To think it's ironic about Niqab and face coverings

[IsntItIronicDontYouThink]

Just thought about this and how ironically, face coverings have become mandatory on public transports and it makes me think of Muslim women (Niqab wearing women specifically) who've had a hard time because of their face coverings to now find that everyone has to cover their faces (for different reasons yes but still ironic, isn't it?)

Googled to see if anyone else mentions this. Here's a piece I found about it (There's more but just picked this one).

www.google.com/amp/s/metro.co.uk/2020/06/12/face-mask-compulsory-muslim-women-12838585/amp/

OP how are people missing the point? Your title and post was about the irony and comparing niqab to face masks. What point are we missing exactly?

In all my years of living as a Muslim woman with a huge extended family (lots of women) and social network that spans both Muslim and non-Muslim women (and men!), I have never met nor heard of any Muslim woman who is wearing a head or face covering, against her will or choice.

Do you think every single woman in Iran, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, to name a few, will agree with you?

You are lucky you can have a choice. Many don't.

It's like equating circumcision for medical necessity with circumcision because an ancient book/the voices are telling you to hack bits off babies' cocks.

@ChardonnaysPetDragon

In all my years of living as a Muslim woman with a huge extended family (lots of women) and social network that spans both Muslim and non-Muslim women (and men!), I have never met nor heard of any Muslim woman who is wearing a head or face covering, against her will or choice.

Do you think every single woman in Iran, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, to name a few, will agree with you?

You are lucky you can have a choice. Many don't.

@ChardonnaysPetDragon I'm sorry, do you live in one of those countries? Do you have a wide reaching Muslim community in one of those places who can all back up what you've just said? Are you a Muslim woman who has been forced to wear a niqab? Or are you making assumptions based on a Daily Mail headline?

You're right. My choice is a privilege which is why I will defend the choice any woman's right to wear a bikini or a burkini on the beach.

@KitKatKit

In all my years of living as a Muslim woman with a huge extended family (lots of women) and social network that spans both Muslim and non-Muslim women (and men!), I have never met nor heard of any Muslim woman who is wearing a head or face covering, against her will or choice. I don't wear a face or had covering, and guess what, nobody has ever questioned my reasoning for it!

The ignorance of some posters on this thread is embarrassing. Go and educate yourselves, speak to some women who choose to wear the niqab and then formulate an opinion. Until then, don't police what women choose or don't choose to wear.

Have you met any women who have chosen not to wear a head or face covering being treated negativity due to their choice?

no I'm not. I'm saying that some people see only what they want to see.

The problem is, your point doesn’t seem to be clear to a number of people on this thread, which is perhaps due to your assertion of an ‘irony’ where there seemingly isn’t one.

What do you mean by “I'm saying that some people see only what they want to see”?

I find no basis for comparison between a religious required for one sex and a health requirement for both sexes. What am I not ‘seeing’?

And clearly it's clear to others. So some choose to see it, others choose not to. 🤷🏻‍♀️

You're intentionally ignoring many of the common complaints leveled against people that wear niqabs

@ChardonnaysPetDragon I'm sorry, do you live in one of those countries? Do you have a wide reaching Muslim community in one of those places who can all back up what you've just said? Are you a Muslim woman who has been forced to wear a niqab?
Or are you making assumptions based on a Daily Mail headline?

No I don't live there, but women's right there, or rather the lack of women' s there is widely covered, not only by the Daily Mail. Are you saying every woman everywhere is free to wear what she likes, women in Iran, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan included?

Yeah, right.

Are you saying every woman everywhere else in the world does?

@WorriedAboutMom

As a Muslim woman, nope no 'man' told me to cover neither will I be killed if I don't 🙄. The only people who think they have a right to tell me how to dress are non Muslims (ironically). I don't wear niqab but my mum did (actually my dad tried to discourage her but she's very headstrong) and the amount of abuse she recieved from white men (it was always men) was disgusting. I probably cover the exact amount of hair a wooly hat would cover yet I'm oppressed. I guess you probably think that nuns have been forced to cover too oh wait, it's ok coz they're not Muslim. Yet another Muslim bashing thread on Mumsnet I have to hide 🙄 .

You are a Muslim woman in the U.K. so your experience is very different from the vast majority of Muslim women who live in Muslim majority countries. It’s not Muslim bashing to state fact. Just ask the women imprisoned in Iran for taking off the niqab in public or posting photographs of themselves without one.

And clearly it's clear to others. So some choose to see it, others choose not to.

Well, that’s cleared that up, then.

Apparently it did for you when you thought mentioning those to whom it wasn't clear was some sort of proof that there's no irony.

So yes that clears it up for me as well that it is clear to some.

I don't understand how people are missing the point??

OF COURSE they're for different reasons but the issue a lot of people have with women wearing niqabs on public transport is not ever a concern for the oppressive religion... so yes it is fucking ironic.

@Freddiefox No, I have not come across any women who have been treated negatively from not covering their heads/faces, because in Islam, your modesty is your choice.
What you choose to wear or not wear is between you and God not you and your husband/father/male relative.

@ChardonnaysPetDragon - Let me ask you this - Is every woman in the UK free to wear what she likes? Because your comments and this thread is evidence that the answer is, in your own sarcastic words, 'Yeah, right' !

Women who do wear the niqab have come onto this thread to share their experiences and still people are harping on about the niqab being oppressive.

Here's an idea. Listen to the women who are right here, speaking from their real lived experiences and LEARN FROM THEM.

@worriedaboutmom completely agree. Can't believe @mumsnethq is allowing such a shitty amount of comments bashing Muslims here

Ok. You’re speaking in riddles now.

Thanks for your thread. It’s been ... ironic.

Enjoy the rest of your day.

Women who do wear the niqab have come onto this thread to share their experiences and still people are harping on about the niqab being oppressive.

You come here to speak for an experience in a country where you a free to choose what to wear.

Millions of women't don't have that privilege. Maybe you should educate yourself?

If you speak to the youngsters, many of them cannot wait to hit the age where they start wearing the shayla / hijab and abaya. Just like their mums and sisters. They feel protected, happy and free, the flowing abaya is cool.

Protected from what? Men and their sexual harrassment? Why should women modify their behaviour to prevent this?

Yes buh-bye.

Oh and, for every single poster who is so concerned about the rights of Muslim women in those oppressive Middle Eastern countries, what are you doing about it?

How are you using your power, your privilege, your voice, to help them?

You're not. You do not care about the rights of women of colour, that much is apparent. Any faux concern and outrage about women being 'forced' to wear the niqab is a fallacy.

If you speak to the youngsters, many of them cannot wait to hit the age where they start wearing the shayla / hijab and abaya. Just like their mums and sisters. They feel protected, happy and free, the flowing abaya is cool.

And that is the success of brainwashing

Go to Amnesty International to read about Iranian Muslim women and their being forced to wear hijabs, either through head scarves or the niqab which covers the face as well as hair:

www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2019/03/iran-pro-government-vigilantes-attack-women-for-standing-up-against-forced-hijab-laws/

Usual sentence is 2yrs in prison. A female lawyer who defended many women in court has also been sentenced to 38 yrs in prison and over 100 lashes of the whip.

Also, here
“Today it was reported that a Saudi women who posted a picture of herself on social media in public without wearing a hijab faced outrage on social media, including calls for her execution. One man memorably declared: “Kill her and throw her corpse to the dogs.””
www.independent.co.uk/voices/saudi-woman-no-hijab-beheading-killing-social-media-isis-womens-rights-human-rights-council-uk-a7452636.html

A Canadian Muslim girl, Aqsa, only 16 was murdered in 2007 by her own father for refusing to wear a hijab
www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/muhammad-parvez-killer-daughter-hijab-clash-1.4002891

Anyone who says they’ve “never heard of any muslim woman being forced to wear anything or imprisined/killed for not wearing anything” is either lying or incredibly sheltered.

@ChardonnaysPetDragon

Women who do wear the niqab have come onto this thread to share their experiences and still people are harping on about the niqab being oppressive.

You come here to speak for an experience in a country where you a free to choose what to wear.

Millions of women't don't have that privilege. Maybe you should educate yourself?

@ChardonnaysPetDragon Did you really just try and whitesplain the treatment of Muslim women, to a Muslim woman of colour with actual lived experience?!?!?!

I despair at the state of the world. Stay in your lane Chardonnay.

KitKatKit

PP is right though, if you've never spoken to a Muslim woman that has been treated badly because they refuse to wear a covering, then you SHOULD educate yourself. Refer to PP above and the punishements carried out