How exactly do you know your child is top of their class

[shadesofsun]

As per the title, I am curious as to how so many parents claims their child is top of the class, so who tells you that?

Are teachers really telling parents this or giving a hierarchy of where the children sit?

Teachers give parents an idea of where their child is at parents' evening? One of my DC's teachers once told me that there was a huge gulf between her writing and that of the other children!
That was in primary. It's not so noticeable in secondary - children go at their own pace, etc.

I was a teacher and would never have described a child as 'top of the class'. The term is practically meaningless as children tend to be better at some things than others. We had ability groups but never a child who was better at everything than anyone else.

DS is (probably) the top of the class in areas such as science and humanities. He was put on the G&T register for general knowledge, and his feedback from his y3 teacher for his ASD referral cited his adult depth of knowledge and application.

He still struggles to organise the 6 letters in his name accurately and barely able to write a sentence, so he's pretty close to the bottom of the class in literacy.

There are plenty of spaces at the top across the curriculum, and you don't have to be top of everything.

@RomaineCalm

Position in the class is pretty meaningless unless you know the level that the cohort is working at.

As other posters have said we tended to get an idea of DC's levels from the tables/groups that they were working with.

In senior school they start comparing marks in tests so you can make a guess from there. Saying that I would prefer DC to get 80% in a test and come 10th in the class than get 60% in the same test and come top.

What if the 80% one was a really easy test, and the 60% one was really hard (e.g. above the level they are expected to be working at)? It's more complicated than just percentages.

@TheFormerPorpentinaScamander

In year one they sat on tables named after shapes. They moved between the tables for some subjects. Ds2 realised that the shape name for the table he (and a friend) were on for every subject had more sides than any other. He then worked out that they did harder work than other tables and came to the conclusion it was the cleverest table. He and aforementioned friend also did their year 2 SATS in year 1.

I can proudly report he is distinctly average now (year 8) despite his early promise

That's brilliant! Very impressed at that age.

DC1 is top of her class because I help out with reading and the reading register was lying next to the teacher. I can read upside down very quickly and I saw DC1's name at the top. And it wasn't alphabetical.

And she's on top table for everything. She knew what colour table was top.

When she was moved from 'Elephants' to 'Zebras' I hoped she was going the right way

I spent 7 years teaching and never used the phrase "top of the class" about a single child. Obviously you know if your own child is bright, but I don't like the concept of parents comparing their DC to their classmates. It's important for my DC that they work hard and give their best. Their ranking means fuckall - too many parents focus on it and it helps nobody.

DS1 has been reading - and understanding texts - since before he started school. He has autism and certain things simply come easily to him whilst others are a huge challenge. DS2 is one of those lucky children for whom most subjects come easy - out of the two of them I'm certain DS1 works harder whilst DS2 achieves higher grades. It's chance, luck and a bit of hard work.

Speaking now as an adult, as a child I felt well aware if who was clever or not, who could draw well, who was good at sport etc in the class and where you fitted in.

As a parent now I came away from parents evening feeling my 5yo was fairly average but bright enough and was achieving good levels. My husband seemed to think teachers said she was a genius from same conversation. The teacher was so positive and enthuastic it felt like I was reading between the lines to hear her true level of ability.

Teachers told me my child was "one of the ones she needed to give harder work to" and whenever there was a trip for gifted and talented, she was invited.

It many children are 'top' of the class across every subject.
They might be in one or two subjects, but rarely all.

I've taught lots of children and it's unusual
To get a child who is top of the class in maths, English, PE, reading, science, humanity subjects, languages etc all at the same time. Very very rare, even at lower primary.

Few teachers would ever tell you and a mark book raw scores often don't say a huge amount either, certainly not the whole picture.

Yes the teacher told me with dd!

In younger years, the groups for maths were ants, beetles, caterpillars. Didnt take my child long to work out that was A, b, c.

One of mine is very bright and school made it very clear both at primary and secondary.
They discussed it practically (how to manage his needs) and were honest about the difficulties it provided both them and my child. It wasn’t great tbh. He hated doing different work to the others and had to go and do maths in particular with three years ahead when he was in Yr1.
In secondary he had additional further maths one to ones from the start and the English teacher would tell us his essays were university standard from about Yr9.
It doesn’t translate to an easy life at school or in the future. School is very much about fitting in and the social side for kids and who wants to be different?

The others have all been average and I assume this rather than have been told but it’s obvious- no discussions as per the eldest but never any major concerns voiced about ability keep up with the year group.

I have no idea how my DD compares to the others.

The grade she got was higher than everyone else in her class for this particular subject

I'm not sure whether DD was at the "top" of her class (by that I mean absolute number 1) but I knew she was v v bright as her teachers told me at every parents evening.

She was on the top table for every subject (they have colours for each table for each subject according to abilities). She got top marks in her phonics score in year 1, she got top marks in SATS in year 2 and she got top marks in SATS in year 6.
She won prizes for writing and got a piece of work published. Her reports were all As and she was the first person in her year to get her pen license. I know that she was the first as they announced it in assembly.

Now she's at High School and she in top set for all lessons and gets As in most subjects except for PE (obviously gets her sporting ability from me ).

From all this I would assume that she was at least one of the top in Primary school.

I would NEVER EVER tell anyone in RL that she was at the top of her class though. If anyone comments on her abilities I just say that she's "doing well at school".

I still have DD2 at Primary and I know that she ISN'T top of the class.

Every parents evening I get told that she's where she's meant to be. She seems to be on middle range tables for different subjects. Her reports are mostly Bs with a few As. She's very sporty.

I'm immensely proud of both of them.

But yes, parents usually know whereabouts on the scale their child is, although some might be lying. Some are competitive.

My child also figured out that certificates were given to the naughty of less intelligent kids, to encourage them to be better.

I think some parents interpret kids levelled at greater depth / exceeding to mean top of the class. There might be half a dozen children in the class at the same level.
One if mine was a bit good at spelling. The teacher said that he and 2 others were doing different spelling work as they were a bit ahead of the others (can't remember her words exactly). You could read top of the class into that, but actually it is top three of a tiny bit of the curriculum. Most classes have kids with different skills.
I did teach a class with one kid who was streets ahead of the rest across the board though.

Not necessarily top of the class but children were arranged in the class according to ability...less able at the front through to most able at the back, confirmed by SATS results. Everyone knew it including the kids themselves.

What would the point be in doing KS1 SATs a year early? They'd still need to do them in year 2 anyway. They're not like GCSEs and a levels.

I know which children are the cleverest as it patently obvious in the Zoom meetings!! 🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️(unfortunately mine is down the other end of the scale).

We were always told at parents evenings 😐

“Dd is working at top of the class”
“Dd has been given different work as she’s ahead of the rest of the class”

Also been shown charts etc...

Teachers do tell parents same as they tell parents if their child is struggling.

What if the 80% one was a really easy test, and the 60% one was really hard (e.g. above the level they are expected to be working at)? It's more complicated than just percentages.

Sorry, I didn't explain that very well. I meant that a child in Class A takes a test and gets 80% and comes 10th in their class; child in Class B takes exactly the same test, gets 60% and comes top of the class. Position in class doesn't mean much in that case - a score on a test (and knowing whether that means in terms of the child working at the expected or higher level) is potentially more useful.

It's all irrelevant anyway, because your childs class might not be as good as another class in another school. If they went to another school, they might be middle range.

Exactly as pp say. I can safety say for many reasons DD is top if her class. However if she was in a different class she wouldn't be. That's all there is to it