Family row scheduled for this afternoon - help me prepare myself

[Oakmaiden]

This is not the way I would prefer to deal with this, but unfortunately my husband scheduled a family row (aka "We will discuss this tomorrow") with my teenage daughter. I need help to work out what we hope to achieve and what is reasonable to expect. Please.

The background: I am trying to keep this as brief as possible. DD is 16 and is currently (was, before everything shut down) being assessed for Autism. She also suffers from sometimes very bad depression and very high levels of anxiety. She is very bright (was hoping for straight A's for GCSEs, but with all that is going on, who can tell...) but her passion has always been for performing - she normally spends around 20 hours a week on top of her school week dancing/acting/singing etc.

Lockdown obviously changed her life dramatically. As well as an abrupt end to her schooling and the cancellation of several performances she had been working hard toward, her "extra curricula" life changed. Her dance, drama and singing lessons all went on line, so she could have continued them as normal, but she finds the online format very difficult, and says that she no longer feel as though she is being taught and corrected, merely given activities to do. She has stopped singing and drama completely, and goes to maybe 3 or 4 dance classes a week. At most. The rest of the time - she plays on the computer or sleeps.

And this is the source of most of the conflict - she plays a game with people in the States, so goes to bed at about 4am and gets up early afternoon. Yesterday we didn't see her until 6pm. She hasn't been outside since the week before lockdown (she was isolating the week before as she had mumps) except occasionally in the garden. Her contribution to the household is to cook one meal a week and wash up once a week (these are her official "tasks") which I don't think is very much, but she thinks is hugely unreasonable. Yesterday it was her turn to cook, and she decided to make macaroni cheese (which my husband can't eat as cooked cheese makes him ill) and refused to heat up a jar of ready made sauce alongside it for her father so he could eat.

And EVERYTHING we say to her she has a comeback for.

I want her to live more "UK centric" and sociable hours, to become more involved in preparing for her future and to help out a bit more. To lead a more normal life. She says she can't see what difference it makes to us, and we should leave her to do what makes her happy. DH wants to confiscate her computer.

Am I being unreasonable to want to make changes (I am willing to compromise, and in honesty her happiness IS very important to me) or should we just leave her to get on with it.

[Dotty1970]

Your are describing my 16 year old let us know how you go on.
Good luck🤞 , usually we get agreement and the right words but literally no changes 🤔

[Dotty1970]

Oh dear sorry, I am way too late and I get annoyed at people not reading the full thread and coming in with repetitive and silly answers... That will be me then

[steppemum]

She masks extremely well, and has all sorts of clever strategies to help herself cope. But secondary school (and it was a huge jump from her lovely, small class, nurturing primary to a huge state secondary) pretty much undid her. It has been very hard.

This is very similar my DD1's experience. We had no idea she was autistic until CAMHS told me when she was 12. High school nearly destroyed her and I promise you that is no exaggeration.

Can I just say thank you to both of you who posted these comments? They are veyr helpful to me and make me more convinced I need to pursue this.

Dd2 is 12 and just started secondary school. She has really struggled. Very bright and appears to be sociable, but when you look closely she isn't sociable with her peers, but with adults and older kids, as she finds the social aspect of school hard. There have been many quirks over the years (your picture of her lined up beany boos made me smile as dd used to do that with sylvanians) but nothing concrete enough to pursue. Just before lockdown we had a conversation with school which means we are now pursuing a diagnosis for ASD.

One or two websites listed the differences between girls and boys, and it was eye opening. It was also frustrating that when you then go to the self assessment type pages, they are all for boys. One specific example was that autstic children don't do imaginative play. Except that girls do. They just do it very differently to NT girls.

[Blondebakingmumma]

Congratulations, that sounds like a lovely compromise for all! I hope the new and improved routine works well

[Nearlyalmost50]

Your pasta jar is tongue in cheek but fun at the same time, I think that's an excellent way to parent. I have been rewarding one of mine in lockdown for exercising, just a little incentive to keep going. That's not babyish, everyone loves a reward (I bribe myself to write!)

[planningaheadtoday]

ASD parent here. Similar issues with unsocial computer times.

I set firm boundaries for term time.

I'd let her have computer access for x amount of nights on condition that she is able to function during the week. This includes making supper for the whole family with care. Bringing down dirty cups and plates, putting her laundry in the basket and putting away clean clothes.

On the nights she doesn't have all night access turn the internet off. If this doesn't work, take the router to bed.

Then she gets to spend time with friends which is important, but it doesn't overshadow your life or school work in the UK.

We use the google Wifi mesh system and can isolate individual IP addresses. So at the agreed time xy&z turn off. Usually the PS4, TV, and computer. Only administrators can adjust settings so no chance of clever children tweaking the system to allow extra time.

This has been my life saver. Because although she'll try to persuade me during the day, When I'm in bed and it all automatically turns off, she can't argue, it's off and we are asleep.

[Creamcar]

I'm cutting my exam age child a lot of slack re computer time, but I would draw the line at those hours. Mine gets up by about 12 and I think that's ok in times such as these. He is expected to do the dishwasher in rotation with his siblings, and cook when I ask him to (rarely) as well as pop up to the shops occasionally, mend bikes and replace lightbulbs. Then I leave him alone to game to his heart's content. But he is pleasant and non-confrontational. Sorry that's not much help.

[Phineyj]

I have found this thread very helpful, OP. My 7yo DD has these traits (she's not mature enough for a pasta jar approach) but it's been a great insight into what struggles we may have later. I also have a probably ASD DH.

[steppemum]

We use the google Wifi mesh system and can isolate individual IP addresses. So at the agreed time xy&z turn off. Usually the PS4, TV, and computer. Only administrators can adjust settings so no chance of clever children tweaking the system to allow extra time.

well, ds aged 16, hacked into this, then changed the IP addresses on all the machines he wanted to watch to new ones which weren't set to turn off.

This was successful for months, until one night I was woken up by him playing on-line on a school night at 3 am and it took dh all morning to work out what he had done!
The difficulties of a veyr computer savy child!
(needless to say, we took the router to bed after that)

[Jeremyironsnothing]

I think you've handed it well. Some humour - the pasta jar, which also acts as a small inventive, some boundaries and some compromise.

Good luck.

[differentnameforthis]

@Oakmaiden

Someone asked why dd is only just now being assessed, while the boys have been diagnosed.

Because they are very different?

The eldest is now 22 and was diagnosed first (and at a very young age) with ADHD and then shortly afterwards with Asperger Syndrome and Tourettes.

DS2 is 15 and it was always very obvious that he had definite traits.

DD always just seemed a bit... precocious. But never any trouble at school or at home until she hit secondary school. Or rather - she had idiosyncrasies, but we worked around and with them. She masks extremely well, and has all sorts of clever strategies to help herself cope. But secondary school (and it was a huge jump from her lovely, small class, nurturing primary to a huge state secondary) pretty much undid her. It has been very hard.

That was me...honestly wasn't meant as a criticism, just curious.

Girls mostly are diagnosed later, and yes, it's hard. We have no idea about dd until a particularly nasty teacher made one yr very stressful.

[differentnameforthis]

@Oakmaiden

That’s so patronising and childish, I stopped doing that when Mine were about 10yrs old!

She is not an ordinary 16 year old. She is rather - unique. For example, you can't walk across the floor in her bedroom - not because it is messy as such, but because she collects Beanie Boos, and each one has its own shoe box as a carefully made bed, and they arranged in careful rows across her bedroom floor...

She is unique, as I say...

That sounds delightful.

[Dontfuckingsaycheese]

"Only administrators can adjust settings so no chance of clever children tweaking the system to allow extra time." I too would stand no chance with this. DS is incredibly tech savvy (his main interest since... Birth really) so he's locked me out of stuff, made controls invisible, withheld passwords from me etc. So my only choice is to negotiate and discuss. I could go zero WiFi/phone data but that would not work for us and would cause him untold stress and anxiety. With children with autism it's not simply a case of turning router off or taking it to bed with you. We've just moved house. I don't want to have to polyfilla any more holes or replace doors in this house. This anyway, is the indication of the distress he's feeling and I'm not going to do that to him.

[SocialConnection]

I'd go and ask parents and teachers etc if children & teens with autism. They'll know, there must be specific strategies and best ways of dealing.

[mumwon]

@SocialConnection no disrespect but what makes you think teachers have expertise on autism & adolescent behaviour? Some might have experience but some equally have not very helpful preconceptions - especially with girls within the spectrum. Living with dc (as adults. adolescents & young dc) within the spectrum is often a massive case of trial & error & a lot of patience both with the person concerned & other peoples' advice & suggestions (mostly critical & unhelpful) there was a great psychology article I read called (if memory serves me right!) "walk a mile in my shoes" about parents experience with advice & training from social workers etc - the experience they mostly went through was often judgemental & frequently felt like they were being undermined & considered incapable. There are some knowledgeable & compassionate & empathetic professionals out there (& hopefully more than they use to be) but sadly its very much a lonely battle to get help & supportive advice. The thing is as Tony Attwood says - to paraphrase: 100 children within the spectrum in a room they all have certain things in common but equally asd affects them all differently - because they are all individuals much the same as the rest of the population
Op if it works use it!

[Meatshake]

Adding to the female autism thing, a lot of us don't get diagnosed til adulthood, get misdiagnosis (borderline personality disorder, bipolar, anxiety, depression and OCD are favourite), or don't seek diagnosis for ourselves until our children are diagnosed.

[mumwon]

again I think I read a book by Tony Attwood where he mentions how frequently people (girls/women) have several other diagnosis before they get full diagnosis
In dd case: Dyspraxia, & Epilepsy & ADD (without hyperactivity) & she was medicated for epilepsy …

[Poppinjay]

Genuine question but given her unique aspects you outline - why wait so late to pursue an assessment?

I see some people have already answered this. There is also the issue that, when young people mask, GPS, teachers and other parents will usually explain their behaviour away as either completely normal or manipulative and knowing which buttons to press. If they have diagnosed siblings, it's often dismissed as learned behaviour, which is the most unhelpful of the lot.

[differentnameforthis]

@SocialConnection

I'd go and ask parents and teachers etc if children & teens with autism. They'll know, there must be specific strategies and best ways of dealing.

No, not teachers!

I have come across my fair share of teachers (in only 4yrs as a special needs mum) to know that most of them have NO idea, even after I have told them all about dd. Not many want to listen either. They know better!!

And when you meet an in-school psychologist who also has no idea about autism - and doesn't think she needs to know either - then somehow, teachers not knowing doesn't seem so bad!!