To be utterly disgusted by the protests today.

[SoggySocksAgain]

Am I alone here?

I am utterly disgusted by what I have seen in the news.

This year has been a shit show.
But I'm more disgusted by the fact people are being killed for the colour of their skin and have to protest against systemic racism in 2020 ! It's horrible it's during a global pandemic but this was the straw that broke the camels back.

It's proven even by the suffragettes that being peaceful doesn't work and they were driven to acts of destruction and violence!
Voices need to be heard and things need to change.

Personally I'm more disgusted that so many people are bothered by protests and riots more than they are by racism and killing of innocent people.

The protests across the whole world have been mainly peaceful yet the media chooses to report the headline grabbing non peaceful pockets. People are angry, they have been fighting against injustices for hundreds of years, and still some people choose not to understand, preferring to focus on damaged property instead of a damaged system.

Open your eyes and your heart.

preferring to focus on damaged property

Is a London cop with a broken collarbone, broken ribs and a collapsed lung property?

Is David Dorn property? Why isn't his name being sprayed over monuments?

We don't yet have any idea how many of the more disgusting acts were perpetuated by actual protestors, those who have no real side but want to cause damage or plants. As has happened in many protests, there is strong evidence of involvement from both outside sources (even early protests in Minnesota showed a large number of out of state people being arrested, very few from within the community affected) and involvement of people employed by the state acting as instigators (the US particularly has shown several of these already, but it's been known in the past to happen in the UK).

Beyond that issue, It's not unreasonable to be disgusted, but that doesn't mean anything in whether or not it will enact change. Public reaction around the time has minimal effect on the long term changes or how it will be seen in the future. I mean, I haven't yet found comparable British statistics, but there is strong evidence that the majority of Americans found the '60s protests of sit-ins, Freedom Buses, and marches as hurting the cause and horrible at the time. Now we praise them (and, much like with other movements, many of the more violent acts involved are either swept aside or glorified as a handful of acts in desperation).

We don't yet have the ability to tell whether or not a particular movements actions will result in anything at the time the actions are happening or how much outside influence - state or otherwise - is involved. Sometimes peaceful protests - of which there have been many with this - work, sometimes they don't. Sometimes riots work - we have quantifiable evidence that they can enact change, sometimes they don't. Sometimes legal pressure works - Inquest is working hard in the UK to help reduce state-related deaths and violence, sometimes it doesn't. We can't yet know which makes it difficult, at least for me, to feel strongly about the actions of the protests at a whole. Certain acts, sure, but most of the horrible ones, the perpetrators and their involvements are still unknown so I can't really classify them as part of the protest. Protests are very convenient smoke screen for shitty behaviour, that doesn't mean they're part of the protest.

abcnews.go.com/US/small-town-police-chief-killed-officers-cities-wounded/story?id=71017820

My cousin actually attended the protest in London and said that most of the protesters were peaceful.
Unfortunately, these protests will always attract individuals who do not have any interest in the cause and are simply there to cause problems .
It is vital that the press be proportionate and responsible in their reporting so not as to undermine the reason for the protest.

And what about all the innocent black people who have been assaulted by cops @BovaryX ? Cops risk violence as part of their jobs, Black people risk it because of their skin colour. Let me know when you decide to be outraged about that.

@BiBabbles- Great post. Very insightful

Totally agree with the OP. It’s disgusting that you can’t have concerns about people gathering together to protest during a global pandemic without being branded a racist. Of course the death of George Floyd is awful but there are other ways to get your point across without violence or taking stupid risks. What was the point of the majority of us sacrificing so much for our efforts to be ruined by these selfish idiots?

@RunningAwaywiththeCircus

Interesting that the same MN’ers who were frothing over Cummings (who admittedly is an odious twat) are suddenly okay with breaking the rules to protest against racism that occurred in another country. There is so much cognitive dissonance in politics at the moment.

The converse is that the same MNers who were saying it's absolutely fine that he broke the rules at a time when we were in strict lockdown and it was particularly dangerous to do so are suddenly frothing at other people breaking them at a point when lockdown is much less strict.

Lots of people are going back to work today and next week, and travelling on public transport. Will they be in any less danger than the people on the streets in the open air yesterday wearing masks?

@GreytExpectations

You think that there is a comparison between policing in the US and the UK? There isn't. Why is a killing in Minnesota being used to justify violence in London? What are the aims of the protest in London? Do you imagine everyone from a BAME background has a monolithic view on this? Do not make assumptions about my ethnicity. I am from an ethnic background. I think these protests are destructive. What positive outcome will be achieved by violent protests and denying that they are violent?

Cops risk violence as part of their jobs

@GreytExpectations

Does that justify attacking cops in London for a police killing in Minnesota? You sound like you are justifying violence against the police.

BovaryX Ever heard of Sean Rigg?

Why are you here just to gaslight people? Is there something about black people getting parity of rights that offends you?

I think some people are looking for an ‘excuse’ not to support the protests.
A few troublemakers, use the protest as a way to behave terribly and as a result some posters now decide that they will no longer support the protests. It’s just so predictable and very telling

It's ridiculous how people say protesting like this isn't the right way to "win people over" or "get your point across".

It's basically saying that black people should behave themselves correctly in order for you to care about racism.

They are angry. You should be angry. And you should be more angry about racism than vandalism. If you aren't, why not?

'Police horses are used because they are a crowd pleaser.'

There we have it, white privilege in one sentence.

@JustAnotherPoster00

If someone makes the point that violence is counter productive, that attacking cops in London for a killing in Minnesota is bizarre, that isn't gas lighting. It's avoiding the question. What are these protests meant to achieve? What is the aim?

The protesting is fine.

Attacking police officers and horses - not fine. How is that difficult to understand?

It ruins the message with the minority rioting. There's no need for acting like a thug.

I am utterly disgusted by people who write off entirely legitimate and necessary protests against racism by focussing on the the minority who are damaging property, as though someone damaging a statue or a flag is on par with institutions that damage thousands upon thousands of lives.

YABU, but mainly ignorant. Willfully ignorant, at this point, not to get it.

YABU

I think George Floyd has largely been forgotten

He was just an excuse to go out and cause mayhem.

Guy on tv after the looting of the target store seemed to miss the point completely.

He said people weren’t taking notice of peaceful protest but they were taking notice now (or words to that effect)

People were taking notice of looters in a store not because they were protesting about George Floyd

Oh for crying out loud, the Suffragettes didn't win the vote back for women after the Great Reform Act through protest; in fact, the more extreme acts damaged the cause.

Women got the partial vote (that required property rights) in 1918 because the need for electoral reform after the First World War was vital to avoid what the establishment feared could become a revolution as working class men came back from the war.

Note it was women over 30 with property rights who got the vote in 1918; they were used as a bulwark against the voting tendencies of the working class male for a decade.

Change only comes when it is expedient for the establishment to enact it to advance their own interests.

It's unfortunate, it's shitty, but it is true.

@Packingsoapandwater

Good analysis and these vandals won't achieve anything but what they're protesting, inadvertently maybe, is lockdown. It's bored young people who have had their freedoms and normal lives taken away and don't have the maturity to handle it for months on end.

How many are just using it as an excuse for a day out the house and human contact?

Is a London cop with a broken collarbone, broken ribs and a collapsed lung property

Of course not, and the perpetrators should be prosecuted.
Presumably you are equally incensed about the number of black women who die in childbirth, 5 times the rate for white mothers, or the fact that BAME people have 2 or more times the risk of dying from coronavirus, driven significantly by systemic inequality? Because those people were killed by racism. That's a big part of the reason why people are so upset, and that's why they're shouting Black Lives Matter. The death of George Floyd is just a videoed and directly observed expression of another death of a black person that wouldn't have happened if they were white.