...to hate my dog

[SorrySadDog]

I need to gent this off my chest and I know that I will probably be shouted at and please don’t think that I feel it’s okay to feel this way.

I have two dogs, they are three years old. As a family we got a spaniel in June 2017, I love her so much. A month later we realised that we could probably have a second because my husband worked part time etc so someone was home most of the time. I saw an advert for someone wanting to rehome a 12 week old Sprocker Spaniel and I thought that was probably a better idea than getting another puppy, if you want to rehome a dog after only having it for a few weeks then you shouldn’t be a dog owner (the irony as you’ll find out).

I turned up and it was clear she wasn’t a spaniel, I couldn’t work out what she was but the lady said she had been sold to her as a sprocker from a woman’s with gun dogs. I really only wanted a spaniel however the conditions she was living in were not great. Her bowl was piled high with cheap food and she was living in a crate with a neon fluffy child’s cushion as a bed. There were puppy pads all over the place and she hadn’t taught her to go outside. The pads were used and not picked up. The dog was very timid. I felt awful for her so took her home with me and very quickly she became best friends with my spaniel. They brought a lot of joy to our lives and I loved them very much....and after a dna test it turned out she was half springer half border terrier.

Last year she started attacking my spaniel, she has established herself as leader of the pack and does a lot of things that are classically dominating. Urinating over where the spaniel has weed to cover her scent etc. She won’t let her go down stairs in front of her and sometimes waits at the bottom of the stairs and there can be a fight. She’s recently been spayed so I’m hoping that will help with that. She is an absolutely softie around people and even other dogs she’s intimidated by, she’s completely submissive. But she is so mean to my spaniel and I hate it. Over the past 8 months I have steadily grown to hate her. I’ve tried everything to sort the issue and I hate seeing my lively friendly spaniel cowering.

Also, they’ve always slept in the living room with the door shut, for the last couple of months terrier has taken to scratching and whining for hours as soon as the sun comes up and I am at the end of my tether. The second she makes any whining noise it’s like a red flag to a bull. I can categorically tell you that right now I despise her. But you don’t get a dog for Christmas, or three years in this case. You get a dog and you care for them for the rest of your life. But I don’t know how to get over this, how to stop her attacking my other dog and get her to fucking shut up in the morning. If those two things were solved, it would be fine. She’s sat at the foot of the stairs at the moment whining at me because I’ve closed the stair gate. I just can’t.

I’m sad and I’m upset that I could feel this way.

I could never understand his techniques they always seemed obscure. He trains pit bulls etc and some highly dangerous dogs too. I like Victoria someone or other but again too hard to see what she's doing.

Graham Hall is a very plain spoken but nice Yorkshireman who shows very clearly what he is doing. It's telly so obviously you don't see how long he's had to do it for but very easy to follow, non aggressive, and effective. You can see the little dogs confusion as it dawns in them, then a few more try's just because, until eventually they work it out. Then the next level of modification starts (faster usually) until by the end of it the dog is relaxed and happy and well behaved.

They are just relieved to know it's over and to have the clarity. Dogs have pretty short memory's in some ways 😁😁

@Vodkacranberryplease I know you mean well but multiple elements of your post are "techniques" with (scientifically proven) large risks for the owner and dog in attempting them. In short, they can do much more damage than the chances of them doing any good.

They have no basis in science or learning thoery at all and are the methods of a showman. Not a single accredited behaviourist would tackle interdog conflict in that manner.

@incognitomum can I ask what the supplement was?

I would personally rehome, it sounds like she needs to be an only dog in a home. It sounds like she may not have been well socialised as a pup and doesn't understand how to interact with other dogs. I totally agree with your belief that when you rehome a dog you make a commitment to them but in your case I think the kindest thing to do would be to rehome her.

We had a similar situation in that we rescued a puppy who turned out to be an utter monster very anxious.
I'm an experienced dog owner but she was beyond me so we used a local behaviourist who turned out to be dreadful, and in effect caused more problems than she solved.
In desperation we used another behaviourist at vast expense. I can honestly say that the 2 hours she spent with us have changed how we think of and treat DDog3 (DH especially)

She's 6 now and a combination of techniques taught by the lovely behaviourist, calming potions and a great deal of patience on everyone's part mean she's mostly fun to live with.
FWIW we pursued this path as we would have her PTS rather than rehome - her anxieties and breed type mean she would languish in kennels for the rest of her life (no prizes for guessing what breed she is!) and the experience would break her completely. If we had felt she could have been effectively rehomed it's definitely something we would have considered.

I would suggest your options are to either keep her and make the financial and time commitment to work with a dog behaviourist, or rehome her as an only dog, but please don’t do this yourself. Do it through a reputable charity so that home checks are properly carried out and she goes to the right person or family.
I imagine she was taken away from her mum or siblings too young and has issues linked to that.

@SorrySadDog I think in addition to what I said you need to get terrier away from being with just partner (who she clearly thinks is her owner) and with either you, or you both, or no one, in the training phase.

No training will work if it doesn't involve the main people as the terrier sees you individually- in its eyes you may not be the owner and if there's someone else not enforcing the good behaviour then it won't change.

So a dog might be great with person x and a nightmare with person y and indifferent to person z. They need to know that x, y and z are all above it and it needs to be good with everyone not just the one person who it thinks matters.

So if you don't want to regime you'll all need to do the training together and keep the terrier away from its favourite person/family life when not being controlled/trained. Probably something you could make good headway on in a day so I'm not suggesting being cruel.

@LadyEvelynBagley you could well be right. Are you a dog behaviourist? Maybe you might have a few tips?

I'm only recommending the tips because I've seen them on tv and the guy is a top flight dog trainer. I think you would need to watch him, read his social media/blog etc as the way I'm explaining it may not make sense. www.dogfather.co.uk/

He's not in any way aggressive in his training - he's a very calm, sensible man and far from a showman. This is definitely not a dog whisperer thing! I am very interested in animal psychology and if it wasn't such a hard way to earn a living would have trained in it. So please don't get the idea that I'm some moron sitting at home watching everything 'on the telly' and mindlessly believing it.

It's a very difficult thing to get right, and the devils in the detail, but equally not all dog behaviourists are good and I suggested it more as a holding pattern pre rejoining/getting someone in.

look for recognise the sprocker spaniel page on FB. They are affiliated with sprocker rescue. My friend had to rehome her sprocker because she could not cope with a baby in the home.

You rushed into getting a puppy without any thought or research, and now you can't cope.
It was a stupid thing to do but lots of people do the same.
I think you should rehome the dog through a reputable organisation asap and don't get another pet without proper research and consideration.

I'm afraid you may have to re-home her. Your spaniel is living a very uncomfortable life. Your new digs needs a home where she us the only dog. Maybe try and find a home for her yourself rather than taking her to the local dogs home. Put advert on, check out anyone interested to make sure they are suitable. Dogs feel if you don't love them. It's not fair on your other dog, the dog itself and you and your family. You must do best for all. 💐

Agree sandiecheeks

This thread is so sad. It sounds like you can't wait to get rid of her because she makes your life difficult compared to your other perfect dog.

You refer to her as 'the terrier' as if that's the reason for her issues.

I would have been much more sympathetic if you'd already taken her to a behaviourist and she was still very difficult, then I could feel your desperation but you don't seem to have consider it yet.

Being woken up early is part of the parcel as other things most dogs do. Sadly, if your feelings for her have got to the point of being so extremely negative, then she is indeed better to go to a home where she can be loved. Does your partner feels 5he same about her?

Post covid there will be hundreds of young dogs being rehomed. It breaks my heart. Though it's probably the right thing to do the actual rehoming will not be easy. I'm sure you already know this too but please don't do local ads/gumtree/pets at home 'free to a good home'.
I've ended up on my local Nextdoor group and it's very accountable- everyone is super local and if I had to rehome mine apart from speciality rescues I'd probably put a post there and do several trial walks etc just to know where she was going.

@dontdisturbmenow I’m, no I’m referring to her as the terrier rather than by her name. I’m also referring to the spaniel, as the spaniel.

And no, It’s not a case of can’t wait to get rid of her at all. It’s a case of seeking advice

Have you tried leaving the door open and letting her settle beside you? Things are worse also if you have disturbed nights. If the spaying is recent there may still be an improvement in her behaviour.

I feel your pain OP. My dog is a nightmare now. She has dementia so I know it isn't her fault and I would never rehome her but she brings nothing but stress to me and ruins my evenings and sleep every night.

Time to re-home, sounds as if the dog will be happier too

Well there are 4 APBC Behaviourists in my area so my list is not too big, currently contacting them now

@SorrySadDog
Please come back and let us know how you get on with the behaviourist.

Well done you! It's the right thing because they always need to look at how the people behave - more than the dog, and see the overall dynamic.

Perhaps google each one to see if there's any good/back feedback online?

But by the time you've reached the stage of despising a person or animal, it's almost a non return. I just don't understand why you waited so long to seek the helpf a behaviourist.

Do you think you have it in you to love her again if her behaviour improved? How much of an improvement?

@StrongTea she will happily sleep in the foot of the bed however if she hears a noise she will bark quite loudly and my partner struggled getting back to sleep once she’s gone off on one. And as he’s NHS staff I worry about him going to work on no sleep. Spaying was two weeks ago, I wouldn’t have spent £250 if I didn’t want to keep her and find a way to manage it. Just was at the end of my tether this morning and feeling utterly drained with a 5.00 door scratching episode. Everyone’s In a similar boat though, WFH, home schooling I just really wanted a decent noght sleep without worrying about it all. Maybe the behaviourist can do humans as well....

Are you a dog behaviourist? Maybe you might have a few tips?

I have a degree in canine training and behaviour but I don't currently practice for personal reasons. I have given my tips above - primarily to find an accredited behaviourist whose work is based in science. This is because - as you rightly say - dog behaviour can be really complex and it does require a proper evaluation to make really decent suggestions. Someone to see (preferably) or ask extensive questions to get to the root of what's going on and look at the owners and ways they live and interact with the dogs to suggest realistic ways to handle the situation. Someone with the science learning, so that old myths of dominance etc do not cloud their judgement.

Graeme is calm and probably a really nice man. I have watched his shows and there are occasionally things he does that coincide with the science (mainly anything involving reward or looking at the ways dog behaviour can be influenced by the emotional state of the humans) and I can see working.

But he is still using punishment far too liberally. It's mild punishment, to be sure ("NO") but anything the dog doesn't like is punishment and can backfire. Dogs trained with punishment (even very mild punishment) are more likely to develop aggressive reactions to events they are not comfortable in than dogs that are trained with reinforcers (rewards). In a nervous dog that we know uses aggression in some circumstances, I would not risk pushing her to use it more often by creating scenarios where she is confused stressed, afraid or otherwise unhappy.

Some of it is just bonkers stuff, imo - anything seeking to promote/demote the rank of a dog tends to fall into this category. The way dogs decide who will defer in any given situation is beyond the control of humans and very often a fluid and dynamic arrangement with one dogs appearing "on top" in one situation but being "subservient" in another. You will not influence this by dictating beds etc. Plus, as above, I suspect the "problem" dog here is the less confident one so I would be very reluctant to do anything that reduced confidence further.

If you are interested in animal/dog behaviour there are some fantastic books that are relatively easy reads but based in science. John Bradshaw, PatriciaMcConnell, Brian Hare, Adam Miklosi are all good authors. Alexandra Horowitz is brilliant but more based in the physical abilities of dogs - still really interesting, though. Plus, physicality influences behaviour.

@dontdisturbmenow honestly, I had other issues on my plate to deal with and it was put off whilst divorcing and moving. The issues started last April which was “bad timing” because I had to leave the marital home quite quickly due discovering my ex husband was assaulting me in my sleep. We are all settled now in a sense but I do wonder if that has had an impact but I’m not sure.