Rant alert! How do those who want Lockdown to continue justify the suffering of everyone else?

[Thefrenchbaguette]

My 3 month old has been waiting for a hip scan to confirm her rather obvious DDH. She needs a harness, the GP already confirmed she will need one and put in an urgent referral at her 6 week review and still nothing because they're not doing them at all here! You can only use a harness up until 6 months and after that the treatment for DDH is an operation! My baby is going to have to have a completely unavoidable operation or suffer lifelong damage to her hips because the NHS is just not interested in anyone who doesn't have Covid19! There isn't even the option to pay for it to be done privately! I am furious and so sick of seeing countless threads and comments about how lockdown needs to be continued and even stricter! All very well with your comfortable house and perfectly secure income and no real risk to your overall well-being but what about everyone else who is suffering?!
A friend had an abnormal smear come back in January but the follow up has been indefinitely postponed! How many people are going to miss life saving diagnosis', life saving treatments! It's disgusting and I feel so unbelievably angry at what this country has come through so 90% of people can avoid getting what is essentially a bad cold!

The NHS gets an awful lot of money it is not funding that's the problem it's how that funding is misused.

This written by some kind of government bot? That you Boris?

CQC have released data this week that shows a rise of 134% in the number of death notifications for people with learning disabilities between 10 April and 15 May this year over last year. And these people have died at a younger age range than the wider population Awful lots of young vulnerable adults with a care package in their own home were moved to residential care during this causing an increase in their deaths.

Essential health treatment should never have been stopped, beyond what's necessary due to actual demand and staffing.

Closure of public spaces and events, limitations on unnecessary travel, and so on though were and are reasonable.

Covid-19 is still circulating and still dangerous. I've not seen any headline breakthroughs in treatment.

Although as mentioned, we already know people in the UK have died because the NHS didn't offer early intervention, the policy was to wait until patients became critically ill before doing anything. Changing that policy will give people better prognosis in future.

I have had life changing surgery delayed due to Covid. And while it's life changing for me, it's not life saving. Non essential services are coming back onto line. The NHS, and the staff, at no point asked to be redeployed from their normal work to help with Covid response.

As it turned out, the response was OTT. So now, people are getting moved back to their normal roles, and those appointments are being resumed.

@TheClaws

Yes it's sad on a personal level. But people don't live forever. People dying in their nineties is not especially surprising or tragic from an objective point of view.

The remarkable thing about COVID is that it’s brought out all the heartless, soulless people, along with the those who seem to lack the ability to think critically. Sometimes these exist together to create an bleaty empty beast. Maybe, formerbabe, even if you think something, it could be better not to type it out and broadcast it?

And here's our new normal, where people dying in their 90s is tragic.

It used to be normal or even a good long life for people to die in their 90s; until recently, this was built into the funding decisions surrounding their care as far as their remaining quality life years (QLYs) are concerned.

I think we've completely abandoned this long-standing practice during this pandemic, so who knows what sort of funding formulas await us on the other side.

You are 100% right to be angry that your daughter is not getting the treatment she needs.

You have 100% misdirected your anger at mumsnet readers. No one in their right mind wants lock down to continue, but they do want to be safe from a covid 19.

Your anger would be better placed at the government failure to lockdown quickly and firmly enough and to track and trace from the outset has led to both high death rates and to a continued lockdown where other countries have been able to open up.

Write to your MP, lobby them. Speak to your GP. Take legal action as someone suggested upthread but do not blame people who are in no way responsible for the situation you are in.

Yes, I agree, people will die from not getting cancer screenings, but the numbers are lower than those dying of covid.

You don't know that. We won't know whether or not that is true for a while yet. I think the cancer thing may turn out to be quite shocking actually, because in the last few years there has been such a huge sea change in cancer diagnosis and treatment that it is no longer the 'death sentence' it used to be, particularly in very common cancers like breast and prostate cancer. So a big rise in cancer deaths will de difficult to fathom. Nor will we know how many of the people who have died from Covid would have died in the next year anyway. It may be that the yearly death rate amongst certain demographics dips from average by next year because many of those people are already dead?

I'm not saying that that is OK and we shouldnt care about older people. And we have to do whatever we can to keep the deaths down and the NHS coping (or not seemingly if you are Boris!) But there is a balance to be struck and there is a definite sense amongst some people that Covid deaths are the only deaths that matter right now.

Let's just hope that when you get to take your child to hospital for treatment that you don't catch CV when you're there.

I have had CV for 13 long weeks. I am 44 was fit and very active. It most certainly is not like a bad cold. I can understand your want to get the help for your child, but it isn't all about YOU.

Many beds have been purchased from independent sector but they aren’t allowed to admit patients. Well I'm due to have a lumpectomy in one of those requisitioned beds very soon. I'm in Scotland.

Righty oh. Let's don armour and deal with some of your frustrations OP.

Caveat: I've committed the mn crime of skimming, not rtft. Forgive me, I'm fresh off nights on a ward. Some covid patients.

I'm also wife to a teacher wfh harder/longer hrs than ever, mum to SEND (autism/ADHD) 9yo & two teenagers, one with pathological demand avoidance (possibly some early childhood trauma).

Most importantly, I've been where you are. With a sick child, needing treatment, frustrated I can't get people to understand the urgency. (daughter had cancer at 2).

It is incredibly frustrating to see what you feel is snails progress from your medical team, when they don't phone back, when you don't see progress. It doesn't mean nothing is happening. Multidisciplinary work happens across the NHS all the time - paediatrician/physio/radiographer will still be communicating about your case. In fact, lockdown has put a kick up the arse to start using virtual consultations & mtgs a better. Tech was there, behaviour change was needed amongst some (esp seniors dare I say? See also Parliament)

Lots done to continue essential services in alternate ways. Other services paused but prep for start up never stopped & in my Trust (community services in hospitals & across large county for older people Inc Mh, continence, school nurse, health visitors etc) much better worker across different organisations (something nhs spectacularly bad at! I'm new to NHS from private sector)

I also have lots mh experience, volunteering, education, 20 yrs hr mgr doing conflict resolution. We see things as we are, not as they are. Perfectly understandably your situation dominates your thinking. It isn't reality. News isn't reality - it's what's grabbing the news cycle shiny woo look here. Lockdown breakers and lockdown hardcore are both extremes. Most of us are muddling along doing our best. Treatment for one, doesn't meant no treatment for another.

There's a really false impression being created about COVID. Including the annoying clapping people out of icu or going home. The point is, there's a massive range in symptoms. Recovery from long term icu typically takes 12-18months rehab, with physios, occupational therapists, mental health teams (ptsd v common). Covid patients are recovering with same, but additional kidney, bladder and other organ damage. So maybe long term catheter/dialysis. Hardly a cold.

Of unknown damage are asymptomatic spreaders who never no they are infected but go on to infect many more. (see Wedton Super Mare. General hospital found 6% staff tested positive despite no symptoms.)

For those reasons, keeping people out of hospitals & healthcare settings, is not about prioritising others. It's about protecting vulnerable people from places where they are potentially at risk of the virus. It is horrible trying to deliver compassionate nursing care whilst wearing masks, apron, gloves, aprons. That's all patients,in for falls, nursed in bed following fractures, confusion, diabetes complications. Not only Covid. Ward closed, room doors shut, no visitors, no activities, meals alone. Harder for elderly, deaf patients, some End of Life.

Same routine for many nursing homes.

So what. I'll take discomfort and extra effort every time if it means my patients are protected from me. I don't see it as me being protected from them, I see it as my job to protect them whilst they are in my care.

Just as a mum, I got frustrated and cross about delays in cancer treatment until I asked questions and understood. I had no power over the big cancer thing, but it helped to take control by having a named nurse for questions, rather than a shouty, scattergun protest at everyone and everything.

Just as I am worried and anxious how my kids will settle in school - I have no power over the big decisions, but can focus on the existing great dialogue with teachers

I have no power over extremes of lockdown behaviour shown by others. But I can model what should be done.

I can't fix the NHS but I can care for My patients.

Sorry that was a rant. But important to spell out, for my own benefit I think, my reasons.

OP I hope your daughter gets ern soon, and you enjoy her early months. It is hard. We know. Keep going, fight for her treatment. But focus your energy productively for her.

Great post @oldstripeyNEWname1.

Curious OP as to why you felt the need to NC for this? Or have you just joined to post this?

I've read the first few posts from the OP and I won't be reading any more. Goady, incredibly insensitive and so entitled.

If you actually read my comment you'll see that I absolutely agree that necessary treatment should be going ahead. What I disagree with is those who want a longer, stricter lockdown being blamed for a lack of nhs care. The two are separate arent they because going to the beach all packed together isnt essential medical care is it? Tomb stoning in Dorset isnt essential is it? Packing into gardens for bbqs isnt essential is it? OPs DD should get her treatment, as should her friend who had a concerning smear result, BUT many people havent been able to adhere to basic restrictions to their work and social lives (again stressing not medical care) and that puts everyone at risk, especially those in the vulnerable and extremely vulnerable groups. I really cant see how that's putting myself before OPs child? Can we not conduct essential medical treatment as a society AND protect those in the vulnerable/extremely vulnerable category.

Essential health treatment should never have been stopped, beyond what's necessary due to actual demand and staffing

Early on, hospitals were a primary site of transmission, there wasn't enough PPE, and there was not enough testing to know which medical staff had it! Some people went in for one thing, and came out (or didn't) with Covid-19, a pretty high price to pay for routine service.

@Twinklelittlestar1 oh do piss off I'm not a bot. I'm just not stupid to think that the NHS takes the money its given and uses it in the right way. It doesn't and throwing more money doesnt solve the problem just more is wasted.

I doubt you waste your own money? Oh wait taxpayers find the NHS so they are saying our money and they shouldn't they should make sure it's used properly before expecting us to hand over more.

Ok I'll bite. Again.

None essential treatment didn't stop in hospitals because we're in lockdown. It stopped for a number of reasons:

1. increased demand for acute beds for those with covid meaning additional ward rounds and additional wards were set up. Doctors need to cover them with more ward rounds than usual in order to treat and discharge patients as quick as possible in order to free up beds for the next sick patient. These doctors aren't additional, they've been pulled off clinics or surgery to staff the wards. Where else would we get them from. The priority is and always is the sick on the ward need managing more than those in clinic (this is the same if a doctor on ward round in normal circumstances calls in sick, another will be pulled from clinic to cover his ward).
2. due to the high numbers in hospital plus the ease of infection, plus the numbers of walking well with the virus but no symptoms, a lot of the nursing and medical work force were off sick. We had to plan for long periods of sickness absence which in w lot of places meant up to 50% of the work force could be off at any point
3. again due to the high risk of infection, clinics cancelled to prevent patients coming into an unsafe environment where they could pick up the virus and get seriously ill. Or come in with the virus and pass it on to the doctors/nurses/patient transport teams who see lots more patients and could easily pass it on.
4. it is not a bad cold, as many many other posters have said that is naiive at best, and bloody insulting and ignorant at worse. Yes some people had it mildly (myself included) others, such as one of my doctors whom I work with ended up on ITU, has not got a breathing tube in place and will never work again in a medical capacity (at 45) and he was previously fit and well.
5. we were unable to source additional doctors from Locum agencies as many refused to work in covid sites (as they don't get sick pay) or those that would tripled their cost and the government wouldn't let us approve their rates.

Now to your points about everything being cancelled. That's just not the case. There is variance up and down the country however the message that hasn't actually been shared by the NHS/gov which is a massive oversite and would stop the relentless posts like this is the following:

1. in most places, life and limb care continued
2. where it was paused, all patients on all lists will have been reviewed by the consultant (look at letters/results etc) and a decision made and documented as for how long this patient could be safely delayed without coming to harm. These lists have been prioritised and will be being seen. This also takes up time of the doctors
3. in the 3 months whilst activity has been reduced, people have still been being referred into the services and therefore the list is ever growing. lol
4. an edict was delivered by NHS England about 4 weeks ago telling hospitals to try and get back to a "new normal" and reinstate as much activity as possible
5. clinics are significantly reduced still because the time taken to don and doff PPE between each patient appointment has had to be considered, plus there are limits on the number of patients that can sit in a waiting room at once, therefore smaller clinics = longer waiting times.
6. we have been told we can't use additional out of hours / additionally paid sessions to see the medics. Besides they are all knackered and don't want to work extra, and who can blame them.
7. many patients don't want to come into hospital as they're scared and DNA appts leaving lots of space wasted.
8. doctors are still getting sick, or their families are and they have to isolate. So clinics get cancelled at the last minute.
9. some clinics are being done over the phone or video conference which is great, but can lead to a lot of "what did you say" etc - imagine your nan zooming with a doctor who's first language is not English - it's not always easy!
10. as a previous poster said, a lot of work especially on cancer patients has continued behind the scenes - MDTs, tests, reviews of results without the patient there. It's a shame this isn't communicated to concerned patients though!
11. if you haven't been seen yet I'd feel lucky that I'm not deemed urgent enough to warrant the risk. If you're called in now it's likely you're really unwell.

One of the great failings has been the lack of communication around all this.
I'm sorry your daughter is unwell and obviously you are concerned. But I hope the above explains to you that haven't "just stopped everything for a bad cold" where 50,000 have died.

There is the thing they're not all 90. My DM was 69 although she has obesity related hyperventilation with sleep apnea she was 14.5 stone, slim compared to many.
This week will show an increase if it's to get worse, we just have to hope wait and take care of personal space by keeping social distance.

Also to the poster who said "the nhs gets plenty of money" HILARIOUS. Yeah the NHS does get plenty of money in comparison to education and n comparison to my wages. But do you realise how expensive things are?

Every year we are told to cut down on what we're providing to save money. For example for this year, I've received 20% less funding than last year for one of my services, but have been told I have to increase appointments by 40% - how the hell do I do that without compromising care and with less money.

On the other hand, one of my services has a ratio of 7 follow ups for every new appointment (because this service sees patients with horrendous life long, life limiting painful conditions). I've been told I have to reduce the ration to 1:2. So cut these people's appointments by 5. So the care. They receive will be compromised in comparison to previously. The medics are up in arms about it. But been told to by government.

One of my services, to run properly needs 7 consultants, we have 4 and do not have the funding to make 1 of these permanent let alone recruit 3 more.

Other countries don't cancel treatment completely.
My friend in St.Petersburg had normal dental treatment although there are many cases of Covid in the city. But about 1/3 of dentists are open because people need to be treated.
My friend who is a dentist here works in emergency hub. He said only 90 hub are opened for 60+million people. The shouldn't have shut dentists. It is essential service and they always have PPE.

14.5 stone, slim compared to many.

I'm sorry, what? That's not slim by any means.

She said slim to many, which means slim..er than many people who are heavier. Anyway, she could be really tall. 14.5 stone isnt that bad.

@TabbyMumz

She said slim to many, which means slim..er than many people who are heavier. Anyway, she could be really tall. 14.5 stone isnt that bad.

She’d have to be 6ft 5in for that to be a healthy weight.

Dentists It is essential service and they always have PPE.

Not true. www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/society/2020/may/30/shortage-of-ppe-may-force-reopened-dentists-to-limit-treatments

One of the great failings has been the lack of communication around all this.
^^
See this is probably my only complaint in regards to all this! I've been trying to get in touch with my daughters paediatric consultant for about 2 months and haven't heard back yet. Despite leaving countless messages.
Understandable that they're all busy, however there does need to be more contact with patients to keep them up to date. Fortunately my daughter doesn't need urgent medical care in the sense of a&e etc, but there are things than can get worse if we aren't put in contact soon.