Not welcome in sister house

[mamascorpio]

I rang my sister today and she has informed me that I am no longer welcome in her home.

My BIL fell out with me in Feb this year after they went through a separation.

I spoke to their Eldest daughter during the separation and advised that if either mum or Dad tried to talk to them about what was going on just to say it was none of her business. Both of them were using eldest daughter 13 as a means of communicating what had gone wrong.

Bil lost it when the eldest daughter told him what I had said. He hasn't spoken to me since, has actively ignored me when I have walked past to go into the house etc.

They reconciled after a few weeks, then Bil decided that I needed to apologise for what I said to Eldest daughter and also for the fact that years before I had mentioned that 1 in 5 children are not the biological child of their father. bIL developed complete paranoia over this and decided that I was trying to tell him that one of his children isn't his. Nonsense.

Further he is also angry apparently that i wasn't happy when my sister and he reconciled.

They had an argument after a night out, he was verbally abusing to my sister, she and 4 of the children came and stayed in my house overnight then he left the house a few days later.

So he had been ignoring me for months, I have simply not paid any attention to the issue although it was annoying on the basis that he was being unreasonable.

So now after I was at their house yesterday he has decided and is supported by my sister that I'm not welcome.

I'm devastated, I live alone with my DS and my sitter is the closest person to me.

Her children all adore my son, and her youngest son stays here and they visit me once per week at least. I visit them also at least once a week.

My sister also looked after my son while I worked, albeit he is going elsewhere at the minute due to covid.

I can't believe my sister would say that to me. I know BIL is well capable of this. He has already fallen out with one of my other siblings. He didn't speak to one of his own for almost 20 years and didn't speak to his father for longer.

I'm so hurt.

Am I being unreasonable to not apologise when I didn't do anything wrong imo.

Or should I have just apologised?

". My sister said they were getting dinner shortly but she didn't tell me not to take them."

Seriously??

I mean if you hadn't said that her husband was abusive, I'd be beginning to think that he had a point about keeping you away!

You took them to the drive through for dinner even though you knew dinner was being cooked for them at home At that time and your sister told you so, purely because she didn’t say specially don’t take them when she told you dinner was being made?

Why? honestly op the examples you give do make it seem you’re a bit difficult.

Your sister will never leave him. It will always be this way. I would take a huge step back, and leave them to it. Arrange family gatherings without them, at your. I understand you feel deeply hurt by this. I went through something similar with my sister and her controlling/abusive husband. I stepped back and 10 years later she contacted me. She did leave him eventually, but she did it alone.

I’m sorry - but if I were your sister, I would want some,space,from you. It is always difficult for family members when a close,family members has what you perceive to be a shitty partner they reconcile with - but her life, her partner, her choices . And right now you don’t fit into that narrative.

And she and BIL regard you as interfering (unsolicited advice to their daughter) and perceived innuendo about the paternity of one of their children

Your sister is NBU

I accept that taking them to the drive through was thoughtless in the context of them getting their dinner.

That's why I say that he has used this an ammunition to keep me away.

Taking your nieces and nephew for a drive through as a treat although I was in the wrong to do so and it was clearly insensitive is hardly grounds to tell me I'm not allowed at their house.

The comment about the paternity was said at least 4 years ago. It has nothing to do with the current fall out with them separating and reconciling.

It is simply a red herring for him to use to try and make his case against me. Even though he remained friendly with me up until February when they split up.

1. You can’t just randomly decide to take your DN for dinner. These things need to be planned with their parents. You did massively overstep there.

1. If he’s so controlling why does he want your mum around and staying over? I don’t buy that he’s as controlliing as you’re making him out to be.

1. Not going out for more than 3 days when you’ve been pregnant or with young kids for the last 10 years is pretty standard and normal. As is calling your partner / kids when you are away for the night.

@Bluntness100

This will also inadvertently let your family know never to help her out as this will be the consequence

I’m not sure that telling her husband who she has five kids with that biologically one in five kids doesn’t belong to the known dad is particularly helpful, nor is telling the child to tell her parents it’s between them. Even if it was correct it would not Appear helpful I think.

So I’m not sure the rest of the family would consider the op to have been helping her out really.

I disagree with both points. It’s sound advice to tell a 13 year old to stay out of her parents arguing.

And the 1 in 5 kids - is nonsense. Most people would have laughed it off

I am sorry that you became upset as you had misconstrued something I said.

I am sorry that I gave your daughter advice when she was distraught at the manner in which her parents were communicating during their seperation and that you took offence to that.

Apologise but without apologising.

Not going out for more than 3 days when you’ve been pregnant or with young kids for the last 10 years is pretty standard and normal. As is calling your partner / kids when you are away for the night

No it isn’t. It might be in your home but not in many others. I go on holiday every year for three nights with my girlfriends (all mothers) we also have regular nights out/school functions/day trips.

It’s sound advice to tell a 13 year old to stay out of her parents arguing

Sure, no one would disagree with you. It’s fairly irrelevant though because that’s not what she did is it? The point is she told her that if her parents spoke to her about their split she was to respond that’s none of my business.

My sister will regularly arrive over at my house with breakfast for my daughter.

I don't give out about it, we are a fairly relaxed family about these things.

I mean I could tell you that when my sister didn't ring him until we got in at 2 am on my hen night that he called her every name under the sun, had her in tears telling her what a dirty slut and tramp she was and that he wanted nothing more to do with her.

I could also tell you that the night she stayed out in the hotel, he lost his shit in front of my mum who was staying in the house with him, ruined my sisters night out and similarly had her in tears.

I know that people with young children rarely go out but if there partner makes it so if when they do they fail some perceived test of checking in at a non defined time, they are automatically accused of cheating and their life is made hell then they are of course much less likely to go out in those circumstances.

That's how he is controlling, my sister who is one of the most gregarious people you could ever met now spend t have a single friend left in her life. I'm the only friend that she has left along with my Mum.

2. If he’s so controlling why does he want your mum around and staying over? I don’t buy that he’s as controlliing as you’re making him out to be

Because he doesn’t want to look after the kids by himself.

1. You can’t just randomly decide to take your DN for dinner. These things need to be planned with their parents. You did massively overstep there

Really isn’t the crime of the century unless your a control freak

go on holiday every year for three nights with my girlfriends (all mothers) we also have regular nights out/school functions/day trips

Do you have five kids? I think for many people with five kids, it would be fairly normal not to have many individual social nights out. And I’d argue it is normal to call your partner or text at least once when out.

@mamascorpio

My sister will regularly arrive over at my house with breakfast for my daughter.

I don't give out about it, we are a fairly relaxed family about these things.

I mean I could tell you that when my sister didn't ring him until we got in at 2 am on my hen night that he called her every name under the sun, had her in tears telling her what a dirty slut and tramp she was and that he wanted nothing more to do with her.

I could also tell you that the night she stayed out in the hotel, he lost his shit in front of my mum who was staying in the house with him, ruined my sisters night out and similarly had her in tears.

I know that people with young children rarely go out but if there partner makes it so if when they do they fail some perceived test of checking in at a non defined time, they are automatically accused of cheating and their life is made hell then they are of course much less likely to go out in those circumstances.

That's how he is controlling, my sister who is one of the most gregarious people you could ever met now spend t have a single friend left in her life. I'm the only friend that she has left along with my Mum.

Your mum is probably keeping things civil so she has access to inside her house to keep an eye on things.

Step back from him and her. It will come right again.

It sounds very much like you’ve been trying to cause trouble by questioning the paternity of their child. Don’t say this wasn’t what you intended to do, because I don’t believe that. I think your interfering has backfired spectacularly on you. If you want to salvage a relationship with your sister then you should apologise.

Honestly, OP, I’ve been reading through your posts and can’t shake the feeling that you’re also controlling with your sister. The fact that you ‘tell’ her what you’re doing with the children, rather than ask, then feed them while your out, even though your sister was making them dinner. He sounds like a controlling fucker, but I suspect your sister finds you to be controlling of her too.

I don't give out about it, we are a fairly relaxed family about these things

Well clearly you’re relaxed they aren’t. Op how long ago was your hen night, it seems it was years ago but you’re still going on about her staying out late and him being pissed she didn’t call.

He likely is controlling but I don’t think you’re innocent here either, and I would imagine your interactions have caused arguments at home, the five kids thing, the ill advised advice to the daughter, the taking the kids for dinner as the parents were close to serving.

She’s made her decision, as said, either accept it and that you’re out, or apologise and try not to do stuff that’s going to cause her additional arguments.

He sounds awful- no excuse for his behaviour but I can't get past that awful and thoughtless 1 in 5 comment or taking the DC to the drive through when they were about to have dinner. You sound very thoughtless.
Does your sister actually want to meet up and go on nights out or is that your expectation of what she should be doing ?
You sound like very different people with different values.

@Bluntness100

go on holiday every year for three nights with my girlfriends (all mothers) we also have regular nights out/school functions/day trips

Do you have five kids? I think for many people with five kids, it would be fairly normal not to have many individual social nights out. And I’d argue it is normal to call your partner or text at least once when out.

I don’t personally but one of the group have six. Women do manage to escape the house if their husbands are not twats and actually parent. But I was actually a responding to another poster that said this is normal if you’ve had kids. It’s not.

Also when either I or dh go out we don’t message. Why do we need to ‘check’ in? We’re adults. If something was wrong we’d let each other know

You have read the up dates of what he actually said to her on the phone? Do you honestly think that merits what he called her?

It is controlling and abusive of you call your wife a slut or tramp because she was having a good time and didn’t ring him

Google coercive control and contact paladin for support.
He's abusing her

He sounds toxic and dangerous and you have my sympathy.

You sound nice but a bit your way or the high way.

I feel for your sister most.

I accept that me taking the children out close to dinner was thoughtless. But I don't think the appropriate response is to say don't come back to our house.

The conversation about 1 in 5 was years ago, it was literally years later than I was told he raised a problem
With it. I mean if I said that 1 in 3 women were victims of domestic violence would I also have been accusing him of beating her up.

It was a conversation in the context of my work and was relevant to a conversation that we were having. I didn't just randomly sit down and say did you know this. I never occurred to me that he would think I was trying to suggest that one of his children isn't his. It would be a pretty ignorant and stupid thing to do if there was any question of it and I'm not the type of person who goes round trying to plant seeds of doubt into the minds of the intimate relationships of my family members.

@Alexandernevermind

Agree with everyone else, she is being controlled. Just be there for your sister if she needs you, she will one day. "I spoke to their Eldest daughter during the separation and advised that if either mum or Dad tried to talk to them about what was going on just to say it was none of her business. Both of them were using eldest daughter 13 as a means of communicating what had gone wrong." He had a point about his daughter though, even though you meant it for her benefit, if anyone outside my home said what you did I would have been livid.

as a teenager my parents constantly used me to communicate their perspectives on their separation. They piled private adult information on me that no child needs to know about their parents, particularly in the middle of an acrimonious split when suddenly nothing is solid any longer.

They put me in a shitty, toxic position and I didn't know I was allowed to say - wouldn't even have found the words to express - that it was none of my business thanks very much. Props to the OP for showing her niece that's an option.

If you don't get on with your BIL and he has five kids and you tell him that one in five kids are illegitimate, then I can absolutely see why he took offence.