Are women allowed to be offended by Drag/ women face now then?

[Chosennone]

Things are changing. Strange times. Midst Pandemic. Horrific events in the USA. people are 'waking' up to oppression and inappropriateness within comedy.
If it is no longer seen as acceptable to wear any kind of black costume, seen in LB, LOG, Ant & Dec, surely it is time that a sensible debate could be had on Drag. Is it acceptable? Is it not a mockery of female features for comedy in the same way original blackface was?
If not, why not?

And sometimes on the Black and White Minstrel Show they just blacked up and sang songs while dancing. Doesn’t make blackface ok. Not is womanface ok.

MonsteraCheeseplant oh I didn't deny its not mainstream? I was just speaking for myself and saying I have never experiences that sort of disgusting behaviour in the frag I've seen and do see.

*drag

All the things I mentioned have actually happened, @Notimeforaname - there are links up thread to two child drag acts, lists of names including the one I gave, the ‘fishy’ reference was, as a pp has said, on Big Fat Quiz of the Year, and another previous poster witnessed a drag act joking about the smell of minge in the room, and about domestic violence.

How can any of these be acceptable? And why wouldn’t women object to them?

@SaraLundsHairyJumper
Can you explain why the question is racist and homophobic? Without olympic standard mental gymnastics. Please?

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius those things u mentioned are not acceptable. I said you were completely right to be outraged and offended by that. Anybody who says or does such horrible things is a bad person. I was just saying I have personally never seen or heard such things in the drag my friends do and the drag shows I go to.

NoTime
I was involved with a Brighton Fringe event a couple of years back.
The misogyny of 90% of the drag acts was deeply unpleasant.
(as per their own promo / leafleting / actions)

And if others are offended and outraged by drag artists simply lip syncing, that's their opinion and are completely entitled to it, I respect that. Drag doesn't bother me... The drag I see .... But I would never agree with any human saying those nasty things that others have seen and heard.

ListeningQuietly that's awful. I would never support anybody who did such nasty things.

When Daniel Radcliffe informs us that we can be offended by drag I shall be

But until then I simply don’t know

Sorry, @Notimeforaname - I missed that post - stupid me.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius no problem. There are horrible disgusting people everywhere in the world...that's for sure. Nobody should ever joke about domestic violence or abortion etc... No matter who they are.

God I love Mumsnet and this thread.

Excellent thread and to see so many woman challenging drag. Recommend this great comment from page 1 by GrabtharsHammerWhatASavings :

Have you noticed the trend yet of justifying things that offend and harm women by positioning them as vital to the rights of another disadvantaged group? We aren't allowed to be offended by "Karen" because apparently its an anti racist term (in imaginary land), you can't be offended by drag or surrogacy because that's homophobic, you can't want your own spaces, rights, or language because that's anti trans, you can't be anti pornography because that kink shaming, you can't be against prostitution because then how will disabled men have sex? Even our reproductive rights re currently being painted as ableist. Women, does this male behaviour offend or harm you? Too bad. We've just hitched it to another more popular groups rights (hint: every group is more popular than women) and positioned it as integral to their dignity and freedom. Now you can't complain without looking like a bigot. It's classic heads we win, tails you lose

Transwomen
demand to be treated as women
because they live like that
= leaky boobs
= unexpectedly early periods
= torn perineum
= adorable but incessant children
go for it

If I identify as a man would I immediately get a 17% pay rise?

I could name at least 20 drag artist I know personally.... Never once, not one single time has anything you've said in your post, come up. I don't know who's doing that stuff but I've never experienced it.

Lucky you. Misogynistic language is an integral part of every drag act I’ve ever known or witnessed, from 90s Old Compton St to present day Canal St to Ru Paul’s televised Drag Race.

‘Fishy’ and ‘Hunty’ being two obvious examples.

I find men dressed up in drag a bit scary. Not my kind of people at all.

truthisarevolutionaryact that's so true and really important. Needs saying. But in order to sleep at night (no exaggeration, I'm a light sleeper) I need to believe that it's only a small but vocal part of the population who believe those things. I almost wish I didn't see it. I find it hard to know how we'll ever fight back.

I hate drag too.
I could never understand why men dressing up as women seemed to hate women so much?
I just didn't make sense to be.
I guess the same reason Transwomen hate women?
Jealousy & contempt in equal measure with a huge pour of fetishism.

I have been arguing that drag acts are offensive to women for years. When little Britain came out and Walliams was a national treasure, i couldn’t believe what they were getting away with. I was shouted down by lefties and tories alike saying it was parody humour. The drag race thing is so offensive too. That’ll all be a can of worms for the bbc wont it?

Also, ‘cards against humanity’ which my friends think is hilarious. I hate that game, it’s so offensive. In a few years that’ll be in the firing line hopefully.

I hate woman-face. Disgusting, mindless misogynistic stereotypes that enforce the idea of woman as a performance of external appearances and superficial, weaponised sexualty.
I'd never send my kids to a panto. A woman in drag would likely terrify or at best bore them. The jokes they make are vile and at best not even funny to a child.

Drag is utter puerile childish shit. Reminds me of a little boy dressing up in his mum's clothes and going oooh look at me I got boobies. It's just crap and the only reason it's accepted is because men want to do it.

ProfessorSillyStuff panto has moved on. I was of your opinion but thankfully it has changed, at least the one in our area has.

I remember watching panto as a child and getting confused why the Prince was actually a girl, and why on earth was being a bit fat with big boobs just soooo hilarious. Ie the dame. Grim.

Being racist never stopped any debate about drag or womanface. Don't conflate the 2 just because you really wanted to talk about blackface. You've got to be really dense if you compare a bloke in makeup to a person born with black skin. It doesn't rub off you know