Family row scheduled for this afternoon - help me prepare myself

[Oakmaiden]

This is not the way I would prefer to deal with this, but unfortunately my husband scheduled a family row (aka "We will discuss this tomorrow") with my teenage daughter. I need help to work out what we hope to achieve and what is reasonable to expect. Please.

The background: I am trying to keep this as brief as possible. DD is 16 and is currently (was, before everything shut down) being assessed for Autism. She also suffers from sometimes very bad depression and very high levels of anxiety. She is very bright (was hoping for straight A's for GCSEs, but with all that is going on, who can tell...) but her passion has always been for performing - she normally spends around 20 hours a week on top of her school week dancing/acting/singing etc.

Lockdown obviously changed her life dramatically. As well as an abrupt end to her schooling and the cancellation of several performances she had been working hard toward, her "extra curricula" life changed. Her dance, drama and singing lessons all went on line, so she could have continued them as normal, but she finds the online format very difficult, and says that she no longer feel as though she is being taught and corrected, merely given activities to do. She has stopped singing and drama completely, and goes to maybe 3 or 4 dance classes a week. At most. The rest of the time - she plays on the computer or sleeps.

And this is the source of most of the conflict - she plays a game with people in the States, so goes to bed at about 4am and gets up early afternoon. Yesterday we didn't see her until 6pm. She hasn't been outside since the week before lockdown (she was isolating the week before as she had mumps) except occasionally in the garden. Her contribution to the household is to cook one meal a week and wash up once a week (these are her official "tasks") which I don't think is very much, but she thinks is hugely unreasonable. Yesterday it was her turn to cook, and she decided to make macaroni cheese (which my husband can't eat as cooked cheese makes him ill) and refused to heat up a jar of ready made sauce alongside it for her father so he could eat.

And EVERYTHING we say to her she has a comeback for.

I want her to live more "UK centric" and sociable hours, to become more involved in preparing for her future and to help out a bit more. To lead a more normal life. She says she can't see what difference it makes to us, and we should leave her to do what makes her happy. DH wants to confiscate her computer.

Am I being unreasonable to want to make changes (I am willing to compromise, and in honesty her happiness IS very important to me) or should we just leave her to get on with it.

I am a very good cook. I love cooking, I love eating.

I cannot stand the last 15 minutes or so of making a meal because I get completely overwhelmed with everything that needs doing and ensuring that it all comes together exactly as I want it to. I have to work very, very hard every time at not getting hugely stressed. If someone were to demand that I add an extra step to my plan right at the last minute, I would find that very difficult.

(Extremely high functioning, very intelligent, very likely to be on the spectrum, never diagnosed)

I don’t think it was spiteful at all. I think it was stress.

I don't know what advice to give you, but I could have written exactly this about my sister when she left school and lost her routine. I'm sorry to say that it was the start of a downward spiral and she has had an awful life since.

So please take this seriously, don't think of it as just a discipline problem. Consider her point of view too. And I really wouldn't recommend taking away her computer at all, even though you need to set some boundaries somehow.

I don't know the solution, but please consider getting medical help and or counselling.frabkly I think you need to give it more thought than just 24 hours.

Why not suggest to your DH that you 'meet/discuss' with DD alone? It almost sounds as though the tipping point for him was that she didn't heat a jar of pasta sauce for him. If that's the case, then he is too emotionally involved to get a good outcome for everyone from talking to DD.

She is 16
I would cut her some slack
1 of mine is staying up most of the night,I leave him to it
They have to learn to self regulate otherwise how will they cope with Uni/ work

@Floatyboat Why can't he eat cooked cheese. I have to be careful with cheese as it can trigger a migraine, cooked cheese is worse. I like it but can't eat it unless I'm prepared for the days of pain to follow. I'd love some cauliflower cheese.

@Soubriquet vampire freaks! That brings back memories!

When I was 16 I went to bed at about 3am after aimless hours on the internet (On a dial up connection!) and, unless I had college the next day, got up at 4pm in time for my shift at 6pm!

I think I turned out okay...

she has to come up with something everyone can eat

She usually makes spaghetti Bolognaise or chicken fajitas.

@Oakmaiden

I think there are a few issues at play. How you view conflict - preparing for 'family row scheduled'

I am rubbish at conflict. It scares me and I get upset, even quite mild disagreements. And I am afraid of upsetting dd a lot of the time, as her mood has been SO low and I am scared of what she will do. And she gets upset so easily, too.

I suffer from mh issues too.

All in all it makes me very far from a perfect parent as far as discipline is concerned.

It must be so hard when you have your own issues too 🌷

She needs to be loved & understood, not disciplined! So you're just perfect for the job!

It's not unhealthy to sleep & function on a different timetable. We are conditioned to think being up early is virtuous and sleeping in the day is not.

Try not to stress about dealing with this. Try to talk to DH before you both talk to DD, you need to Be on the same page.

& that's NOT 'discipline & removal of her computer!'

Well, I do think that ASD childen need some structure, but I get the happiness point too. How about a compromise that she has to do her chores properly from monday-friday. Computer off at midnight (but wednesdays at 1 AM) and the weekend is free play? Or some kind of schedule like that?

Your DH needs to give his head a wobble. Music and Drama ARE academic A-levels. There's no such thing as a 'non-academic A-level'. I did Music as well as History, Economics, Maths & Stats. Music was by far the most challenging of the four.

Dissing her A-level choices in this way can't be helpful. Of course she knows his opinion. .

At the very least someone who goes suddenly from a lot of physical activity to none at all, must be feeling rotten.

Your DH sounds quite rigid and completely unable to put himself in your daughters place at all. Is he also on the spectrum? Quite likely, I’d imagine...

Is DH autistic?

She’s walking all over you. I would remove the computer from her room, or remove her access to it until she’s towing the line. She should be doing jobs in the house on a daily basis I’m not talking about loads, but washing up, emptying dishwasher, tidying her room, hanging washing out, that kind of thing.
I wouldn’t let the fact that she has autism have any bearing on her responsibility to take part in family life and the little jobs that this entails.
As for the America thing, do you know who she is speaking to. It could be anybody with all kinds of dodgy intentions. If she’s refusing to come off the computer then disconnect the internet. She’s taking the piss and you’re letting her.
It might do her anxiety good to keep her busy doing other things.
You need to give her room and time to speak tonight to give her a voice, but at the end of the day you need to tell her what you expect from her and what is acceptable within the house. I would let her speak first. Asking her what she thinks and how does she feel about your points will help her feel listened to. I would also have in mind what points you’re willing to compromise on and how far you willing to compromise on those point. We always found with our teenagers it was really great to have meetings because they felt that we were interested in what they had to say. It’s also a good chance to praise her for what she has done well, and tell her how proud you are of what she has dealt with well. Good luck.

I think it is such a balance with children who may be asd (my dd9 awaiting assessment) between allowing them to do the things which bring comfort and enjoyment Vs 'spoiling' them. As others have said I think taking away the computer would be inflammatory and have the opposite effect to what you might hope.

Maybe time to adjust down some chores to give her space to not go 'wrong' eg I never made dinner for my parents until I had left home. But would help eg get things out of freezer, get something started when they were on their way home, help with chopping/peeling. Then you can build on that through praise for the positive contributions rather than punishment for the poor performance when she did give it a go. Can make it fun eg recipe planning together.

Then agree some timings eg if 5hr gaming was permitted what is the time she most wants to be online? 5-10pm or 10pm-3am for example. In a few years she will need to set her own schedule, and find the routine that works for her, and this is something even NT students struggle with in first year of uni!

But generally don't underestimate the stress of lockdown. If this is relatively new behaviours then suggests she is trying to escape from current reality? Treat this as you would any other crisis in mental health, traditional rules of childhood behaviour management don't always have to apply.

Better routine needed op

i write as someone who has explored their own autistic traits and identifies as Aspie.
I can see where i was let down by my caregivers when it came to learning responsibility and boundaries as a teen.....and i see you doing the same.

I had to learn the hard way to 'function' despite the challenges.....your dd has two parents who love her and genuinely want to help her - they're just clueless and don't realise they're creating a rod for their own and her back by acting like friends instead of parents.

@Setsoma

I don't know what advice to give you, but I could have written exactly this about my sister when she left school and lost her routine. I'm sorry to say that it was the start of a downward spiral and she has had an awful life since.

I'm sorry about your sister, but we're in a pandemic so I think this is different. This cohort have had their GCSEs/Proms/routines/boyfriends and girlfriends all taken away from them ..... all of the ones I know are up all night.

Hi OP,

I also have a girl with asd (although she’s only 4! Not sure I’m excited for the teens just yet) she is also a bright little thing who has struggled terribly with the lockdown. Her need for control has been a real challenge and she has been really dysregulated. Traditional style hierarchical parenting does not work with her at all. Please don’t confiscate her computer, it sounds like she is also going through a very tough time at the moment. There is a way to set loving boundaries around the computer time in partnership with her. It sounds like you are attuned to your daughter and you could encourage your other half to look at things a little differently?

@Oakmaiden She usually makes spaghetti Bolognaise or chicken fajitas. That sounds good, so this time she got it wrong and probably got flustered. Not the end of the world but if she just checked with you at the start, "Is macaroni cheese OK today." You could say fine just heat some sauce for dad or maybe do spaghetti bolognaise as we can all eat that. Simple.

My teenager is sleeping until midday. Up late, it’s fine. He works hard when school is on, he’s the same age between GCSE- A level. He can’t go out with friends safely. Rather him at home than out in the gangs of teens I’ve seen not socially distancing

My GS is a year younger, he's struggling with all the fun stuff gone and lots of work from school, I think the school need to ease off a bit. I know people say some schools are doing nothing but his is doing alot and I think he is feeling overwhelmed. It really isn't easy at the moment.

So I would like her to:

1. Spend some time outside every day (cycling with her brother or walking)
2. Keep up with her dance and singing - maybe I could phone her teachers and try to organise one to one lessons for dance, and talk about restarting singing as soon as practical (apparently it doesn't work on Zoom because of the time lag).

3.Do her (modest) chores without complaint.

1. Shower regularly.
2. Get up by lunchtime (ready to eat at 1pm?)
3. Spend some time taking part in activities with the rest of the family.

Does that sound reasonable?

Darbs76 that is so true.

Is DH autistic?

Um. No comment...

The thing that hit me was the dance lessons. If you can get more of those going I think a lot will be better. Have you viewed these online lessons? Is it true that there’s no correcting going on? If so, maybe find somewhere else online for the moment or speak to the school.

I say this because DD teaches at a dance school and it’s all online at the moment. At the start she thought it was going to be very difficult. But it’s getting better and better as they all adjust. She says many students have made more progress in this term than they usually do, particularly the high end. Part of this is because they can’t copy and have to think for themselves, so she’s correcting absolutely what each individual needs, and not what they’re picking up from the others. They’re also learning to work round the difficulties of space, so lots of techniques which might only get a few minutes are being really focussed on. She says those who wouldn’t give it a go and haven’t been doing it are massively missing out.

I would watch a few lessons and pursue it with the dance school if no proper tuition is going on. It’s perfectly possible to do it well. If your daughter really cannot handle the online format that’s harder, but might it be easier as she does it more?