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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

WIBU to say no to bailing BIL out?

578 replies

YeahWhatevver · 03/07/2020 13:31

Really struggling to work out what to do.

DH and BIL are relatively close. BIL has never been great with money, definitely lives for the moment. Has in the past had quite a bit of credit card debt and has previously struggled with managing his money. He has (had) a decent job BIL and SIL both work, though SIL is 2 days a week. They have 2 kids.

DH and BIL inherited just under 90k each about 2.5 years ago from their Mother's estate. Nothing was ever discussed about what they were planning to do with it, we put a lot of it into the mortgage or set it aside to put into the mortgage when our fixed term ends (want to a out early repayment fees) and have put some aside for our kids (first cars/bit ot money for college)

Looks like BIL spent most of his - none of our business it's his to use as he wants.

BIL is looking like he'll imminently lose his job. And called up DH asking of he has any of mum's inheritance left as he's in a bit of a spot a figure of £25k seems to have been banded about. Annoyingly DH said yes, we've got quite a bit in savings, so BIL knows we could if we wanted to

DH has previously "loaned" BIL money for it to never be returned fully.

Our family and BIL's family have similar incomes. So it's not like DH has got lucky while BIL has been dealt a bad hand in life.
BIL has a lot bigger house, 2 nice cars lots of personal finance

I can tell DH is protective of his brother and wants to help but I really want to just say no. We've made plans around this money, made sacrifices to be in the financial position we are now and I don't see why we should squander those plans to bail out someone who has failed to take responsibility for themselves.

Problem is, I can see this creating a huge rift.

WIBU to speak to BIL and say no?

OP posts:
mrpumblechook · 03/07/2020 16:27

Sorry, DH hasn't said yes, only that we have it in savings.

You can tell his DB that he made a mistake about the savings and the money is actually tied up. He could perhaps it is being used to pay off the mortgage for example. Your BIL may not believe him for what can he do?

CoraPirbright · 03/07/2020 16:28

Yes tell bil that it’s one of those savings accounts where you can’t access the money for 3 years thereby getting a better rate.

MrsNoah2020 · 03/07/2020 16:30

@DisobedientHamster

Agree. Personally I was thinking more in terms of a Declaration of Trust for the house, not relying on the BIL to pay.

But even that won't pay out if the BIL goes insolvent (which, given his history, is a distinct possibility) or the home is repossessed and then sold at a price less than what is needed to satisfy the mortgage(s) (he may have more than one) - that lender will be in line to be paid first.

True. Personally, for my brother, I would probably take the risk and pay the mortgage for a few months, to give him the chance to sell up, rather than have the house re-possessed. But you are right that it is impossible to make doing so risk-free.
VioletGrace · 03/07/2020 16:35

He will spend it and then hound your DH for more, until your DH's 90k is gone too! Do not lend it to him!

Whywhywhy321 · 03/07/2020 16:35

Inheritance can cause huge rows in families! When my dm died, elder brother thought house should come to him as oldest son, despite it being left 4 ways between my siblings and I. He then thought that we should sell it to him at a reduced rate of £150, therefore £112.5 with his share taken off and with all contents left in house, despite these being left between my dsis and I. He pestered my dd (who had moved in to nurse her dgm, but moved out day after dm died) asking for key, which I had already handed to executor and wanting to know where certain items were that should be his (which again, had been left to dsis and I). He actually phoned me and threatened to contest will if he didn’t get his own way!

Final straw was when he tried to block the sale of the house for £200k, as it wasn’t enough money, despite him wanting to buy it at a value of £150!

He wasn’t struggling for money, just greedy! He had bought his dd a house outright, had 2 houses locally which he let out, plus a flat in central Edinburgh, which was also let out!

Once inheritance was sorted out I went LC, which went to NC, when he continually accused my dd of taking items from the house (which my dm had given her and had told both dsis and I that she had done so, for looking after her). We both agreed that my dd deserved these, plus more, for the 6 months she had moved in and looked after dm.

Purplephonecover · 03/07/2020 16:43

Surely if he is about to lose his job he only needs money to cover loss of earning for the time it takes to get a new job? Unless he earns £200k that’s not £25k.

In your shoes I would suggest to DH that you jointly come up with a plan to help, my suggestion would be to offer to lend the shortfall in income, for a couple of months, with a repayment plan. Is BIL getting redundancy/severance?

Ellmau · 03/07/2020 16:45

£25k is a whole year's worth of money for many people, on top of what benefits or redundancy money he'll get

It might mean he wasn't eligible for any benefits.

cabbageking · 03/07/2020 16:45

Consider it a loan against the mortgage and have a charge applied.

MrKlaw · 03/07/2020 16:47

@Purplephonecover if BIL only inherited 90k a couple of years ago, shouldn't they still be reasonably expected to have a safety net of their own?

It seems clear he's pissed it down the drain and now expects DH to bail him out. And based on past behaviour I can't see you getting it back other than in dribs and drabs to the point where it'll be almost useless.

OP has already agreed with DH to set some aside for the mortgage once the early penalty payment window has finished - if that wasn't there they'd have put it in already and it wouldn't be 'available'. The rest for DCs for Uni support - both pragmatic, sensible and important reasons to keep it

PAND0RA · 03/07/2020 16:48

@cabbageking

Consider it a loan against the mortgage and have a charge applied.
His existing lender won’t allow him to do this.
LakieLady · 03/07/2020 16:49

Personally, for my brother, I would probably take the risk and pay the mortgage for a few months, to give him the chance to sell up, rather than have the house re-possessed

That would be a decent gesture, but given that OP's BIL has borrowed money before, and not paid it back in full, I'd be reluctant to lend to him again.

It sounds to me as though their financial picture is very bleak and if the BIL's job was well paid AND they've got loads of debts with only a heavily mortgaged house with a nice kitchen to show for it.

What they should be doing now is putting that nice house on the market to raise the money they need to clear their debts and, hopefully, buy a modest house with what's left so they have a roof over their heads. And they need to hand back the cars, buy an old banger and SIL needs to up her hours or get a second job.

MillyDilly · 03/07/2020 16:49

@cabbageking

Consider it a loan against the mortgage and have a charge applied.
That doesn’t help as if the house gets repossessed, the lender doesn’t care what they sell it for as long as it covers the outstanding mortgage amount. OP’s £25k might not be there.
mbosnz · 03/07/2020 16:50

Given the extremely uncertain times we live in, I'd also be asking DH how he'd feel, and how he thinks you'd feel, if the financial proverbial hit the fan for your family, and that money had been pissed up against BIL's wall, no longer available as a buffer for your family?

Girlsjustwanna · 03/07/2020 16:51

Heck no billy oh

LakieLady · 03/07/2020 16:52

It might mean he wasn't eligible for any benefits

Means-tested benefits aren't available to anyone with over £16k in capital. All he'd get is "New-style JSA" of £74.35 a week.

Mumto1andthetinybun · 03/07/2020 16:53

Its not 'mum's money' though is it? Its your security.
Your DH just needs to say you have less then he thought or most of whats left is in the kids savings and the rest is locked away for a few years yet.
Could he offer to help them go over their budgets to figure out what could be cut back on in the mean time?
As a way to help?

simonisnotme · 03/07/2020 16:55

wow 25k is a shit load of money to spend never mind lend to someone whoever they are
they need to sort their finances out and stop using your DH as a cash cow, you will never see it again OP
'Neither a borrower or lender be'

willowmelangell · 03/07/2020 16:55

Bil wants you to pay for him to sit on his arse moaning how he can't get a job in his desired career.
That would be a hard no from me.

mrpumblechook · 03/07/2020 16:57

His existing lender won’t allow him to do this.

They will allow it. The lender will get their money back first though so if the house is in negative equity OP may never see anything.

Original poster
YeahWhatevver · 03/07/2020 16:58

Thanks for the replies, nice to see its almost unanimous. I wasn't faltering much but I could see my sympathy for BIL rising, reading the posts has really hardened my resolve to say no.

Didn't think about it at the time but you're right, DH has been a bit of a pussy and set me up to be the bad guy. I'm going to insist he says no and that he didn't even discuss it with me.

Someone mentioned Aviation earlier, yes that's the sector.

Lots of disbelief about the 90k in 2.5 years (me included when I heard!)

There's been holidays to far flung places, a raft of expensive home improvements (in addition to the kitchen) , I really don't know what else. I really don't want to know, I don't want to take any ownership of it.

OP posts:
5foot5 · 03/07/2020 16:59

Ask your DH if he gives this £25K to his brother (gives not lends because you all know full well he will never repay it) how long he thinks it will be before he asks for some more? And then when he has been through all of your share of the money, which he surely will, if you or your DH lose your jobs and get in to a tight financial spot, will BIL be in a position to help you out?

ButteryPuffin · 03/07/2020 16:59

If your BiL is going under, it may as well be for the larger amount of money. You and your DH can't save somebody in these circumstances, you can only lose money that might actually be more useful later, if it came to helping them find a deposit for housing etc. (should they lose their home).

This is a point the husband might see the sense of.

ChikiTIKI · 03/07/2020 16:59

Bil needs to sell one of his cars and probably some other stuff too. Hopefully he doesn't lose his job... Can his wide pick up more hours?

I'd be paying off the mortgage ASAP so there isn't cash lying around.

Original poster
YeahWhatevver · 03/07/2020 16:59

I also think that when the 90k was received it immediately went towards some existing debts so the spending of it actually stretches past the 2.5 years.

OP posts:
DoubleTweenQueen · 03/07/2020 16:59

Bil should have behaved like a responsible adult and have savings to fall back on as you and your DH have wisely done. He lives beyond his means and gone through a significant amount of extra cash. That's on him. If he loses his job, can't get another as good for a while, he needs to look at changing his lifestyle, cutting back on outgoings. If you give him the money, it will go to servicing his unaffordable lifestyle - prop it up for a few months. At the end of which he will likely be in the same position and still need to make changes. He needs to face up to his responsibility and financial position now. You would not see that 25k again and will likely lose the current close relationship as a result, too. Please say no.