Why was I BU? Race related.

[asixthofafathom]

I know I was BU and I am sorry about it, but I don't understand.

I have a black friend who is really articulate and passionate and posts a lot on social media about race - the perfect person, I thought, to ask what to read and what not to read at the moment, so as to avoid stuff that is inaccurate and offensive and hear only the authentic voice of those being oppressed.

She went ballistic and unfriended me, then proceeded to rant publicly about how offensive, selfish and insensitive my request was. Her friends chimed in and started calling me names.

I accept that I was wrong. I know it was poor timing, she doesn't owe me anything and it's not her job to educate me. But I genuinely just wanted to learn and understand and show willingness to listen rather than just assume that I understand an experience that I don't share.

Why was I so wrong to ask? Please don't bite my head off (unless I deserve it), I genuinely meant well and was trying to show respect, and now I feel awful.

Read Me and My White Supremacy. It’s an anti racist workbook for white people.

She sounds like exceptionally hard work

 how the fuck would you know?!

You are an absolute minority in my part of the world. I know of no black females in my bit of rural England. Best guess is you have no knowledge of farming. So why would I know any more about your struggles than ours with irrigation, crop pricing or rural poverty All issues effect us both. Both need to understand the issues of the other

@Leflic FFs. Are you seriously comparing the two?

So you're comparing life as a black woman/man where you're treated badly and often killed for simply being black, with a fucking job? A job that you could change The two are simply not comparable but then you know that don't you.
Fuck me, what is wrong with you?! That's actually disgusting and you sicken me.

It’s not a black person’s job to educate you though. Some might oblige but again, not their responsibility

SoVeryLost

Of course it is real life for her friend. I don't have one single black friend who trusts the police. They may not have experienced police brutality but they have all been profiled. Of course it is crass to compare people's lives being affected and football. Does being a fan of football mean you are 5x more likely to die in childbirth, that you'll be chased out of a play park as a child and called a dirty football fan for no reason? This is about actual lives.

You are still happy to assume, but fine. Having been the black victim of racial profiling doesn't make it the correct response to be a dick when a white friend asks you for the best sources of information on race relations.

As for the analogy, we'll just have to disagree. Apparently it can be correct to demand that friends take an interest in what I want them to, and then fuck them off if their timing displeases me.

Fake race baiting thread- where is the op?

"I believe most movements are doing themselves a terrible disservice when they state education is not their responsibility. There is a ton of bad information online. Asking a trusted person for guidance should be the starting point. Helping people learn is going to be more effective than the more strident approaches. "

I agree with this. I am a member of another minority group and have experienced and witnessed both directed and systematic racism throughout my life. If a friend asked me for for resources I recommended or even just to hear my experiences I would have no problem sharing. I know it is not my job to educate but if I can I have no problem, I appreciate their effort to seek out accurate resources verified and supported by members of the community they're about. If I was too tired or frustrated or just didn't feel it was my job to do so I'd tell them this and just say have a google and see what you come up with, I certainly wouldn't go ballistic and shame them on social media as I think social media shaming is cruel in any sense and attacking people trying to support your cause is never going to help it, even if they are misguided or wrong in their approach it is better to just point it out than go yelling at someone.

I have a black friend who is really articulate

Do you have white friends who are also articulate, and would you describe them as such?

@Anotherlovelybitofsquirrel
The pp is translating the situation into something that is applicable to her own experience to attempt to empathise. To her experience, farming is not just a job, it’s a culture that defined her views. The same way Jewish people would relate this debate to their experiences with anti-semitism, and Middle Eastern people will compare it with the whole every Arab is a terrorist stigma.

If someone is genuinely looking to understand, it’s not your place to say they’re wrong.

Strive for a bit of empathy. It’s shit having to explain and justify, I know. And god knows people sometimes are blasé and insensitive but if you make the effort so other people understand the problems then they will usually make efforts to help combat it.

It's exhausting explaining racial injustice to white people. You'll never understand the mental burden of being a non who're person and in particular a black persons. I'd probably have unfriend you too.

@Hadjab have the decency to quote the whole phrase, rather than doctoring it to serve your own purpose.

I have a black friend who is really articulate and passionate and posts a lot on social media about race

I'm not the poster you're referring to, but yes, I'd absolutely say about a white person:

*I have a friend who is really articulate and passionate and posts a lot on social media about (insert cause)

Even if it is a fake thread it really highlights that if you’re white you’re automatically racist, wrong, patronising ...and did I mention racist?🙄

Fuck sake, it was a friend asking another friend for some good source material. There's so much bullshit out there, it's not always easy to sift through it and think 'bullshit' when you don't know where to begin. It's no one's job to educate others (unless....you know teacher) but it'd be nice if it was offered. If not, then hey ho that's life. No one's ignorant for asking a question, if we don't ask how do we learn? If OP were to start researching and cited a bad source Then, I'd assume if this was a real scenario, OP would be condemned as an ignorant racist for 'spouting nonsense'. Damned if you do and all that. 🙄

A concern of mine in a situation like this is how my friend would react to me asking a question or for information. Over the top at best, cuntish at worst.

Half DSIS is BAME, we chatter and discuss current climate and sources. She's not unfriended me yet but given the current responses perhaps she's secretly planning to murder me for my apparent 'ignorance'. 😐

Also POSTERS WHO ARE JUST STARTING TO TYPE SOME DAFT RESPONSE TO THE ARTICULATE LINE -- angry caps in hopes that some will read.

It was one word, in a whole sentence. One fucking word. Very easy to pick things apart and make 'em sound how you want, yeah?

Yes, I'd refer to a white friend as articulate as well as a BAME friend. Not because I don't think that type of person in a specific race exists (oh please) but because I like how this specific person writes. I like how they think, I admire their wordsmithing and phrasing and perhaps whatever sources they can give will be of similar tone. 🙄

Do you have white friends who are also articulate, and would you describe them as such?

Yes I would actually, and I have.

It is not the responsibility of the opressed to educate the opressor. It’s like asking a DV victim to point out some helpful material about her struggles so Op can understand — you just don’t do it. You need to educate yourself and if you can’t be bothered to do that then do something about it in your day to day life - like not ignoring a racist relative’s rants to be polite.

@SoVeryLost they weren't racist posts that were deleted. I reported a few for prejudice that have gone. There weren't any salivating racists jumping up and down, that's for sure.

Fake race baiting thread- where is the op?

YES

Better to show up than not show up at all op. Do some reading:

www.instagram.com/p/CA7il-ogkTm/?igshid=1oy65e2y0uqju

"It is not the responsibility of the opressed to educate the opressor"

Absolutely this but there's no harm in asking as long as you are as happy to accept 'no' as an answer as you are 'yes'.

As someone from an oppressed race I welcome people asking me questions, I'm happy to share my experiences and I'd rather point people to something I've read that I feel best articulates the point than them stumble upon something convoluted or down right incorrect.

Now absolutely not ever person of colour feels like me, they have every right to not want to educate or share their stories. But if someone is really a friend (not an acquantice) and they feel this way I'd expect them to just say no, not go ballistic and shame me online for genuine good intentions.

@Biancadelrioisback I don't understand how asking advice on what to read to try and understand oppression suggests the OP doesn't believe that oppression or racism is real?
I'm a white female. I fully accept that I am privileged, and that racism is a systematic issue. But there is much that I don't understand because it's not my lived experience. Wanting to read about the experiences of others does not mean that I am sceptical that their experiences are bad.

Just to clear up. @mnhq emailed me back and op is a longtime poster.

@SistineScreamer

Even if it is a fake thread it really highlights that if you’re white you’re automatically racist, wrong, patronising ...and did I mention racist?🙄

Fuck sake, it was a friend asking another friend for some good source material. There's so much bullshit out there, it's not always easy to sift through it and think 'bullshit' when you don't know where to begin. It's no one's job to educate others (unless....you know teacher) but it'd be nice if it was offered. If not, then hey ho that's life. No one's ignorant for asking a question, if we don't ask how do we learn? If OP were to start researching and cited a bad source Then, I'd assume if this was a real scenario, OP would be condemned as an ignorant racist for 'spouting nonsense'. Damned if you do and all that. 🙄

A concern of mine in a situation like this is how my friend would react to me asking a question or for information. Over the top at best, cuntish at worst.

Half DSIS is BAME, we chatter and discuss current climate and sources. She's not unfriended me yet but given the current responses perhaps she's secretly planning to murder me for my apparent 'ignorance'. 😐

Try reading what I have posted and others. I haven’t been unfriend either. Strangely as I gave a shit prior to it being cool.

It's not about you. Look at all this emotional pressure? You've asked her for advice which she clearly didnt have the energy to give and now you've got so offended you've come on a forum to talk about it... I know you havent meant to but you've made the entire thing about you and your feelings and your attempts to help and how you expect them to be recieved. Can you not see how draining that is for someone to deal with on top of what is going on at the moment? I absolutely understand you meant well but to now get offended at the bad response and want some validation about your attempts... it's kinda really white isnt it? And I say that as another white person... we have to realise we are so used to being treated with respect and kindness that we are listened to in a way that POC often arent... not that white women dont have struggles and issues.. but it's on a whole other level. So much so that when we are rebuffed like this even when we know why really we are still so hurt and outraged that we weren't understood and accepted... but that's how loads of women of colour feel every minute of every single day.

@BrainFart

SoVeryLost

Of course it is real life for her friend. I don't have one single black friend who trusts the police. They may not have experienced police brutality but they have all been profiled. Of course it is crass to compare people's lives being affected and football. Does being a fan of football mean you are 5x more likely to die in childbirth, that you'll be chased out of a play park as a child and called a dirty football fan for no reason? This is about actual lives.

You are still happy to assume, but fine. Having been the black victim of racial profiling doesn't make it the correct response to be a dick when a white friend asks you for the best sources of information on race relations.

As for the analogy, we'll just have to disagree. Apparently it can be correct to demand that friends take an interest in what I want them to, and then fuck them off if their timing displeases me.

No one has demanded that you take an interest in a friends hobby, but you know that and are trying to devalue peoples lives down to supporting the right football team. That’s the dick move. We have no idea why the OP was ‘fucked off’, you are assuming. The op hasn’t come back and plenty of people have asked for clarification. Personally I don’t believe the OP, I think this was designed to divide people but @mnhq are ok with racism on their boards so whatever. I