life-changing hormone treatment on the advice of campaigners..

One former clinician claimed "Mermaids sell themselves as a support group. They are not. They are lobbyists. During sessions they would sit in the waiting room outside."

The GIDS's own internal review acknowledged the rise in the number of families "presenting with their minds apparently made up".

The same clinician said: "The reality is if you say the right trigger words, get Mermaids on your side, by 11 you'll be on hormone blockers and by 16 you'll be on hormones. That's not ethical." '

Sorry, April 2019.

@LemonadeAndDaisyChains

You've just missed the point entirely that it's pointless to post examples of transphobia because whenever I or others have done posters will just deny that it's transphobic,

Why are people still pretending they can't understand?
I've just had the point made SPECTACULARLY why it's absolutely pointless to point out comments on another thread when asked.
Calling a trans woman on a thread a "Gloating manipulative male" is apparently not calling them a man, I said male! Try again!"
It's just.... no words lol

There are plenty of gloating, manipulative, dangerous men who are riding the trans wagon. It’s not hateful to point that out - it’s the truth and it’s necessary to voice it in order to protect the best interests of women and children.

Not having seen the relevant thread I can’t be sure, but as I understanf one potential reason why the person might have said that in reply is that ‘misgendering’ (saying ‘man’ when the individual claims they are a woman) a person is apparently ‘hate’ so it’s become necessary to try to say ‘male’ instead which refers specifically to biology. It’s an awkward distinction and shouldn’t be necessary, but that’s the way it is right now.

But as I said that’s just off the top of my head.

Yes it's just one person's story but there have been others in the press
The stats are possibly hard to find due to the secrecy around the issue. But anyone who has looked at the "genderbread" teaching materials or seen the assessment criteria either has concerns about the application of regressive sex stereotypes and using inadequately trialed treatments on children or is operating under the delusion that it's possible to be born in the wrong body

So no actual proof of children being forced to transition then, it's all heresay? Sounds more like parents allowing children to make decisions they are clearly not mature enough to understand the long term effects and the children growing up to regret them. Weird how nobody blames the parents in this kind of situation.

Sigh. *As I understand it

Weird how nobody blames the parents in this kind of situation.

Weird how you missed all the discussion about a specific court case where a mother with mental health issues was certainly blamed. But she was also supported by Mermaids.

@HandsOffMyRights

The Times, April 8 2018:

' Frontline clinicians who assessed the thousands of young people coming to the Gender Identity Development Service (GIDS) for help, said they felt families were 'systematically' demanding to be referred for life-changing hormone treatment on the advice of campaigners..

One former clinician claimed "Mermaids sell themselves as a support group. They are not. They are lobbyists. During sessions they would sit in the waiting room outside."

The GIDS's own internal review acknowledged the rise in the number of families "presenting with their minds apparently made up".

The same clinician said: "The reality is if you say the right trigger words, get Mermaids on your side, by 11 you'll be on hormone blockers and by 16 you'll be on hormones. That's not ethical." '

That's not proof nor statistics, its based on opinions. Whereas seems the parents realise they weren't actually parenting and looking for someone to blame to avoid making themselves looks bad. Please can you provide the link the above is from?

@G5000

Weird how nobody blames the parents in this kind of situation.

Weird how you missed all the discussion about a specific court case where a mother with mental health issues was certainly blamed. But she was also supported by Mermaids.

Nope, I saw that. Sorry that someone disagrees with you. It's not a charity's job to parent your child.

@GreytExpectations can you see me / my posts??

The headline is 'Families 'exploited by gender lobby groups pushing for treatment'

It was part of a larger investigative edition, alongside the feature 'it feels like conversion therapy for gay children, say clinicians'

Ex- NHS staff fear that homophobia is driving a surge in 'transgender' young people, writes Lucy Bannerman.

"In the future I think there will be lots of de-transitioners who feel their bodies were mutilated as young people."

And 'Doubts over evidence for using drugs on the end'.

Lots to get through still - we haven't even mentioned Charlie's detransitioner website yet, from the perspective of a young woman who transitioned and then detransitioned.

Oh and to clarify, yes she should be blamed. It's her job to parent her child and make informed decisions for said child.

And one last point from me. In order to be a feminist one must center women and girls. So if people are arguing in threads to do with feminism that, for example, there is no need for explicit and absolute protections for women and girls in law and/or society, or if people are bleating on in various guises about ‘What about the men? Won’t someone think of the men?’ then they will be rightly told that they are not a feminist. Feminism is about women.

There are plenty of gloating, manipulative, dangerous men who are riding the trans wagon

OK, there's a possibility there is.
This wasn't "the trans wagon" though.
This was a poster, who was a trans woman. An individual with a differing opinion.
How, how is that OK to say "gloating manipulative male" in that context to an actual person, just because you don't agree with them?
They're people, it's a bit sickening and seeming to lumping them all together and othering with "trans wagon" "there's lots of manipulative ones" - maybe there is but as with all people there'll be lots of lovely ones too just like you get with biological men and women.

*That's not proof nor statistics, its based on opinions. Whereas seems the parents realise they weren't actually parenting and looking for someone to blame to avoid making themselves looks bad. Please can you provide the link the above is from?

It's based on the experiences of staff from GIDS. A number of staff have since spoken out, as is their moral duty I feel.

The Times, Monday April 8 2019 page 9.

"I thought for convos re gender and sex
man / woman = gender
male / female = sex"

Woman = Adult human female in any dictionary, and that is the only meaning I use that word in. It does not and has never meant "Adult human male who likes pink, wears dress, and wants to be called 'she'" in the English language.

Good luck to TRAs arguing Oxford ED, Cambridge English Dictionary and others are all "transphobic".

Hands off I don't think your link has worked properly as there isn't one

@LemonadeAndDaisyChains

There are plenty of gloating, manipulative, dangerous men who are riding the trans wagon

OK, there's a possibility there is.
This wasn't "the trans wagon" though.
This was a poster, who was a trans woman. An individual with a differing opinion.
How, how is that OK to say "gloating manipulative male" in that context to an actual person, just because you don't agree with them?
They're people, it's a bit sickening and seeming to lumping them all together and othering with "trans wagon" "there's lots of manipulative ones" - maybe there is but as with all people there'll be lots of lovely ones too just like you get with biological men and women.

Yes...and I’ve never said otherwise. Nor have the vast, vast majority of posters on FWR. We stress over and over and quite emphatically that there is absolutely no problem with those individuals that are decent people. They are not our concern. Our concern is directly in respect of those who are not decent people, and keeping them out of women’s spaces (literally and figuratively).

Again, without having seen the thread you are referring to, I can’t comment further on that specific discussion.

It's not a charity's job to parent your child.

So you are saying that the court was wrong and Mermaids had no influence in this case?

@CoteDAzur

"I thought for convos re gender and sex man / woman = gender male / female = sex"

Woman = Adult human female in any dictionary, and that is the only meaning I use that word in. It does not and has never meant "Adult human male who likes pink, wears dress, and wants to be called 'she'" in the English language.

Good luck to TRAs arguing Oxford ED, Cambridge English Dictionary and others are all "transphobic".

I realise that thanks Cote but in the discussions on these boards it’s generally understood that we make a distinction in some cases - it’s a terrible concession but better than getting deleted for using MN banned terms or the awful cis