Mr and Mrs his initial surname 🤬

[ottermadness]

I just hate it, I’m not a Mrs and I have a name.

It’s nice that people remember to send anniversary cards though so I’m not going to be impolite.

AIBU that this gives me rage!?

The OP and poll was about whether it is reasonable to refer to women by Mrs husband’s initial and surname, not about whether it is reasonable for a woman to change her name upon marriage.

so why the nasty posts trying to put down women who chose to change their name? That's what I was replying to...

I couldn't care less what name you chose, it's just impossible to guess so you are guaranteed to get it wrong and offend someone.

@JaniceWebster

The OP and poll was about whether it is reasonable to refer to women by Mrs husband’s initial and surname, not about whether it is reasonable for a woman to change her name upon marriage.

so why the nasty posts trying to put down women who chose to change their name? That's what I was replying to...

I couldn't care less what name you chose, it's just impossible to guess so you are guaranteed to get it wrong and offend someone.

“I couldn't care less what name you chose, it's just impossible to guess so you are guaranteed to get it wrong and offend someone”

Thing is, it’s not... it just takes a bit of thought, effort and willingness to embrace change 🤷🏻‍♀️

I choose to change my surname on marriage but I am not Mrs husbands initial surname. What really annoyed me was the letter that arrived Professional title and Mrs surname- I’m the one with the professional title not him. It is sexist whether I changed my name or not to assume he is the one with the title.

ottermadness

Thing is, it’s not... it just takes a bit of thought, effort and willingness to embrace change 🤷🏻‍♀️

HOW can you guess if you are offending someone by NOT using their married name or by NOT using their maiden name? That's was my point. You CANNOT guess if someone keeps their name or not.

Why does informal post like a birthday or anniversary card need to use a title anyway? I always just put Firstname Surname (e.g. Annie Oakley), or if it’s to a couple, Firstname and Firstname Surname (e.g. Annie and Danny Oakley).

FWIW, I did take my husband‘s name when we got married, but I often wish I hadn’t, even though I really like the name.

Extra note: I wouldn’t use Firstname and Firstname Surname for a couple unless I knew that they definitely shared a surname. I’d put Fullname and Fullname - or sometimes just Firstname and Firstname. The post still gets there!

I’m Ms Baskin and will remain that regardless of martial status

How do you "traditional" people address same sex married couples? Karen Smith marries Jenny Jones. They don't change or double barrel their surnames. How do you decide which one loses their identity, or does it only work in a male/female marriage? If so, why?

Very old fashioned but from women over 70 who were less likely to have worked,/studied, they felt they had to take statues from their husbands. The patriarchy screwed them and left them with no status of their own. Even if they had studied/qualified, they were still pitied if a man didnt claim them.

A lot of older women probably feel judged indirectly by the very reasonable request from married women to have their achievements acknowledged.

My mum is like this. She wanted more for me than she achieved but somehow i was to achieve it without letting go of any of the patriarchal bullshit that kept her in a small place.

@ottermadness send your mil a formal invitation to something like the anniversary of your phd and write Dr and Mr Otter on the other side of the enveleope!

@JaniceWebster

ottermadness

Thing is, it’s not... it just takes a bit of thought, effort and willingness to embrace change 🤷🏻‍♀️

HOW can you guess if you are offending someone by NOT using their married name or by NOT using their maiden name? That's was my point. You CANNOT guess if someone keeps their name or not.

You use their name, their first name, rather than adhere to formality or tradition or title!

Or make the effort to ask their preference

and then be willing to change what you think is the right thing to do when they tell you their preference!

Id assume that it is more offensive to reduceva woman to mr s husbansurname if she is married to steve husbandsurname that it would be to call her mrs h familyname ie her own first name + birth surname.

And Im 50. So not young. And i would still if i had to guess what a random woman would prefer, go with her own initial her own surname.

ottermadness
and then be willing to change what you think is the right thing to do when they tell you their preference!

You are terribly judgemental in your posts. I stated that I DON'T CARE what you chose, and that you can have preferences.

Why do you translate the fact that I CHOSE to have my husband's name, that I am happy and confident in my choice, not defined by my married status (and very successful professionally in my own right may I add), why do you translate that as an attack against others?!?

I am responding to the posters who are trying to put women down because they made a choice. Why do you feel threatened or attacked and feel the need to be so negative towards me?

Interesting to see how so confident and modern you really are then...

I know some women who get offended if you don't use their husband's name. You get offended if you are not called by your maiden name 🤷

In all honesty, I think families should have a family name. Have said to my kids, pick either his name, her name, double barrelled name or entirely new name but both use it and be a family.

I think that's different to using hisname though. Their choice what they use and that choice should be remembered.

@JaniceWebster

I know some women who get offended if you don't use their husband's name. You get offended if you are not called by your maiden name 🤷

Where have I said I didn’t take my husbands name?

Again, I DON'T CARE!

I just refuse to feel inferior (or superior) because of my own choice. I am not, and I am not defined by my marital status.

I was also merely pointing out that it IS a minefield, you cannot GUESS what other people have chosen and many get offended if you guess wrong. Not sure why that simple fact is controversial when this thread proves it's completely accurate.

This thread is interesting as, in my experience, titles are very much dying out in both official and personal correspondence. I’ve always been a Ms mybirthname and he’s Dr hisbirthname, but everything we receive (either individually or jointly) usually just states our individual first and last names sans title. He veeerryy occasionally gets the odd ‘Dr’. I’ve just double checked to make sure.

I work for a UK national membership organisation (circa 200k members) and we generate a lot of correspondence. Our protocol is also just first name and last name, sans title, unless it’s an earned or ceremonial title or actual position. As in, a Rear Admiral would be called a Rear Admiral.

So, I am very much of the opinion that titles are dying out, so this will all be a bit moot shortly. If something was addressed to me as Mrs hisinitial hislastname, I’d think it was a hilarious windup. It’s just so far removed from my normal.

I did not change my name when I got married and always used Ms MyOwnSurname. My (ex) MIL absoltuely refused to accept that and never learned my surname. Every year for my birthday she sent me a card addressed to Mrs MyInital HisSurname. That wasn’t even formally (oldfashionedly) correct - that’s how you address a divorced woman, apparently in oldfashioned formality.

Or maybe she was prophetic. Almost 20 years later I divorced her son.

Just pointing out that you have made a few assumptions...

“I just refuse to feel inferior (or superior) because of my own choice. I am not, and I am not defined by my marital status.“

I think we are saying the same thing then aren’t we !?

“I was also merely pointing out that it IS a minefield, you cannot GUESS what other people have chosen and many get offended if you guess wrong. Not sure why that simple fact is controversial when this thread proves it's completely accurate.”

Perhaps! I’d argue it’s best not to guess at all, worse still stick to a dubious convention.

It’s nothing personal!

I have kept my own names throughout and use Ms. However when addressing either the very old (now 90 plus) and/or very traditional people I use the older form of address. It gets complicated when a partner dies or divorces.

It's ludicrous really. But I must admit to seething when addressed by an elderly uncle as Mrs Crosstalk's husband and he even spells his surname wrong.

Just put it back in the post saying 'not known at this address.

It makes me cringe when women refer to their own name as a maiden name.

Yeh the term 'maiden name' does grate and I can't understand women who use it.