Not welcome in sister house

[mamascorpio]

I rang my sister today and she has informed me that I am no longer welcome in her home.

My BIL fell out with me in Feb this year after they went through a separation.

I spoke to their Eldest daughter during the separation and advised that if either mum or Dad tried to talk to them about what was going on just to say it was none of her business. Both of them were using eldest daughter 13 as a means of communicating what had gone wrong.

Bil lost it when the eldest daughter told him what I had said. He hasn't spoken to me since, has actively ignored me when I have walked past to go into the house etc.

They reconciled after a few weeks, then Bil decided that I needed to apologise for what I said to Eldest daughter and also for the fact that years before I had mentioned that 1 in 5 children are not the biological child of their father. bIL developed complete paranoia over this and decided that I was trying to tell him that one of his children isn't his. Nonsense.

Further he is also angry apparently that i wasn't happy when my sister and he reconciled.

They had an argument after a night out, he was verbally abusing to my sister, she and 4 of the children came and stayed in my house overnight then he left the house a few days later.

So he had been ignoring me for months, I have simply not paid any attention to the issue although it was annoying on the basis that he was being unreasonable.

So now after I was at their house yesterday he has decided and is supported by my sister that I'm not welcome.

I'm devastated, I live alone with my DS and my sitter is the closest person to me.

Her children all adore my son, and her youngest son stays here and they visit me once per week at least. I visit them also at least once a week.

My sister also looked after my son while I worked, albeit he is going elsewhere at the minute due to covid.

I can't believe my sister would say that to me. I know BIL is well capable of this. He has already fallen out with one of my other siblings. He didn't speak to one of his own for almost 20 years and didn't speak to his father for longer.

I'm so hurt.

Am I being unreasonable to not apologise when I didn't do anything wrong imo.

Or should I have just apologised?

You are far too invested in your sisters relationship. It's never good to interfere as you will get no thanks for it and now you are made out to be the bad guy. Just keep away for a while and your sister will probably come round. You shouldn't have spoken to the child as you did. Still it's done now. Try to take a step back even if you are right in your concerns.

@OhCaptain

Your first paragraph is absolutely ridiculous Zackly!

OP has even just posted to say that her sister of the abusive husband and five children comes to clean her house!

There is more than one person manipulating this woman...

@mamascorpio you should encourage your sister to post.

Must have hit a nerve with my first paragraph And oh look who it's from!

Again you obviously didn't read the Op's posts. She pays her sister, and it's the only money her sister has that is hers. Twist the narritive anyway you'd like to suit your own purpose, some of us can actually read, and know you're shit stirring for some weird reason

narrative

Must have hit a nerve with my first paragraphwink And oh look who it's from!grin

What does that even mean?

Granted I didn’t see where OP said she pays her sister. Not sure why you think I’m all about the “menz”, which is what I assume you’re implying?

I’ve never seen your username before so I’m genuinely lost! 😂

Sorry but a few issues here.

1. He may be controlling. If so it is entirely up to your sister to address this.
2. You talked to your BIL about possibility of kids not being biologically related to their fathers which sent him into a spin.
3. You told their daughter what do do while they were separating.

I think I'd not have you involved either as you take massive liberties. Can you not butt out? And maybe apologise.

@Jakey056

Sorry but a few issues here.

1. He may be controlling. If so it is entirely up to your sister to address this.
2. You talked to your BIL about possibility of kids not being biologically related to their fathers which sent him into a spin.
3. You told their daughter what do do while they were separating.

I think I'd not have you involved either as you take massive liberties. Can you not butt out? And maybe apologise.

1. There is nothing wrong in wanting to support your sister who is in an abusive relationship. You shouldn’t just leave them to it. It’s not 1950 anymore.
2. it’s not the OPs responsibility to walk on egg shells because the BIL is likely to “go into a spin” over a newspaper headline.
3. the daughter was obviously upset about being put in the middle of her warring parents. Her aunt advised her that she is within her rights to tell them she didn’t want to be put in this situation anymore.

These are some of the examples of abuse that OP has given:

*They had an argument after a night out, he was verbally abusing to my sister, she and 4 of the children came and stayed in my house overnight then he left the house a few days later.

He is very controlling of my sister, at my hen do years ago he went mad because she didn't ring until we arrived back at the house at 2.am. Lost it when she stayed overnight at her friends 40 at a hotel all prearranged because she didn't ring at a certain time etc.

She is allowed out but not really by herself without the children.

That's how he is controlling, my sister who is one of the most gregarious people you could ever met now spend t have a single friend left in her life

He always threatens to stop paying the mortgage and that she would be destitute / homeless without him doing so.*

These are all warning signs for coercive control. If you have a family member who is being subjected to this level of control, I strongly advise that you do not butt out. Take fucking liberties and let them know that that is not ok and that they can come to you for help.

I think you need to give it a few days before you make a final decision. It's too new to be able to see clearly.

The bottom line is: Is your pride worth more than your relationship with your sister and possibly the rest of your family if they 'side' with her. Is it worth more than the help you may be able to give her not only in her present situation, but if she ever does make the final decision to leave him.

@OhCaptain

Must have hit a nerve with my first paragraphwink And oh look who it's from!grin

What does that even mean?

Granted I didn’t see where OP said she pays her sister. Not sure why you think I’m all about the “menz”, which is what I assume you’re implying?

I’ve never seen your username before so I’m genuinely lost! 😂

Where did I say you were all about the menz? Go back and have a re-read, you seem to have some trouble with responding before you actuallly comprehend what a poster is saying. In fact I didn't write any usernames. I wonder why you took that particular post personally? Hmm maybe the part about giving a kicking and making shite up bothered you somehow...

I've been here quite a while and have seen your username a fair bit. Did you not realize that many posters name change? I'm so sorry this has genuinely moved you to tears, hopefully you will find yourself soon

To be honest, I think the OP's sister needs to get herself and her kids the hell away from everyone. Her husband is an abusive twat and she's caught in the middle of another toxic relationship between him and her sister. Poor woman.

@ZacklySo the menz thing was a guess since you were so busy thinking you were oh so hilarious and edgy with your snarky comments, you didn't actually say which part of your waffle was supposed to have touched a nerve!

However, apparently you think I've given the OP a kicking so why don't you go ahead and show me where. And honestly, the digs about me not being able to read and comprehend are just embarrassing for you.

I'm flattered that I've made such an impact on you as a poster I guess.

OP, you must be so hurt. But going forward, maybe you need to make your sister less central in your life. Spend time with other family members. As lockdown eases, and your child grows a little older, encourage your little one to make friends, then you will have others to invite round to play in your garden. You don’t want your child to be dependent on their relationship with your sisters children if your BiL can snap his fingers and take that away. It will take time but try to build new friendships for you and your little one.

@MotherofTerriers thank you. I think you are correct. I need to just to step back.

In respect of her marriage, once she reconciled with her husband I completely respected that and haven't said a word about it since.

Clearly that isn't enough for the BIL and he continues to be threatened by me.

I feel less raw today, still heartbroken.

My brothers have been in touch, expressing their upset and shock at how sister and BIL have behaved

My mum says my sister just feels stuck in the middle and that it is BIL house as well and that my sister hasn't fallen out with me.

I think I just need to be protective of myself.

So your brothers feel 'upset' and your sister feels 'in the middle'. I understand your sister, but are your mother and brothers just going to go along with this 'banning'?

I still wonder why the rest of the family would still consent to go to BiL & DSis house for family celebrations when one member of that family has been excluded. Unless of course they agree with the exclusion, which your mum and DBs obviously do not.

As I posted above, in a similar situation with DH's SiL the rest of DH's family started celebrating family occasions elsewhere. Obvs DSis's child's Bday would be different, but any other family get together would be held elsewhere with both DSis and BiL invited. It would then be up to BiL to accept or decline.

Your family should absolutely be supporting you by having family get togethers anywhere but your BIL's home. And they should turn down any invitation from them while you're banned from their home.

While they continue to accept DS and BIL's decision, DS will continue to let him call the shots. If they withdraw from her home also, it might help her realise just how unreasonable he's being and how his decisions are ruining her and the DCs lives.

Wait.... so you have TWO brothers? Why haven't they confronted him? Why have they let their sister stay in a trapped relationship where she has no friends and is held hostage? Just what the hell kind of brothers are they to let their own sister suffer like this?? Any other family with two brothers and that husband would be in fear of his own life. It sounds one big family that couldn't give a shit about her, the only one who does is you. Maybe you need to tell your brothers to be a man and go confront him. You shouldn't even need to have to tell them though. That's the sad thing, the complete apathy towards the sister.

And your mum doesn't sound like any kind of mother with a maternal instinct.

The abuse and controlling of my sister isn't overt. If you visited their home you wouldn't think anything was wrong. Except that my sister does all the childcare / housework etc

My brothers obviously have their opinions and we're obviously all supportive of her when she left him but you cannot go into an adults life and make decisions for them. If it worked every family that had controlling partners would simply go in and remove their family members.

If my brothers went in and confronted him. BIL would simply use it as an excuse to isolate her further from the rest of the family.

Until she makes the decision to leave there isn't much anyone can do.

That's the awful thing about coerive control and domestic abuse generally is that the victim is there because they want to be absolutely not in all cases.

Op, I do feel your somewhat missing the point

You are Adamant your sister is in an abusive relationship with a man she has five kids with. How do you correlate this against your own behaviour, telling him one in five kids was not the biological fathers, telling the daughter to tell her parents it wasn’t her business when her parents tried to speak to her about their split, taking the kids out for dinner when you knew full well their dinner was being cooked.

These are antagonistic actions bound to cause her more problems. I cannot correlate your comments about him with your own behaviour which is absolutely guaranteed to cause her more problems.

You seem to just shrug it off, like you did nothing wrong and it was all him, when without a shadow of a doubt if this man is as he says then your behaviour has made it worse for her.

Sorry, how are these “telling him one in five kids was not the biological fathers, telling the daughter to tell her parents it wasn’t her business when her parents tried to speak to her about their split” “bad behaviour”!?

So because I didn't walk on eggshells around my controlling BIL I'm in the wrong?

I have known my BIL for 20 years.

One of the 1sr interactions I had with him was when my sister and he were dating.

They spoke on the landline, later that night I convinced my sister to come out with me and we all stayed the night at my then boyfriends house.

When BIL rang our home later that night and found out that my sister wasn't there as he expected her to be he went mad, was abusive, called her everything, suggested she has been up to all sorts.

Being in mind she was 21 and I was 19 at the time. I messaged him because she was so upset and said don't be silly, she wasn't doing anything she was just with us. His response was to tell me to fuck off. So I have been very careful over the last 20 years about how I behave around this man.

But I will not stand by and watch my 13 year old neice beign used as a verbal punchbag to carry hateful messages between her parents -!: I said the comment about telling your parents it's none of your business in front of my sister.

The conversation about parentage was in context of the conversation we were having and yes I did take my niece and nephew for a takeaway.

So that's 3 things he can say I have done wrong in 20 years.

And he has used these things to keep my sister away from me.

I'm sure to those who are suggesting I'm the person in the wrong here than none of you have ever done anything in any of your relationships and you always behave perfectly.

But no because no one does but if you look really hard and try and make it out that your sister in law is awful for the above 3 things then yeah I'm to blame.

Btw I forgot, one time I turned off the tv and then the TV didn't work. Apparently he thinks I put some kind of code into the tv from the remote control to stop it working. But yeah he is perfectly reasonable.

He’s a dick. You are just looking out for your sister. It’s what sisters should do.

And I can’t believe how many times you have had to explain the 1 in 5 kids convo - read the fucking thread people!!!!!

As per PP suggestions , let her know you are there for her when she finally sees the light and try and step back for now. Do NOT apologise to the bully.

Thanks for the all the thoughtful replies. It seems my family are starting to realise what he is like, my stepping back has made it an issue that no one can ignore and has sent up a smoke signal to everyone.

I think the fact that he has been furloughed with her has made life harder as she doesn't even get a break at the minute with him going to work.