You're white you haven't experienced racism 2 *title amended by MNHQ at OP's request*

[PatricksRum]

I started a thread in the early hours.

I fell asleep
I've checked the thread and it's full.

Whilst the thread sadly proves my OP, there were a lot of great posts and understanding by some MNers.

I think this discussion is so important and I'd like to continue.

These photos sum up the ridiculous responses.

Do not tell me I am doing my oppressed race a disservice
Your racial prejudice faced as a white person do not trump the daily racism and fear for our lives

Finally, if your response to this is to explain your tiny grievances of racial prejudices you've faced then you are wholly part of the problem.

The racist behaviours and thoughts by your people is the problem. It is your duty to understand and tackle it. I repeat, it is not the duty of black people to educate you.

sniping at people never wins them. Educating people is such a stupid concept. Tell them what you need or require - don't say look it up - that is not how you pull people to you.

I’ve cried the tears and felt the pain.

It does not make me dismiss the pain of others. Why should my pain be more worthy?

I hear just fine. And I’ve heard enough on this thread.

Yes you did. You said that it's not your fault if people choose to be hurt by what you say.
I'm kind of sick of you lying about what I've said. I didn't say that at all. I said I'm responsible for what I say not for how you feel about it. I did not say it isn't my fault if someone is hurt by my words.
*

Yeah, I'm choosing to not listen to you, thanks.*
Then goodbye. You said you were going ages ago. You're still here derailing the thread and talking about you you you

Hang on, are Jewish people not white?

[quote PatricksRum]**@Hearhoovesthinkzebras* creativecringe's* post has a lot more questions than that and you know it does. You're being purposefully obtuse.[/quote]
And I said that the questions included but were not limited to. The list is now on another page, I'm on my phone and can't post and refer back to it. Those were the ones I remember. Ten of the points didn't apply to me because they were about jobs and lifestyle choices, like film choices, subscription services, books and so on.

I don't see how not being in HR (at least three points related to that) or not subscribing to TV services or the like make.me part of the problem.

If the list and been about beliefs, or attitudes then that's judging the person but making it specific to lifestyle and then judging someone by what job they do or what subscription service they don't have is frankly ridiculous.

sniping at people never wins them. Educating people is such a stupid concept. Tell them what you need or require - don't say look it up - that is not how you pull people to you.
Not my duty however I have educated and told you what I need. You've chosen to ignore.

@packetandtripe OP is not on a religious conversion mission. She does not need to pander to white people's feelings. Stop telling her how to be. I'll tell you how to be instead. Focus on the real issue here. Unarmed black men being murdered. White supremacy.

And I’ve heard enough on this thread.
Off you go. Toodlepip.

@Hearhoovesthinkzebras There were a total of 16 questions. Refer to the other 6.

I am NOT white, I’ll state that first.

Secondly OP I’m sorry for the fear, anger and oppression you feel. Racism in ALL its forms is wrong. I have always fought against it and will continue to do so in the ways I see fit.

Thirdly I’m sorry but I really can not get down with this thread, some absolutely disgusting things have been written, some of those things from you OP! I understand that rage, fear and grief may drive your posts/responses but frankly it‘s gone beyond that.

Hate breeds hate!
Racism is racism and is wrong regardless of who is experiencing it!
Grouping people together and pointing the finger only perpetuates the situation, it does nothing to solve it.

I get that you are frustrated and I get that you are pissed off, I’ve been in the fight against racism a long time myself. I want people to stand up and join the fight too, but this really isn’t the way to do it. To open hearts, to open minds, to get people to act, to get people to fight alongside you, starts with respect and understanding from both sides. And yes, I get entirely that you should not have to educate people because you shouldn’t be fearing for you life because of the colour of your skin in the first place. It’s not your job to tell others what to do, nor is it your job to educate them but if that was the price for putting an end to racism I would gladly pay it many times over.

I’ll tell you something else as well, I bet some the people who actually stood up and challenged you on this thread are likely to actually be the ones to stand up and fight. You know why? because they already stood up for something that they saw was wrong and challenged it. I would rather that any day, over some half hearted empty arse licking platitude and blind agreement. Too many people just want to be SEEN as being on the right side of the issue and then in reality actually F All. So be glad of those who challenged you, welcome it in fact, because they didn’t challenge the issue, they didn’t challenge the fight to end racism, but they did stand up to you, so if they stood up to you, they will stand up to end racism.

so if they stood up to you, they will stand up to end racism.
No not true in the slightest.
I guarantee some of them are racist themselves.

*It’s not your job to tell others what to do, nor is it your job to educate them but if that was the price for putting an end to racism I would gladly pay it many times over.
*Me educating people won't end racism otherwise it wouldn't exist now.

I want people to stand up and join the fight too, but this really isn’t the way to do it.
Tell me what is then? If you know then I'm sure others will too and it would have been done already.

Hate breeds hate!
Hate toward us exists. Me apparently being full of hatred won't change that.

Racism is racism and is wrong regardless of who is experiencing it!
White people can't experience it.
*
Grouping people together and pointing the finger only perpetuates the situation, it does nothing to solve it.*
White people grouped us together historically. It isn't my fault.

The issue with the next part is you become prescriptive about what black people should be doing. It is not your role to decide that. Rather you should be thinking of what you can do. And don't ask black people what you should be doing. Work it out for yourself by reading and further educating yourself.

Sorry, but I do believe that this will take bame people to be part of the process. It can't be "done" to them.

Yes, I'm.trying to educate myself but as I explained earlier, there are many conflicting views about what I, as a white person, should do. Many people have said, across multiple threads, that they are not doing anything because they don't feel that it's their place to do anything, that they are listening but don't feel it's right for white people to speak on something that they can't understand. I've seen people being accused of being "white saviours" by stepping forward.

I think that's why people are asking for ways to help. They want to do the right thing but now don't know what that is. All over social media on Monday people were calling for white people to stand up and post black squares to blackout social media. Many did and then by Tuesday afternoon the accusations were flying that it was just for show and they were stopping the BLM message from getting across. So, we can try to educate ourselves but we don't know if we are getting the right information.

That's why I gave my exams.of talking about my disability. I know what I need. I know how people can help me. Does it do me any good to tell anyone who asks to go and educate themselves?

Maybe I don't understand the point you are making. I only have my experiences and my frames of reference to work.from. That's how I choose to get my needs met and to have my rights recognised -by educating and discussing. Of course not everyone wants to engage but for those who do, I can't see how refusing to talk with them helps in anyway

NotNow

I'm sorry you find my posts aggressive.

I find it grossly insulting that you think I'm calling OP aggressive due to her skin colour. That's an absolutely appalling assertion.

No. I'm calling what she posts about other posters aggressive. That's it.

@FithColumnist

Hang on, are Jewish people not white?

Well, my family are.

I find it grossly insulting that you think I'm calling OP aggressive due to her skin colour. That's an absolutely appalling assertion.
You** know what I've noticed, and it's crazy, a white person can be so defensive when called a racist. More defensive than they are over black people being killed.

@PatricksRum

Yes you did. You said that it's not your fault if people choose to be hurt by what you say. I'm kind of sick of you lying about what I've said. I didn't say that at all. I said I'm responsible for what I say not for how you feel about it. I did not say it isn't my fault if someone is hurt by my words. *

Yeah, I'm choosing to not listen to you, thanks.*
Then goodbye. You said you were going ages ago. You're still here derailing the thread and talking about you you you

This is what you wrote

Hurtful? Perhaps. I'm responsible for what I say not for how you react to it

So yes, you did say that it's not your fault if people are hurt by what you say. Maybe read your own posts back before repeatedly accusing people of lying about you.

Racism in the UK is alive and well sadly in 2014 me exdp and baby DS were turned away from a independent hotel because "people like us" mixed race family/Jamaican heritage weren't allowed to stay. They wouldn't accept that.

Imagine that for a second, do you think a all white family would get turned away from a hotel in the UK? No.

This is what OP means when she says white people can't experience racism. It's just not a daily thing.

*PatricksRum
Yes you did. You said that it's not your fault if people choose to be hurt by what you say.
I'm kind of sick of you lying about what I've said. I didn't say that at all. I said I'm responsible for what I say not for how you feel about it. I did not say it isn't my fault if someone is hurt by my words.
*

Yeah, I'm choosing to not listen to you, thanks.*
Then goodbye. You said you were going ages ago. You're still here derailing the thread and talking about you you you 
This is what you wrote

Hurtful? Perhaps. I'm responsible for what I say not for how you react to it

So yes, you did say that it's not your fault if people are hurt by what you say. Maybe read your own posts back before repeatedly accusing people of lying about you.*

Where did I say it's not my fault if someone is hurt by what I say? That's your interpretation.

[quote PatricksRum]@Hearhoovesthinkzebras There were a total of 16 questions. Refer to the other 6.[/quote]
I simply said that ten of the points did not apply to me. I didn't make any comment at all.on the other six.

The poster of that list then tried that if the majority of the list didn't apply to someone then they are part of the problem.

I'm simply saying that isn't true. Much of that list might not apply for purely practical or logistical reasons. It isn't a reflection of views or ideologies.

Last post as this is one of the most awful, saddening threads I've read here (or anywhere)

You said:
You're talking out of your arse. I haven't responded to a post about someone being fat and disabled. If I did, I would have likely said I'm sorry for your experiences but this thread isn't about that.

Here's what your response was (& no, you didn't say sorry or sympathise in any way) to WiddlinDiddlin:
Why should we water it down? This is a fact. Your experiences don't matter right now.

You told me I was lying. I was not. You quoted the poster & that was your reply.

No empathy, understanding or compassion.

Absolutely your experiences matter. So, in my view, do other people's, like that poster who talked about being spat at, abused & demeaned. Why can't those matter? They are also happening right now

Have we not got capacity for concern & care for more than one marginalised community?

I did not lie. Don't say I did. And there also your example of insulting people that you refused to accept.

@Hearhoovesthinkzebras you will not get one answer because black people are not a monolithic group and everyone has their own opinion. I would advise you do what you think is right after a great deal of research and reading. You are entitled to your own opinion. Just realise that it is people's lives and murders we are talking about, so the utmost respect and delicacy is required... By you. If you are sincere and open yourself to learning you will go wrong but you will always find the right path again.